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You can do this sort of thing using a feat, if that tickles your fancy at all.


glass wrote:
Skreeeeeeeeee wrote:

Vorpal weapons.

Vorpal wrote:
Others, such as golems and undead creatures other than vampires, are not affected by the loss of their heads.
If a vampire can survive a vorpal blade, I'm reasonably sure that Cthulhu would be just fine.

It says "undead creatures other than vampires". Ie, the vampire are a/the example of undead creatures that do die when they lose their heads.

Also, why is this in Third-Party Products?

_
glass.

Oh! My mistake, that's what I get for visiting these forums just as I wake up. Sorry about that.

But the point still stands, it's not impossible to survive a vorpal strike, so a being such as Cthulhu should be fine even if he loses his head.


Vorpal weapons.

Vorpal wrote:
Others, such as golems and undead creatures other than vampires, are not affected by the loss of their heads.

If a vampire can survive a vorpal blade, I'm reasonably sure that Cthulhu would be just fine.


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Players need to learn one way or another that splitting from the party, and other poor decisions, will have their own consequences. If you baby him now, he'll only keep doing it. Have him learn early that his choices can kill him, it's best to do so before he gets attached to his character. Then he'll think twice about doing something like that in the future.


They have an entry for regular bats right here.

As for why you'd justify taking a bat, I'd say to just do it for flavor purposes. Wizards are strong enough already to not need a familiar's bonus to saves, initiative, or HP, so you have some wiggleroom there. You don't always need to take the most optimal choice for mechanics, as you'll still be a strong party member with a bat familiar.

But maybe I'm just biased.


thaX wrote:
For the other poster, tusks are a part of one's teeth, so the feat can work for the human (with Racial Heritage). Assume the canines grow... a lot.

But that's not naturally in human anatomy. Teeth don't grow to be that large! Only by having an ancestor as an orc(or half-orc) could you ever grow teeth large enough for such a flavorful bite attack. But you seem to be arguing that Racial Heritage doesn't give humans anything they do not naturally possess. Humans don't naturally possess tusks!

Or, we can assume that humans do meet that fluff prerequisite, and have their teeth grow to match the flavor of the Razortusk feat, on account of their orc heritage.

And with that, we can assume that humans do meet the fluff prerequisite of Fox Shape, allowed the ability to change into a fox on account of their Kitsune heritage.

Both of these feats work, or neither of them do. They both have implied fluff prerequisites, which seem to bar you access for feats. Which is it?


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thaX wrote:
blackbloodtroll wrote:

Let's try a different example.

Racial Heritage(Half-Orc), and the Razortusk feat.

Are we agreed that this combination is legal?

Humans (and Half-Elves) have teeth. Yep, that works.

But it's a Razortusk feat. Are you ignoring the hidden prerequisite in the fluff name "Razortusk?" Humans and half-elves don't have tusks. Why would you assume this works, because the flavor of the feat clearly indicates otherwise?


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thaX wrote:
I dislike the "the rules don't say that I can't" philosophy.

I find this to be humorous, as everyone arguing that yes, humans can use this feat with Racial Heritage, are using the simple philosophy that "the rules say I can, so I can."

Those arguing against it are using the philosophy "the rules say you can, but you actually can't."


blackbloodtroll wrote:

You realize, that all these arguments, could be used for, say, a Gauntlet, a Spiked Gauntlet, a Cestus, a Dwarven Boulder Helmet, and a Scizore.

Are these all "not weapons", but sort of weapons, and only work and are treated as weapons, whenever you just sort of feel like it?

To add on to this, there's also the Battle Aspergillum, Sickle, Wooden Stake, Whips, Boarding Axes, Machete, Ankus, Battle Ladder, and more that are all "not weapons" and cannot be manifested as Mindblade weapons, as they all do other things and are only treated as weapons when you hit things with them.


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Daniel Myhre wrote:
CampinCarl9127 wrote:
Daniel Myhre wrote:
"If you use your shield as a weapon"? That's rather telling right there. And the fact it says to treat the shield as a one handed weapon, not that it is a one handed weapon. I can hit you with my frying pan, using it as a one handed weapon. That doesn't mean it is a weapon. it's still a cooking tool, and was designed as a cooking tool. Any offensive use is purely a coincidence. Similarly I could hold a lit bic lighter and spray hairspray through the flames to create a jet of flame. Are you going to claim the hairspray can is a weapon in and of it's self?
Except those are very clearly defined in the rules as improvised weapons. Shields are not improvised weapons.
Actually, they kind of are an improvised weapon. You just don't get penalties for using it like that other then losing the AC bonus.

Longswords kind of are an improvised weapon. You just don't get penalties for using it other then proficiency penalties.


thaX wrote:

Read the Thunder and Fang feat.

Tell me, why would anyone think that one can wield 2 Two Handed weapons and Two Weapon Fight with them? Why would they think that they can wield an oversized Two Handed Weapon with this feat?

Because they ignored the "fluff."

Take the feat in it's total, don't pick and choose.

About the "Tail" in tail slap, some in that thread wanted to use their booty "tail" to use the feat with. There was even an discussion about real tails on humans (called something, not like an actual tail like what a Kobold would have) that got pretty heated.

This is about the same discussion with a different feat. We even had one of the developers come in and weigh in on the subject, saying that some common sense would need to be used when getting the Racial Heritage feat or the Adopted Trait.

Don't have (thing)? You can't use it, even if you take the feat/trait/ability/whatever. You need some way to get the (thing). (being Shape Change in this instant)

Okay, that's nice. Thunder and Fang references Earth Breakers and Klars being necessary to function. Tail Terror references using a tail to function.

Can you point to me the part where Fox Shape says you use the Change Shape racial ability?


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Start with 20 STR after racials. +5 from all your level ups(25), and a +6 enhancement bonus from a Belt of Giant Strength(31). One level of Alchemist can give you Mutagens for an alchemical bonus of +4 to Strength(35). Taking damage with the Blood Rage spell active(so just whack yourself a few times) can give you morale bonuses of up to +10 Strength(45). Using the Eldritch Heritage feats, you can take Strength of the Beast from the Orc Bloodline to get an inherent +6(51).

I came up with that rather quick, so it's far from optimized, and STR can certainly go higher, but it's entirely possible to use Blood Money as a ninth level caster with enough STR to spam Wishes(as long as you can heal the ability damage and as long as your spell slots persist, at least).


Markov Spiked Chain wrote:

Why do you need Psychic sensitivity?

The initiate must also possess the Psychic Sensitivity feat or have levels in one of the occult classes presented in this book.


AwesomenessDog wrote:
Step up feat, and a grapple to stop their movement. Then its just you, caster, and that sweet vorpal sword.

We're looking for a way to restrain and keep spellcasters prisoner, rather than cutting them in half. While that's the simplest way to get the job done, it's not exactly what we're looking for here.

Anyways, to add on to what's already been said. Make sure to take all possessions other than(and maybe including) the clothes on the spellcaster's back, such as a spell component pouch and spellbook, along with anything else magical. Gag and binding their hands can stop V and S components, but they can circumvent that if they have the proper feats.

Tying someone up with rope gives them the "pinned" condition, and any caster that's pinned must make a concentration check to cast spells. That can go a long way in stopping any unruly spells from getting out.


I'd say it could hold a shield, but couldn't wield it in any effective way it grant the AC bonus. The Monkey Belt can't wield weapons, so it can't do anything as simple as stab with a dagger. And, as a shield is technically a weapon as well, it would make sense to say it couldn't provide the armor bonus in addition to not being able to shield bash.


Azullius Koujou wrote:

Hello Paizo members, I'm playing a druid in a pf campaign atm and just reached 4'th and with it Wild Form.

I looked online for guides to what forms i could take and stumbled upon this site:

http://www.espigabb.comuf.com/pftools/

It looks helpful to me, the only issue is I can't seem to get how the AC is calculated.
Aka the ac differes from what i thought they should be.

Here are the numbers i put into the calculator(looking at a 6'th lwl sample)

Str: 12
Dex: 14
BAB: 4
Character lwl: 6
Druid lwl: 6

Next i look at the Aurochs or Bison.

How does i end up with AC 14?

The way i understood it I get +4 str, -2 Dex and +4 nat armor for taking the form of a Large animal. So 14-2 = 12 = +1 Ac, then add +4 nat armor shouldn't this be AC 15?

How Should I calculate these numbers? and is this calculator correct?

In addition to the loss in DEX, large creatures take a -1 penalty to AC and attack, as penalties for their large size. That's likely where you're missing one point of AC.


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alexd1976 wrote:
Byakko wrote:
blackbloodtroll wrote:
Sure, you got to keep those pesky "unwritten rules" in mind. :)
Indeed, can't have those dead people taking actions after all. ;)

Hey, until published materials say I can't take actions after death, I'm gonna keep on acting.

It is RAW, after all.

Just like this feat is. If it was supposed to work differently, it would have been written differently.

In case you're really using this as a legitimate argument.

Pathfinder Core Rulebook wrote:

Handling PC Death: Eventually, through bad luck or bad

tactics, a player character is going to die in your game. Other
events, such as petrification, paralysis, sleep, and stunning
can have a similar effect on the game as PC death, and the
following advice should apply to those effects as well.
When a PC dies, his player no longer has any input into
the game (unless he has a cohort or other allied NPC he
can start playing). That player has to sit at the table quietly,
watching and waiting while everyone else continues to
have fun with the game.

Here is a screenshot, as this section doesn't seem to be listed on the pfsrd.


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Crimeo wrote:

What else does flavor derive from, exactly, according to you, if not from BEING that race? Since you count as BEING a kitsune for purposes of disregaring prerequisities of feats, abilities, etc., I fail to see how that does not come along with disregarding otherwise mismatching flavor.

Are you born a kitsune and then separately gifted its flavor on your first birthday?

And more importantly: Can you explain to me exactly what racial heritage ever actually does for you, if flavor does not according to you transfer AND full incidental flavor is according to you necessary to use any abilities? From what I can see, it would do precisely nothing ever.

Presumably, for feats such as Cautious Fighter, which is racially restricted without any real reason behind it, as there's little reason why humans, or any other races should be locked from that particular boost to fighting defensively.

But, you could also argue that Racial Heritage doesn't apply to that feat, either. I mean, it has flavor text in it. And how can you justify a human "caring about survival more than victory?" Racial Heritage doesn't give you that necessary flavor prerequisite.

So I guess Racial Heritage just doesn't work unless the feat in question is lacking in flavor text.


Jodokai wrote:
It was meant to be a joke but okay I'll bite. You can't deny that improvised weapon is a weapon, weapon is in the name. As far as wielding it, I said you wield reigns in two hands. Now my mind blade can create a horse and wagon.

That's totally a double weapon. It's a no-go.


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The Archive wrote:
A hat of disguise operates like disguise self. It's illusion, not transmutation. Not exactly on the same level as something like alter self or change shape. So, even going by that interpretation, no, that wouldn't really work.

What about a Hat of Disguise, Greater, in that case?


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RJGrady wrote:
BigNorseWolf wrote:
One of the great mistakes in rules interpretation is thinking that raw can only say one thing

That's irrelevant in this particular discussion, as the RAW pretty much does say only thing. I see two reasonable positions:

Fox Shape needs to be errata'd to require change shape, or
It doesn't, because intended or not, it works fine as it is.

Let's assume for a moment you were a developer and you wanted to make it really clear Fox Shape was allowed by Racial Heritage (kitsune). What language would you add to Fox Shape to make that so? You could write, "Special: This feat does not require change shape as a prerequisite." But then presumably you would list all the other things that also aren't prerequisites. Like, Power Attack, being a dragon, stonecunning, etc.

Very clearly, if this ability was meant to require change shape, its prerequisites SHOULD require change shape. If you believe that was an oversight, so be it, but that doesn't change the fact that currently, it's not there.

Also, I will say: I cannot speak for the write of this feat, only for myself. But I know if I were writing a new ability that keyed off change shape, 100% of the time the Benefit would start with, "When you use change shape..." Period. That's how you write a feat that varies another ability.

I'm just going to echo this. It might be intended to have Change Shape, but as written, it is not required. So ruling as written, there is no requirement to have Change Shape. That may be the intention, and I won't refute that. But there's no way RAW to interpret that you need something the feat does not say you need. It doesn't say you need Change Shape, it doesn't say you need anything other than 13 Charisma, +3 BAB, and being a Kitsune. That's the requirements. That's RAW.

But regardless, others may continue to interpret it by adding restrictions and limits on the rule that are not present. I'm not entirely sure why you'd add those restrictions, as it would make as much sense as adding restrictions to other feats like Power Attack, Cleave, etc, beyond the listed prerequisites as that's how you're "interpreting" those feats. If others continue to interpret the feat by adding prerequisites to feats that don't have them, then I suggest we all FAQ the OP and wait for official clarification on RAI.


All PCs being a small-sized race is always fun.


alexd1976 wrote:
Skreeeeeeeeee wrote:
alexd1976 wrote:


Mmm, good find! But, only first level spell, and it just lets you talk to certain critters, not alter your shape.

So, step in the right direction, but a level lower, and WAY less powerful on top of that (IMO, I rank polymorph effects higher than what is effectively ranks in linguistics).

Good find though.

Anyone else? Unlimited use level 2 spells from a feat?

Bear with me a second here.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/racial-feats/wings-of-air-sylph

Would this count?

I know it doesn't technically say "functions as the Fly spell," or anything like that, but it functions similarly by giving you the at-will ability to fly(in light armor) for the cost of a couple feats.

That's pretty close, but requires level 9, instead of three.

Also, there are probably WAY easier ways to get a flight speed before that...

I mean, by this point (level 9) people are casting Planar Binding (lesser) and Teleport...

Meanwhile shapechanging Fox-man has been doing his trick for a full SIX LEVELS. :)

Then I'll have to concede to you on this point! There aren't many other feats I can think of that give you an at-will spell on the level of Beast Shape(even if limited) at such an early character level.

While I still believe that it should be at-will, as there's no wording to indicate otherwise, I will admit that the lack of examples to compare to makes it a suspect, so I'll give that point to you.

Otherwise, be it once per day or infinite, it does still seem that a human can benefit from the Fox Shape feat with Racial Heritage(Kitsune).


alexd1976 wrote:


Mmm, good find! But, only first level spell, and it just lets you talk to certain critters, not alter your shape.

So, step in the right direction, but a level lower, and WAY less powerful on top of that (IMO, I rank polymorph effects higher than what is effectively ranks in linguistics).

Good find though.

Anyone else? Unlimited use level 2 spells from a feat?

Bear with me a second here.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/racial-feats/wings-of-air-sylph

Would this count?

I know it doesn't technically say "functions as the Fly spell," or anything like that, but it functions similarly by giving you the at-will ability to fly(in light armor) for the cost of a couple feats.


alexd1976 wrote:


How many other feats/traits based off of spell use grant unlimited uses per day?

I was under the impression they generally defaulted to 1...

So, if we assume unlimited uses of this second level spell, where is an example to compare it to?

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/groundling

Here's one.

EDIT: And as for traits, I have Beastkin, which functions in a somewhat similar manner.


Oh! I forgot to mention. The Second Chance trait is also very damned good in order to keep you alive through the most terrible of saving throws.


It depends exactly on how you're dying, but there are few general ways to help keep yourself afloat. Iron Will and its improved variant can help patch up your weaker will save, and Toughness gives you a bigger HP buffer. A feat like Diehard can help stop you from dying, and while I don't consider it an amazing feat, it can help ease the burden if you're very worried about dying off.

Improved Initiative is a great feat that'll help with both offense and defense, as it can better allow you to set yourself up before the enemy can act. Any traits to further increase your initiative, like Reactionary, can be a great benefit as well.

This list isn't thorough at all, but I hope it helps at least a little!


Any chance we might be able to see something on the Medium? Maybe I'm not looking in the right places, but I don't see that class discussed much at all recently.


Johnny_Devo wrote:
BigNorseWolf wrote:
The Archive wrote:

The RAW on using it ends up a bit odd since the feat doesn't say how often you can use it, or how long it even lasts, and that can definitely end up with some YMMV.

But, I guess that's what you end up with when Racial Heritage has no guidelines or restrictions, and not every single racial thing is written with it in mind.

Thats an excelent point.. if its not tied to shape change, how do you determine uses per day?
I would say the same way you determine how often you can use power attack.

Thank you.


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alexd1976 wrote:

I'm actually gonna break it down and do a sentence by sentence analysis of this.

"You can take the form of a fox whose appearance is static and cannot be changed each time you assume this form."

Cool. Sounds awesome, hope it mentions how often I can do it...

"Your bite attack’s damage is reduced to 1d3 points of damage on a hit, but you gain a +10 racial bonus on Disguise checks made to appear as a fox."

Um, neat. Didn't have a bite attack before, so I gain one? But it says reduce... I'm confused... Hey, at least I can disguise myself as a fox now! Woo hoo!

"Changing from kitsune to fox shape is a standard action."

Good to know, we can throw THAT sentence out though, because you aren't a Kitsune, and all your feat let you do was count as one TO QUALIFY FOR THE FEAT.

"This ability otherwise functions as beast shape II, and your ability scores change accordingly."

There we go. So, since no duration is mentioned, we can consult the spell, 1 minute per level. Since frequency of use isn't mentioned either, we can consult the spell. Hrm. I guess since it otherwise functions as Beast Shape II, then you have to cast it to use it, as is 'otherwise functions as Beast Shape II'.

Add it to your spell list maybe?

Yeah, without jumping through some hoops, this ability is hard to interpret.

If you want to argue that unspecified criteria are up to the players to choose, please cite the source. Anything else is just supposition.

This feat doesn't list a number of times you can do it per day, even for Kitsune. It can be assumed that it gives you an infinite amount of uses, without an arbitrary limit like "add it to your spell list."

You know, feats like Vital Strike, Power Attack, Deadly Aim, Cleave, etc. don't list a "number of times you can use this per-day." Are we to assume none of these feats function, because it's not specifically giving you the ability to use them at-will? That's silly. Just like it's silly to impose a made-up restriction on the number of times you can use the Fox Shape feat per day.


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el cuervo wrote:
LazarX wrote:
el cuervo wrote:
LazarX wrote:
alexd1976 wrote:
Hey, how often could a human use this, if it were allowed by the GM?
Depends on the GM. Since you're out of rules territory, I can't give you an answer to beat his head with.
How is this out of rules territory?
Because as demonstrated in previous cases of this nature, there is no rules text to support the OP's assertation. The only defense of what the OP wants falls into "ignore the rule because it's a cool idea" variety.
No, this is clearly within the rules of Racial Heritage. It does not require the change shape Magical Racial Trait to take Fox Shape. If it did, it wouldn't say "Preqrequisite:..., Kitsune," it would say, "Prerequisite:..., Change Shape Racial Trait."

In fact, I'd say that not allowing it seems to be "out of rules territory," as that would be a twist of the feat's flavor text to forbid someone from taking and benefiting from a feat they meet all the prerequisites for.


el cuervo wrote:


In fact, I would go so far as to say that you actually gain the 1d3 bite attack when you're in fox form.

You most certainly would. Polymorph spells grant you the natural attacks of your new form, and since Beast Shape II is a polymorph spell you'd gain the fox's 1d3 bite attack.


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MeanMutton wrote:
BigNorseWolf wrote:
Doomed Hero wrote:

I seriously hate this pedantic b@&~+~!@.

The pedantic b@&~+~!@ is saying that it technically doesn't have a prerequisite of the kitsunes change shape ability, which it never the less references nearly once a sentence.
Except that it literally doesn't mention it even once. The closest it gets is that it reduces bite damage but it is certainly not explicit.

This. Change Shape is not listed in the prerequisites, and it is not once mentioned in the text of the Fox Shape feat. It does list "Changing from kitsune to fox shape is a standard action", but as Racial Heritage allows you to qualify as a Kitsune for the effects of feats, there's no real argument there either.

You can argue that you don't want to allow it for thematic or flavorful reasons, but there's nothing there to suggest that applying the feat as a Human with Racial Heritage(Kitsune) is impossible.


alexd1976 wrote:
Diego Rossi wrote:
alexd1976 wrote:
Diego Rossi wrote:

My reply will be on the same level of the question.

"Sure, you can, enjoy your life as a fox."
The feat don't give a way to turn back into an human. So you assume fox form and stay in that form forever.

LOL that's a bit harsh.

It functions as Beast Shape II, which is (D).

PRD wrote:
D) Dismissible: If the duration line ends with “(D),” you can dismiss the spell at will. You must be within range of the spell's effect and must speak words of dismissal, which are usually a modified form of the spell's verbal component. If the spell has no verbal component, you can dismiss the effect with a gesture. Dismissing a spell is a standard action that does not provoke attacks of opportunity.

It is a feat, as written not even a supernatural one. It is not Dismissible as you can dismiss spells, not feats. -

It is the new version of GIGO, Silly In, Silly Out.

It functions as the spell, says so in the feat.

Not liking it isn't a valid rules argument to change it.

And even if you absolutely wouldn't allow the player to dismiss, they certainly wouldn't be stuck in that form forever. Beast Shape II only has a duration of 1 min/level.


This spell should work, kinda, though it only affects one target and doesn't have a range of miles.


Now, I think I'm the farthest thing from an optimizer, but I have a general grasp on what each class favors. Intelligence and spells for a Wizard, Dexterity and weapon finesse for a Rogue, Paladins with good Strength and Charisma, etc. Each class tends to lean itself in one or two directions.

But the Medium has me completely stumped. Their day-to-day ability to swap their entire focus with spirits leaves me wondering how to build a Medium that's even remotely effective. Do I favor martial abilities or spells? Should I aim for a jack-of-all-trades type? What feats do I even begin to consider?

Sorry if this question has been answered before. I've only recently done my reading up on the Medium, and haven't found any answers that could help give me a direction with character building.

Thank you for your time!


Something like this?


If you're playing as a Bolt Ace, you can use Hand Crossbows from level 1. They're proficient with all types of crossbows, exotic or otherwise.


This page lists beneficial effects from both drinking and bathing in dragon blood. This seems to suggest that eating other parts of the dragon would result in similar magical effects, but that can probably be left up to DM discretion.


RAW, I'd say no. But I wouldn't say it's an unreasonable houserule to convert a fraction of your fly speed(half or so) into swim speed while underwater.


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I've always been interested in doing a campaign where every character, for whatever reason, is shrunken down to only a few inches tall. Along with it just being kinda weird, there's a whole lot to come up with concerning rules and stat blocks for now gigantic(or gigantic-er) sizes. That, and along with balancing out magic items and such(you can't really buy from Ye Olde Magic Shoppe effectively when you can't even carry your gold).

And I'm pretty sure players would get a little fed up with being so comically underpowered compared to your everyday commoner.

It'd be neat to try out sometime, still, with a willing party, but there'll likely be a lot of work to do keeping it all in line.


Talonhawke wrote:

I'd also like to add Precise Shot to the list of things we now need to know if they can be done in a rage. I mean if taking the time to reduce one penalty is too much we should prolly check on other things like lining up a ranged attack to not hit our buddy. That is concentration and Patience.

Or we could figure it's training.

The worst thing I can see happening here is another T10 supposed to be ambiguous ruling that will make it hard to figure out what you can do from one DM to the next.

In fact, who's to say a Barbarian can even use a bow in raging? It definitely takes concentration and patience to line up your shots, moreso than "hitting them with the blunt end" for nonlethal damage, so following that line of logic it makes sense to remove a raging Barbarian's ability to shoot as well.


You can take a non-lethal attack with any weapon at a -4 to attack.

Edit: Source.

Under Nonlethal Damage, You can use a melee weapon that deals lethal damage to deal nonlethal damage instead, but you take a –4 penalty on your attack roll.


LazarX wrote:
Jeff Merola wrote:
You want a Ring of Eloquence.
It's function presumes the ability to speak. As it says it helps you choose the right words, so the ring won't help a mute, which animals for this purpose, are.

The wearer retains the ability to speak in these languages even if she assumes a form normally unable to do so (such as a druid wild shaped into a wolf).


If he's ugly in the strong kind of way, you can throw this on him.


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Ctrl+f for "fall" provides no results.

I can't believe you ignored the Paladin conundrum. Shame on you.


Bill Dunn wrote:
Seriously? People are interpreting the description of gloves of arrow snaring to require a feat it says the wearer does not need?

It gives you a feat that does not function without a second feat.

The gloves do not give you this second feat. The first feat only functions when the second feat is used.

Again, the gloves do not give you the second feat. They only give you the first feat.

The feat that does not work without the second feat.

You need to deflect arrows to do anything with Snatch Arrows. The gloves allow you the feat, but the feat does not function if not used in conjunction with Deflect Arrows, a feat the gloves ignore by allowing you to drop prerequisites.


AerynTahlro wrote:
d20pfsrd wrote:
Once worn, these snug gloves seem to meld with the hands, becoming almost invisible to casual observation. Twice per day, the wearer can act as if he had the Snatch Arrows feat, even if he does not meet the prerequisites for the feat. Both gloves must be worn for the magic to be effective, and at least one hand must be free to take advantage of the magic.

Source

d20pfsrd wrote:
Prerequisites: Dex 15, Deflect Arrows, Improved Unarmed Strike.
Seems pretty clear to me... The gloves allow you to catch&keep or catch&throwback projectiles twice a day provided you have a free hand.

It gets a little iffier than that.

From the entry on Snatch Arrows:

"When using the Deflect Arrows feat you may choose to catch the weapon instead of just deflecting it. Thrown weapons can immediately be thrown back as an attack against the original attacker (even though it isn't your turn) or kept for later use.

You must have at least one hand free (holding nothing) to use this feat."

The gloves allow you the Snatch Arrows feat twice per day, without the prerequisites. This means you do not need Deflect Arrows. However, Snatch Arrows only takes effect when using the Deflect Arrows feat, which the gloves do not grant you. RAW, this means the gloves are useless without Deflect Arrows, as you need to use Deflect Arrows for Snatch Arrows to even function. Without Deflect Arrows, Snatch Arrows is a useless feat.

It is a perfectly reasonable house rule to allow the gloves to grant both Deflect and Snatch Arrows.

(Please note this is all based on my own interpretation, as I cannot seem to find any official clarification on the issue).


Souphin wrote:


A bard that gets rid or music all together

I think this works pretty well for a music free Bard.


Edit- Pretty much ninja'd. :(

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