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WatersLethe wrote:One thing I'm curious about, is why there was such a big push to get more damage dice rather than boosting static modifiers? Is rolling handfuls of dice for every melee attack really that important?
After some discussion, it almost feels like PF2e was designed to make every little operation in the game be more time-consuming and cumbersome for the average gamer.
That way your gutcheck when picking your fantasy tabletop system is "wow, PF2e is way more heavy than 5e".
A little playtesting and it's pretty apparent that the game (as it exists today in the playtest) finds every possible way to be bulkier than its 5e counterpart (which some folks will like and some will not like).
1. Watching players have to roll more dice (and instead of pick the highest, making them add them all up). To me, it seems like folks are getting worse at basic addition each day.
2. Watching players figure out how to use 3 actions per turn (vs an action and bonus action). "Guys, whats the best way for me to use my last action?"
3. Watching players remember if their action took 1 action, 2 action or 3 actions, or a variable number and what that variable number of actions does.
4. Watching some players take 3 move actions and start counting out squares on a tactical map and lose their place and then have to start over and wonder where they started again.
5. Having players who are a bit math handicapped tell you, "uhh, I hit in the low 20s" and then telling them you need an exact number because you now need to determine if they beat the target by more than 10 since the effect will be different (or vice versa) and then waiting so folks who used to give you "low 20s" as a result" now need to always deliver the exact number.
This will certainly be an uphill battle for PF2e. While a better balanced system from PF1e, he switch cost from PF1e to PF2e is substantially higher than from PF1e to 5e, which will mean many groups stick to PF1e or if they opt to switch they switch to the system...
Have you ever played a high level Pathfinder Game where each caster takes 10 minutes each round? I don’t think it will be much more or less cumbersone than that.
But back to your points?
1- Yeah, You can’t go lower that 5e so going for more dice will make E2 stand out for that player that may want to try it. Level 20 barbarian Crit rolls 12d12 Muahahaha!
2- Once you get used to it is more or less the Same, in 5e a level 11 Fighter will attack 3 or 6 times and move attack keep moving and keep attacking is standard in 5e.
3- if you are used to: Player: I used my swift action, my main action and my move action, I’m good. Gm: ok next turn. Player: I’m using an immediate action to cast a spell. And then in his next turn. Player: I’ll use my swift action and then your GM: You used your immediate action so you can’t use your swift this turn, Palyer: I totally forgot that I Used it, Gm: Sure you did.
4- It happens all the time in Pathfinder and 5e, like all the time, for me at least once per session one player at the middle of movement says: where was I, o I forgot how many feet I moved. So nothing new here.
5-Maybe your GM can know your passive bonuses and you just tell them the roll and he will tell you if it crit or not.
People may like it or not, but I don’t find anything in the system that is more or less complicated than 1e pathifinder. Sure you have learn al the new action system, so you have more stuff to learn, and sure some players have known this rules (3.5) for many years.
But like any system after a couple of sessions with a good GM where you tell him what you want to do and he tells you how the system handles it, it's going to be fine.
But well this is a beta test to test, and that’s what I’m going to do.