I will agree some of the grit (especially the distrust of half-orcs) is missing in this adventure. But many details were spent elsewhere, such as the actual events, skill checks, and leads needed to start the adventure as well as many situations of "If player group 1 does action B then result C, if action F then result L"
The Doomkitten also had a point that right now, Paizo has taken a few early and very public steps into promoting "gaming for everyone" through NPCs and plotlines, which has already upset a large number of very narrow-minded individuals. If they then somehow persecuted these stories to any gritty/realistic degree they could get backlash from a different group or groups. In some cases, bad press is just bad press.
Finally, it's far too easy to explain a few of the issues in Trunau. After all, the rape issue was the first thing that my own players thought of on their own, no less without me, or the adventure saying a word, and all them grew pale faces. I literally thought I might have to stop the game as it made people uncomfortable. As soon as I explained what a hopeknife was for, everyone suddenly understood the half-orc population of their own accord. Sometimes the GM doesn't have to fill in the lines. You say you don't see grit, I say it's all between the lines and easy to pick up on... if you look for it. If you don't look for it, yes, it's a very black and white, high-fantasy-esque adventure with explosions, orc slaying, and a giant.
Scott Wilhelm wrote:
A sling's range is no different than an atlatl, with the exception I can pick up the atlatl dart after it's used, saving money. My GM has us track ammo, rations, weight, etc.
Because you treat an atlatl dart as a javelin if you throw it without the atlatl itself, the GM says I can pick up the ammunition after firing as it's not destroyed. Plus, I think the chakram and atlatl give me a bit of "character" and difference from the common builds or cookie cutter equipment lists.
Another thing about my playstyle is that I never put all my eggs into one basket. I might have a favored weapon but I tend to carry a variety of tools at all times because I'm from the days of old dungeon crawls.
My current weapon loadout:
Darksol the Painbringer wrote:
I'm really starting to think you have not read about the weapon yourself. Even on the PRD it's listed as a double weapon. Which means it is a double weapon. There's nothing here to state. Secondly, in our hard copy of the book, it's a double weapon. Again, I have to repeat. In our sources it's a double weapon. I don't know why you keep bringing this up after I already answered it. In the rules and RAW you keep talking about, it is a double weapon. The rules confusion comes from the Reach quality on most of the messageboards I've read.
Yes, it was not point buy, and as I already had a 16 Dex and 16 Str, I figured I might as well sure up my con a little at least.
Also I did not realize that weapon training for chain weapons was a thing. Thank you for pointing that out :).
Since I'm really trying to make a more control based character, I wanted to ask the forum's opinion on Combat Patrol?
Darksol the Painbringer wrote:
In our copy of Ultimate Equipment, it is listed as a double weapon. One rule our GM has, is if you don't have a physical copy of a book, it probably isn't a rule at her table. So we can't use sources like PDFs, updated errata, or the SRD. In fact, if I wanted Fury's Fall I'd have to go find a physical copy of the cheliax book.
She won't let me use the ball end adjacently, however. But this I know, which is why I'm not going too deep into two weapon fighting. Mostly I'd be using it to attack someone at reach and adjacent at the same should the situation present itself.
But yes, in our version of Ultimate Equipment the Kusarigama is listed as double, monk, reach, trip, grapple, disarm
Her houserule simply clarifies which end has which quality. (She's actually pretty sure our copy is a misprint, as the Kusarigama is listed on the PRD as ONLY, double, monk, reach, trip, grapple, no Disarm quality.)
Scott Wilhelm wrote:
That's alot to take in. I'll look into a few of the feats you suggested. I've never heard of viscious stomp, or fury's fall, or punishing kick at all.
I'm not looking to multiclass or eke every point of damage possible out of my weapon to be honest. But thank you for the suggestions.
We rolled a pool with 5 sets of dice (there are 4 players, the DM rolled a set) then took turns picking from the pool of numbers. It was 3d6, however.
Hmm, I'll have to ask my GM if Martial Master is legal, I think the only book she said she didn't want at her table was the advanced class guide, so I'll have to see. But interesting idea.
Okay, so I haven't actually played in a while. I've been the Game Master for quite a few years, but not a player.
That said, I've got the chance to play in Council of Thieves.
I want my character to focus on the kusarigama, because it seems fun. By RAW, the kusarigama is quite the confusing weapon, but my GM has houseruled it.
Kama end - 5 ft reach, Trip, 1d6, Slashing
This, admittedly, is a houserule concerning the weapon, so I don't need discussions on how it works, how it's supposed to work, or RAW.
Finally, I have the following stats.
STR - 16
Now, I'm not trying to optimize, I'm just trying to play something I find fun. So if anyone has suggestions on unique feat lines I can go, that'd be great. The only ones I've got lined up for sure are Improved Disarm and Improved Trip.
Kneeling: The character is kneeling on the ground. A kneeling attacker has a –2 penalty on melee attack rolls and can use a ranged weapon with a +2 untyped bonus to attack. A kneeling defender gains a +2 bonus to Armor Class against ranged attacks, but takes a –2 penalty to AC against melee attacks. Standing up is a move-equivalent action that provokes an attack of opportunity.
Prone: The character is lying on the ground. A prone attacker has a –4 penalty on melee attack rolls and cannot use a ranged weapon except for firearms or crossbows, which receive a +4 untyped bonus to attack. A prone defender gains a +4 bonus to Armor Class against ranged attacks, but takes a –4 penalty to AC against melee attacks. Standing up is a move-equivalent action that provokes an attack of opportunity.
Flanking: A creature is considered flanked when two or more creatures are flanking it as per CRB rules, however, flanking is now a condition and all attacks against that foe (including ranged) receive the +2 flanking bonus as long as it remains flanked. This also allows certain feats and class abilities to trigger, even if the triggering character isn't directly flanking the opponent. (Rogue Sneak Attack, for example)
I'm posting these, because normally I just adjudicate them secretly "behind the screen" so to speak, but I haven't done a PBP in a while and forgot I need a certain level of transparency with my houserulings. These are the only three outside of Hero Points, however. Everything else is going to be played as closely to rules as presented and common sense allow.
Okay guys. Rules update. Due to low rolls, I'm allowing Hero Points.
These hero points are explained on page 322 of the Advanced Player's Guide. The only thing you cannot use the hero points for is "Act Out of Turn" as we use block initiative.
Everyone has 2 hero points.
If you decide you do not want to use this rule subset, you may instead gain a bonus feat.
Ultimately people are very unpredictable and predictable at the same time. So for me, I always create my party in one of two ways. 1: I create it based on my already active player's characters. In which case the leader of the party is the leader the players follow.
2: I create a standard group of Cleric, Rogue, Wizard, Fighter, with the rogue playing the "face."
Once this is done, any actions taken by the party are usually dictated by the Rogue or the leader. With a full write-up of this character. I then play it out like Shadowrun: Returns, with the main character performing most interactions, but able to ask other characters to do specific checks or actions. This severely limits the risk of "meta-gaming" as I only have one character's mind to really care about. The other characters are treated as cohorts or hirelings.
Edit: It's not a perfect system, as a good party will come up with different ideas and bounce them off of each other, but it's the best way I can come up with to do this.
I know this might be a bit late, but my houserules were designed with my number of players in mind.
For another houserule I'm thinking of implementing (following occult adventures psychic magic) is seperating classes like Druid, Ranger, Bard, Witch, and shaman into "Primal" or "World Magic" this is just a thought experiment at this point, however.
I'm just going to comment that I have seen this complexity prove an issue for me as a GM and for my players who look to me for rules clarifications. At least 3 of my 4 players have an aversion for forums and message boards.
This issue of complexity, however, is greatly increased by our combat standards. That is, each player including the GM, only has 30 seconds to state their actions or they lose their turn. The only time this 30 second timing is changed for the GM is in the case of special events, such as terrain features changing. (Battle on the side of volcano and a new lava flow begins.)
Huh, never thought about a new contract.... interesting. And actually, two of my players are doing the LG "stand against unlawful tyranny" thing. With the end of goal of just getting rid of Barzillai personally, rather than getting rid of Thrune itself. Very interesting mindsets I don't want to punish, you know?
So, I've read over In Hell's Bright Shadow, and I've come upon an interesting character that I just love.
And I read a certain part of her NPC profile. Now what I'm having trouble with, and what I want to do are:
NPC Spoiler #2:
Figure out a reason for this little creature to actually help the party and join the ravens. The issue I'm having is the whole "bound to a certain family" clause. None of my players want to be a part of that family line, and I'm coming up dead on ways to recruit this creature from a story standpoint otherwise.
I'm not too terribly creative during seasonal changes due to hayfever and sinus infections, heh heh ^^;
I don't know if this is the right place to put this, but.
Page 20 of In Hell's Bright Shadow:
If Chough hears the PCs battling the alligator, she watches from the shadows, delighted by the violence, but if they win, it takes her 2 rounds to register that Chough is dead.
Should that actually read:
If Chough hears the PCs battling the alligator, she watches from the shadows, delighted by the violence, but if they win, it takes her 2 rounds to register that the alligator is dead.
I allow retraining with a huuuuuge caveat. I require my players to track where feats came from, either level or class feature, and when they got the feat.
If you want to retrain the feat, it HAS to be one you could have gotten at the level of, or with the class feature at that point in time. So you can't trade Dodge for Blinding Critical, but you can trade Dodge for Toughness.
My players have agreed that this completely makes sense, and it doesn't take much to put a little parenthesis next to the feat saying what level or class feature granted it, and when.
We had some trouble with a new player who came into our group using the RAW form of retraining attempting to powergame instead of following a natural flow of character progression. Eventually, he left amicably with no hard feelings as our play-styles did not match in the slightest, and he realized that when I refused to up challenges for his character.
As far as HP retraining, I actually upped it to 2 hp instead of just 1 because we do roll for HP.
I am impressed. However, it might be wise to not presume everyone can do this so fluently. I'd wager you're the minority in that respect.
At the same time, it wasn't wise to assume that I wouldn't involve the players who were captured in this way. If not during the normal game night as hired muscle to help find their characters, then during a side session telling the same story. As I play mostly online now, schedules are not nearly as tight as face to face games.
Because the soul knows the alignment and patron diety of whatever caster is trying or raise or reincarnate him and can refuse the spell.
That would be the case normally, yes. If it wasn't for the fact that our last game this happened in happened in Cheliax where most temples would have been devoted to Asmodeus anyway. And the villain in question was LE.... which fits Asmodeus.... so the player assumed their spell had been paid for.
But, again in response to Jiggy. The reason I can do that kind of plotline easily is because my players never beleived in "don't split the party." if they come into a dungeon with two paths, they split up to cover more ground. Using message, telepathy, and other powers they can attain to stay in constant communication. So me being able to run two different stories in the same session has become second nature to me. Especially when I can run up to four completely separate combats on a regular basis anyway.
The characters are conscious, moving around. I mean, that's part of being enslaved. I would probably give them a chance to begin trying to get other slaves to start thinking about escape. And sort of GM fiat the "slave rebellion" to around the time the party finds the locations of their captured friends.
Here's the thing about character death and resurrection that no one has mentioned. If let's say, two characters die and manage to beat the BBEG at the end, who's to say a minion in the shadows didn't get even a lock of hair from the heroes' bodies and escape?
Then, before the party is able to bring their friends back from the dead, the real villain, the master of the last BBEG just reincarnates/true rez's the heroes, and pushes them through a portal to hell to sell as slaves.
Now the heroes who survived make it to a temple, contact a cleric, give over the money. Only to be told "Your comrades are not dead. They are living, and we do not know where."
Bum Bum BUUUUUUUUUM. Now you have an involved rescue mission to deal with. It's not just a case of "why doesn't the king come back?" It's also a case of "Why doesn't the villain raise his enemies and entrap them to keep them from being able to directly attack him."
I will do this as a DM to make sure challenges are right where I want them at a base level. Then if the players have creative answers, or get completely stumped even with the most obvious of clues, it is their own group dynamics and personalities that cause ease of victory or hard defeat.
I play through everything first with an NPC party solo.
That's touching, friend. :)
I myself do not play in a homebrew world, as my group plays in golarion now. But we do have some mysterious things in place. Such as an ancient airship made completely of adamantine that had living wooden men on it. (warforged from eberron), and a man who constantly cursed about gods who don't exist kicking him out (dragonlance).
With quite a few of the tech guide, ultimate combat vehicle rules, and some conversions, my party has slowly been steering towards a spelljammer story to visit all my old campaigns.
I do this all the time. Sometimes I give skill ranks for free if someone rolls natural 20s twice or three times in a row, to signify a sudden burst of insight and epiphany.
PC decides to spend a year between adventures working for his blacksmith brother, he can take armor, weapon, or blacksmithing and add a rank.
PC rolls three Knowledge Planes checks during an adventure and actually gets a natural 20 on the dice, he earns a skill rank in Knowledge Planes for a deeper understanding he never had before.
Banson Rochester. 6th level human male monk. A heroic end.
Banson and crew were in a castle and fighting off undead hordes after being led into a trap. As the group tried to escape they were cornered by flesh golems in the main courtyard, and the inner gate was being lowered. Banson rushed forward with his great speed and for 5 rounds held that gate open with a line of amazing strength checks (3 nat 20s, and 2 19s). He gave his comrades enough time to move past him while fighting off undead, but the damage from the falling gate and the flesh golems catching up to him and striking finished him off.
Albert Legrange. 1st level Alchemist human male. A not so heroic end.
After contracting filth fever from tracking a criminal in the sewers, he was then removed from this world by a pair of extremely lucky dire rats. (crits on both bites).
For me, it was because I'm a complete newbie on these boards when it comes to PBP and was under a false assumption that I needed one to add players to my campaign. As in without it, they couldn't post.
So eh, my bad for now. I'll remember it in the future, however.
Edit: You'd think there would be a sticky post in these boards on how the technical side of PBPs work, rather the one that explains proper posting etiquette.
Race Information Update:
All CRB Races.
Strix with the following adjustment:
Wing-Clipped: The flight of wing-clipped strix is weaker than normal, whether from deformity or injury. Their fly speed is 20 feet (poor) instead of the normal fly speed, and they must make a DC 30 Fly check to fly upward. Ostracized by their tribes and forced to deal with other races, these strix compensate for their weakness by gaining a +2 racial bonus on Bluff, Climb, and Diplomacy checks.
The reasoning for this will become story evident very shortly. For the Stretched Wing feat, add the pre-requisite of 3 ranks in fly.
3rd Party Races Allowed: Half-Giant*, Maenad*, Elan*