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Another question does the kinetic healing for void, can you give the burn damage too an undead who would presumably take no ill efect from it, or are you forced to eat the burn yourself?

The cool thing about the darkness and greater darkness infusion is that every square is considered to be the center of the effect, so you are shooting 20ft radius cylinders of darkness with every shot, or some cool thematic things with kinetic blade/whip, heck depending on your interpretation of conductive you might be able so send darkness cylinders like 1/4 mile long. Conductive weapons might be a bit better now too with 3 new possible energy composites(negative/fire, negative/lighting, negative/cold).

Also was it a typo for the void defense to not get better with levels?

The wood one looks like a lot of fun too, but I'm a hair disappointed that there isn't a double wood composite blast, though having 4 seasonal blasts is pretty cool.

Having the positive energy deal burn to people would probably balance it out pretty well(maybe 2 burn), and maybe allowing drain infusion to work on all creatures that are healed by positive energy.

Don't forget that an aetheric boost added onto a composite blast will add 30 damage at max level for 1 extra burn or the difference between adding maximize or empower, so with the same amount of burn mitigation you will make empower better pretty much in every way, but you have to shoehorn to build to pick up aether at somepoint (probably third).

The Mortonator wrote:

Yea, unfortunately I don't see a point to using a gun with Kineticist. It's a shame they are so limited in terms of the words, "Spell-Like Abilities" vs "Spells." If not then Spellslinger would open up a world of awesome characters.

Besides which, conductive is edgy enough that I have, for the moment, tried not to think too hard about it. It could reinstate something like Magus, but I'm not honestly not sure if Conductive should be allowed with Kineticist abilities and if so how. I would be interested in seeing the designer's thoughts on this.

He came out earlier and said it should work, but that conductive will get a FAQ or Errata to specify it works only 1/round, so you can full attack with full blasts, and that kinetic blade while alters the shape of the blast doesn't work as RAW for melee weapons.

With all that there really isn't too much point to it besides using double barrel shotguns so you can spend all your burn allotment on stuff fun stuff like magnetizing or dispelling spells with your fiery bullets while still effecting an area and bump your damage a bit with stuff like vital strike.

Permanent reduce person would increase your to hit by +2 (+1 Size, +1 from dex). That's all I got.

1. Yeah that should be fine.
2. I just briefly flipped through it I saw a few energy resistances, but on the whole I was surprised at how few DR there were, some SR were kind of high though, so Earth is a solid choice.
3. Composite are pretty much how you do damage, I'd suggest against aether until the third elemental choice. Water Air or Earth again would be your best bets, (Water for better defense, air for flight and earth for best composite), I hate suggesting fire, but if you want a composite blast and an energy blast back up fire might be the way to go.
4. Again depends on what you want to do and your party comp. If you have no utility then aether might be worth it otherwise I'd pick any of the other 4, and honestly by the time you make level 7 Occult Origins will probably be out and there will be two more paths that may be better/fit your character better (Void and Wood).

Honestly I'd suggest reading N Jolly's guide on the class, and you got time to decide on your level 7 ability so I wouldn't sweat it now, especially since two new elements will be out in a month.

You could go regular kineticist and just form gauntlets with kinetic blade, and maybe take VMC monk, though you would be so feat starved I'm not sure if you could TWF with that. Elemental annihilator with the same trick might work too, but you would be giving up a lot for it.

Dragon78 wrote:

I would also like to see a positive energy based element with a positive energy blast though I think the blast should only heal one person per day. Though using d6s for the blast damage would be ok since could only hurt undead/negative energy based creatures. Also having the ability to do non-lethal damage with blast, various healing/curative powers, disruption weapon property, etc.

I was playing around with a homebrew idea and what I came up with was for it too do full kinetic blast positive energy but also apply 2 burn to those hit by it (kind of symbolizing them being overwhelmed with positive energy). This would make it worse then kinetic healing and keep people from complaining about unlimited healing. It also could lead to some pretty fun builds that would focus on stacking burn on opponents to knock them out. I was also allowing drain to drain anything healed by positive energy, so you could have a vampiric healer.

I'm not sure if this exactly what your looking for but I found the 3rd party book Sphere's of Power to add a a lot to my games, and my players love it (though it took some convincing to actually open the darn book).

Back to the positive/negative energy component, the draining infusion could be a lot of fun, the negative energy would draw energy from undead (and probably shadow plane creatures), and the positive would draw from a really small list (or all living creatures who are healed by positive energy depending on the DM, but probably just those that are healed and not elementals or outsiders who don't come from positive planes). AKA I love the idea of a positive healer draining the life from living beings, though considering the fact it's called draining infusion I feel the caster should be nourished in some form.

Hargert wrote:
I would like to see some builds at low,mid,high level to see the claim of tier 2? So far I would put them about equal with rogue.

Rogue is pretty on point, the blast does the same damage as sneak attack and can't be used for irretives unless shenanigans are involved (conductive ammo), so it's dps is much lower, it's skill points are lower as are it's class skills, and it has equivalent BaB and Saves. Granted it has some better buffs, is more MAD (which is kinda nullified by Burn) and slightly better utility, but not by a whole lot (rogue with umd and some arcane talents is probably better).

Deadly aim, and atm it is compatible with the conductive enchant but it only works 1/round per weapon, so it's best on ammo or if you are multi-weapon fighting. Using the conductive enchant on double barreled shotguns is also cool, but that requires advanced weapons.

You could have the positive energy blast give temp hp like positive energy planes did in 3.5, when the temp hp is equal or greater to the creatures normal total HP it must make a dc 20 fort save or explode in a riot of energy. Granted this would be much weaker then most blasts, but it would be a lot of fun.

Gunslinger(Pistolero or bolt ace would probably be best) could be cool, still get touch attacks, you can add your dex to damage and you can get conductive ammo, on top of the synergy with the magnetic infusion. If Advanced firearms come to the table then not only can you get touch attacks at pretty solid range the double barrel shotgun is pretty cool to apply blasts too.

The only down side really is only energy blasts can be added to the ammo, so that limits your simple blasts by a decent amount and leaves only the Blue flame and force blasts for composite (unless you can argue that plasma should be energy too)

This has been posted before but a few ways to work with it are,

Including a infusion that is an overheat blast, it is an infusion that would do base blast damage plus the amount of burn you are removing.

Allow them to reduce burn by a certain amount (maybe 1/4 total) as either a standard action or by taking 15 min out of combat.

Having burn damage be exponential (ie 1 burn 1 dmg, 2 burn 4 dmg, 3 burn 9 dmg ect), this is would harder on low level characters but much nicer for high level (ie 10 burn would do 100 instead of 200).

Reduce burn for all infusions greater than 1 by 1, this includes composite blasts (I feel like you should be able to spam those worry free by level 16 for christ sake).

Having the burn nonlethal be applied until the character rolls a 1, this would allow the character to enjoy burn bonuses for a while without having the negatives, and could display a certain level of mental focus allowing the character to channel more of the energy without the backlash until their concentration breaks. Possibly the same as a 1 but have them make concentration checks whenever they get hit to see if the burn damage is applied, this could lead to a lot of rolling and slow down game play though.

Buff the fire defense, maybe make it go 1 die size up ever 4 levels.

Allow vital strike to work with kinetic blade/whip.

Give more bonus to players if they take the same element 2 times, similar to how they get if they choose the same element 3 times, maybe include the ability to manipulate greater amounts of their chosen element.

On other notes I think this class would be fun with gunslinger and conductive ammo (or a conductive double barrel shotgun that you can vital strike with), especially with the magnetic or unraveling infusions that just seems cool. Also why the heck is plasma a physical blast?

I just moved to the area an I'd be interested in joining a group! Feel free to message me with more info if you are still looking.

I think this can work for gestalt. I had the idea for a mythic campaign that my PCs would have to go through a operation from a Kyton to ascend to mythic status, but they could only gain Mythic points by consuming Mythic creatures. These points would not replenish naturally. They would also then gain any specific weakness(Vulnerability to fire, or vulnerability to anything that would normally bypass the creatures DR) the creature had, the PCs would also detect as the same alignment as the creature. This would both allow me a certain control over their power and leave them in some tough situations where they may have too maim or kill neutral or good creatures so that they could combat a greater evil, and maybe even cannibalizing their fallen brothers in arms to preserve the mythic points. Hell I even contemplated through a mythic troll at them, so they would have a continuous supply of mythic power, if they kept it fed and it didn't go on a hunger strike.

This idea could be used for introducing gestalt in the way that they would gain class levels of those they ate up too their HD, how permanent or temporary this would be would be up too you. Maybe make leveling up the other side something like each level they would have too consume somewhere between 2 and 3 of the class for 1 level on the gestalt side in that class. So eating 2 level 1 fighters or 1 level 2 fighter would gain you 1 level of fighter on the gestalt side.

Then raise the amount to grow to the next level by how ever many class levels you decide as the standard to the next level. Example if you chose 2 levels of fighter to be the amount needed for 1st level then to have 2 levels of fighter you must consume 4 levels of fighter, 8 for 3 levels, 16 for 4 levels.

Sorry if I'm having trouble stating the idea well but the equation would be Y=A^n, with Y being the amount of class levels that must consumed, A the amount of levels that must be consumed, and n is the gestalt class level.

This would lead too you PCs hunting down murdering and eating NPCs to fill out their Gestalt levels. Hell to get to level 20 they might have to eat 1.05 million class levels.

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Spell dodge says exceptional instead of extraordinary in its text block.

Sorcererous step could use some rewording, it makes it seem like you need a full round action of concentrating to get a swift action teleport. I assume the full round clause was for out of combat.

Quell magic also seems a little too weak I think, maybe lower the effective spell level instead, and if the level goes below 0 its canceled. I say that because as is it will take at minimum 3 rounds to get enough animus to cancel a spell when you get the ability(assuming +7 wis modifier and using a boost and maneuver each round.), which you wouldn't be able to do again for a long time afterwards either. On top of that it's a standard action so you'll have to use a readied action to even hope for it to work, and that's a round where you aren't hitting people.

Overall I really like the class, good work!

Since Black Seraph is off the table, I'd say either Scarlet Throne or Riven Hourglass would be the best replacements, Piercing Thunder coming in third. Scarlet throne has some mobility from counters and is a nice set of non supernatural maneuvers that a Harbringer can fall back on, Riven Hourglass is supernatural, gives some mobility and has a bit of fluff with souls which all kind of fits the Harbringer. Piercing thunder, it has some cool impalement themed maneuvers and a strong mobility focus which are both good for the Harbinger, but the whole mounted aspect is throwing me off a little. I suppose it fits as well as Riven Hourglass.

So I'd say Scarlet Throne or Riven Hourglass for regular Harbringer, and to swap out one of those for the Ravenlord archetype for Piercing Thunder. The reason I suggest it for the Ravenlord archetype is because you may increase the size of your bird as a free action at level 4, so if you are small or have the undersized mount you can ride it as a mount at 4 (assuming it's strength score is enough to carry you). So the Ravenlord can then become a mounted flying cavalier, which is an awesome fit for the Piercing Thunder discipline.

That being said if my suggestion is taken for the Ravenlord I might suggest that the raven either gets a psuedo-Strength score bonus to carry capacity or treated as a quadruped for when its size increases, because mounts can't fly in in medium or heavy armor, and a medium or heavy load is supposed to act like medium or heavy armor respectively while flying. This would mean assuming your character and his gear weigh 200 lbs (which I imagine is on the light side for a medium character) you wouldn't be able to ride your raven unless it had 18 STR, assuming Large size, until level 12 (10 base +2 lvl 4 animal companion increase, +2 ability score increases from HD, and +4 from EDL).

That being said I imagine getting a STR increasing magic item, Ant Haul cast, Muleback cords (with the extra imagic item slot feat taken by the raven), heavy load belt or animal growth spell would all allow your raven to carry you without much difficulty. It just seems to be a bit of a downer that you need to go through some hoops to be able to ride your raven.

I don't think is is exactly what you would want to go for but, the wording of spellslinger states you can use it with any spells and doesn't specify arcane or divine. So a Race that gives a level 2 arcane SLA and taking the trickery domain as a cleric would allow you too access Mystic Theurge at level 3. Gunslinger 1/ Wizard (Spellslinger) 1/Cleric 1/Mystic Theurge 10/ Eldritch Knight 7 would get you a Gunslinger that would be able to cast lvl 9 arcane spells and lvl 6 divine spells out of his gun, with 14 BaB pretty decent HD and the ability to buff himself pretty well with the likes with divine power.

I'm not sure if it's worth lvl 9 spells but two more levels of cleric would allow you to cast Harm through your gun, hell it might be better if you swapped out Eldritch knight for 6 or 7 level of cleric so you get level 9 Divine spells and you would still be able to cast disintegrate out of your gun.

It is believed so, and that it will take the rather subpar power to imbue your fists with your blast, and make it into something useful.