Andas's page

Kevin Mack wrote:

...the fact there still doing a capital raise after all this time...

The phrase "doing a capital raise" doesn't paint an accurate picture of the current state, as it suggests that they are still looking for people to give them money. The phrase they used was "finaliz[ing] a significant capital infusion into our company." They have people committed to give them money, and are in the process of dotting 'i's and crossing 't's to get that money into the bank.

This was a complex and slow process because there have been a lot of parties involved, some of them private, some of them not. Deals had to be negotiated between Party A and Party B, contingent on other deals between Party C and Party D, and so on. It has been in the works for many months, and as Erik Mona said the other day, it felt like Achilles' Paradox: every two weeks, we moved halfway to the finish line. But that's *almost* all behind us know, and, as "NewCorp" has said, they're starting to assemble a PFO team that is much larger—and far more well-funded—than Goblinworks ever was.

Thanks for the update.

@Tuffon

Well I mean, it is ALPHA, last I heard. Having a crap-ton of bugs that they then work out with the help of the players was the whole point, wasn't it? The "develop the game alongside the creators" idea?

Unless I misunderstood the year I spent investing 20 hours a week into these forums and the development prior to it's release.

So, if that is really what caused all this, then I really am saddened because that sounds like we the players let the GW team down in a hard way after all the promises of being ready for the bugs and the lower-tier graphics and whatnot.

Sorry, my expectation of a minimum viable product did not match up with Goblinwork's minimum viable product - so I was one that never activated my account.

Nothing I saw from any forum posts or other media was enough to convince me to start paying for access. I think there were a lot of people like me.

Regardless of all this, I think that something more would have resulted had we not been asked to pay for what was basically a beta.

I understand why this was done. But it made it very, very hard to keep up enthusiasm. Everyone just ended up saying, "Screw it, I'll spend my money when the game works." And then everything went downhiller.

And once you start charging a subscription you are released - no matter how you may protest that it is 'early enrollment' and not a public release. Cue the reviews and the firestorm of criticism...

I guess what they are trying to tell you AvenaOats is that the term "WoW Engine" primarily and immediately calls up the graphical engine of the game used by WoW while I think you mean the "WoW look" as in presentation.

Referring to it as the "WoW Engine" sidetracks the reader off the point you are trying to make and frankly confuses people.

Not trying to give you a hard time, but I have had to read your posts multiple times to get what I think is your point. (yes, you can call me dense)

I agree with the general direction he made us believe, he was setting. Absolutely not with the actual direction, he set.

Agreed. It is always easier to talk the talk, rather than walk the walk.

Neadenil Edam wrote:

Edam be looking forward to much fruitful trade at the new free trade city emerging near the weird Glowing Green Spire.

OOC: Historically maintaining neutrality relies on being useful. In WWII many European countries were neutral but were still over-run. Switzerland succeeded in staying neutral mainly because it provided a valuable resource to both sides.

Switzerland was not overrun in WWII because Hitler didn't have the right timetable to initiate Operation Tannenbaum. Nothing to do withSwitzerland being "useful". Additionally,, the active training and defensive deployments of the Swiss military leadership ensured the offensive would have cost the axis a high amount of casualties, manpower needed for the eventual invasion of the USSR.

I was just getting ready to post the same thing :)

Is part of the grind (perceived or otherwise) due to the large amount of experience that people are logging into during Alpha?

I have not played Alpha, but I have been reading the boards and it sounds a bit like what would happen if someone had taken a break for a few months then logged in to a bunch of unspent experience.

"Oh my goodness, I can get xxxx8, but I have to kill 250 goblins with an axe, sword, and longbow."

Would it be less grindy if you were looking ahead and saw - I'll have xxxx8 by Christmas as long as I kill 250 goblins with an axe, sword, and longbow over the next 3 months?

Aaaaannnddd... Karma got me.

Karma's a b~&&* :)

mmmm.... pi.... ;)

I'm not sure about the eyeball, but the philosophy lines up pretty good. I'll help in the land rush.

Good luck in your quest (and hopefully a helpful bump to the top of the board for a bit).

Don't divide us into math and non-math...

Wetlands, all wetlands. We need some swamp people in this game, and how are we gonna get them without wetlands?

It could be a trailer park settlement with car(t)s up on blocks in the front yard :)

Ok, I think I have a handle on it, but I do have a question:

Say you have a Tier II skill/feat that has levels to it. You go to another settlement to train it from level 5 to 6 because your settlement does not have this training.

Your settlement does have the support structure for this Tier II skill/feat, but it is at the base level (they never upgraded it after purchasing it).

Can you still use this Tier II skill/feat? I think yes.

Do you get the full effect of your training in it or are you at the base level since that is what the support structure is currently?

And thanks for all the information - it is looking very interesting!

Andas wrote:

Just don't force the rest of us to.

I really don't see how "what do you guys think?" translates into "you should all play this way" stuff like this keeps popping up around here.

I apologize - I thought you were advocating this system. If you read the rest of my post you will see that I did respond to "what do you guys think?"

Part of what I think is that you should be free to do this if you like as long as I am not forced to ;-)

For those of you unfamiliar with the term. A sleeper is a placeholder for your character when you leave the game. They have all your inventory and if they die, you will be dead when you come back to the game. In essence, when you log off, your character passes out.

I think it could add two things to the game:
1. Makes people think about where they are logging off. You would basically need to be in a player structure that protects sleepers.

2. Creates a 'sleeper hunt' activity for less reputable players.

You should be able to train abilities to protect your sleeping body, and threaded items will still function the same. You could also set it up so you could rob a sleeper getting access to 100% of the non threaded inventory. This would require training, and be open to failure, each attempt would be a further hit to alignment and reputation.

What do you all think?

I don't like it for a couple of reasons. One is cluttering up the world with 100,000 characters that are logged off. Running a NASA supercomputer you would still get significant lag I bet.

Another reason has been covered by other people - there are times you need to log off quickly and it isn't likely that the area will stay safe until you can log back on (whenever that might be).

Now I am all for you just walking away from your PC and staying logged on 24/7. You have every right to play that way if you really want to :)

Just don't force the rest of us to.

Docora wrote:

Of course that doesn't address the folks dumping out to avoid danger.

I'm not sure why everyone thinks this is so complicated:

1) Logging out in a safe area- instant.

2) Logging out in the wilderness, but not in combat- takes 30 sec, during which you can be attacked in PVP or PVE. At 30 sec you are logged out whether or not you are being attacked.

3) You cannot log out if you are in the middle of combat, with the exception of #2.

4) If you're disconnected and not in combat, rules #1 and #2 apply.

5) If you are disconnected in combat, you're character persists until the combat is resolved by your death or you going out of combat (if your team manages to prevail and kept your character alive), at which point you are logged.

Any type of extended vulnerability while you are logged out and cannot defend yourself is just begging for griefing and a toxic community.

I would say that if you are attacked while doing number 2 :) then it becomes the same as number 4. You don't drop out of the world until the combat is resolved.

There has been a desire for a high level of immersion and actions have consequence, so just to toss something out here as an alternative for Corpse Retrieval: don't allow it. Have character death be permanent (no resurrection methods). I don't believe PFO would travel down this path, but it is an idea. The corpse would therefore be a different character making "retrieval" impossible.

The corpse would be fully loot able to any character that can loot it. Gear would suffer durability loss in usage, and not require a death event to trigger it. No "Destroy Item" button would exist, since it doesn't in real life, but a "toss away action" or "convert to materials" could. Having only the game destroy objects (item, corpse, etc ...) adds a bit of processing overhead, but timers could be used to account for how long something would persist.

Accounts would only have one character on them to play. When the character dies it no longer is selectable and the Account would be required to create a new character. The dead character would last until persistence timer has expired (freeing up the character name). An account with the Destiny's Twin feature would have a skill point tracking object named DT_SkillPoints and instead of the newly created character having zero skill points, it would have skill points equal to the object, and the object's skill point counter would be reset to zero.

I don't think permadeath would be very popular. In fact I would go so far as to state that in my opinion it would keep a lot of people from trying the game.

Lifedragn wrote:

You would not think implementing player taverns might break combat with 2-handed weapons, but somehow that manages to happen on occasion.

Future Patch Note: The "Give 'em a Hand" action to reward performers in taverns will no longer temporarily reduce your total number of hands.

;)

Have another ale, Stumpy :)

I think simple feedback like this could alleviate those first weeks in the game big time for many new players, when they are experiencing their first deaths. It will give some meaning to it, and will also act as a Tutorial: such a message may be the first notification they get about the existence of Wars, Feuds,...

I think this could help with players new to PvP. I am pretty sure that it would help me :)

Of course you would want a toggle to opt out of the message/mail once you were experienced enough.

Sissyl wrote:

Leggo Lass?

L'ego Alas?

L'ego M'yeggo?

I have half a dozen names developed over the years. Usually a couple are available no matter how old the game.

Woo, it says I'm a Goblin Squad member now . Woohoo :)

Congrats! :)

The plan right now is that each "role" (class) has a Key Object. Bound to the Key Object are various character abilities that map to the class features of the tabletop classes. You can have two Key Objects equipped, and you can switch between them instantly. So a multi-class Pathfinder Online character is one that has the Key Object for two different roles equipped.

However, that means that you've made a significant tradeoff. While having the Key Object for a role in one set of slots gives you access to that role's feature set, you might want to put something other than a Key Object in the other set of slots. Like a ranged weapon, or a harvesting tool, or a different version of the Key Object for the same role (Maybe you want a sword that has keywords useful against undead in one set of slots, and a sword that has keywords useful against oozes in the other, for example).

The ability to mix & match these Key Objects is how we approximate multiclassing. We can blur those distinctions even further if we make Key Objects that class role boundaries - a Key Object useful to both a Cleric and a Rogue, for example, that isn't as focused as one built for just one role, but creates interesting synergies that might make the item worth using for some characters.

Then you consider the wide range of things like armor, magical items in the ring, head, cloak, boot, and belt slots, and how those objects affect your character and potential provide additional slottable abilities, and you get rapidly into a fractal space where characters can be highly divergent.

What we're not going to try to do is create well-defined role templates out of those combos. Players may do so on their own initiative, but we're not going to be held to them - what you do in terms of how you build out your character is your own choice, it's not a blueprint endorsed by us.

Ok, so if someone is slotting a cleric key object and a fighter key object they would get bonuses or be able to use specific fighter and cleric skills. Now if this same person decided they wanted to stealth (for example) and forgot to switch in a rogue key item - could they still do it (albeit at a lower effectiveness)?

No worries. The nested quotes are easy to combine into one quote.

Andas wrote:

Arwald wrote:

Why I would prefer permadeath in Pathfinder online?

Because in pen and paper Pathfinder you simply don`t respawn;everybody would find it strange and would remove excitement from combat and encounters.

In the Pathfinder TT games I have played you could purchase a rez or the party cleric could rez (if they were high enough level).

You always had the option of starting a new character, but not many people took it unless they were tired of that character.

Of course that is the advantage of a small group and a human GM.

<snip>

Also: "everybody would find it strange", Andas? You do realize this is a fantasy game with magic damn near everywhere, right?

Note that it was Arwald that preferred perma death. I am opposed to it :)

I am not in favor of having threaded items destroyed - if that would happen then what is the point of threading them?

A harsher penalty could be a decrease in the amount of threads you have for a certain amount of time. All of a sudden your better gear could be at risk.

Then you have to make the decision - do I risk going back out immediately? If I do should I thread my uber weapon or that sweet piece of armor?

The cautious would say - screw trying to get my corpse, I'll just have to buy replacements. The more adventurous could still attempt to get their bodies and recover some of their stuff.

Note I am not in favor of this idea - I think the current penalty is fine, but then I am a 'carebear' that will probably be trying to recover my corpse a lot :)

EQ2 added an in game chat interface. I think I used it twice in a year? I can't remember for sure. My raiding guild had their own TS server.

I know it is necessary now for coordination and such, but I still have trouble with the deep bass voice coming out of the slim elf maiden (LOL).

I avoid voip chat for the most part.

Why I would prefer permadeath in Pathfinder online?

Because in pen and paper Pathfinder you simply don`t respawn;everybody would find it strange and would remove excitement from combat and encounters.

In the Pathfinder TT games I have played you could purchase a rez or the party cleric could rez (if they were high enough level).

You always had the option of starting a new character, but not many people took it unless they were tired of that character.

Of course that is the advantage of a small group and a human GM.

Good book :) I can't wait for the 3rd. Unfortunately I don't think things will be quite that 'civil' in a game.

I started playing in '79 or '80. I still play a variation today with some of the same people I started with.

Good times and good adventures :)

Good point Ryan. I am a PvE player and that is exactly what I would do :)

This will be the first primarily PvP game that I try. It sounds interesting and I like the checks and balances that seem to be going in.

I am cautiously optimistic that I will like it.

Before anyone says yes I know all about training and no we wouldn't regard it as a problem because we know from Eve experience that the behind the curve theory is largely a myth that is mostly bandied about by people who want to excuse their failure and can be easily overcome by a group who plays with their brains

Well said :) PFO in EE will be a hard sell to people that are not strongly interested in it - even then waiting for more features may appeal to people.

I would like a full range of options. I used to only play in first person mode, but the last few years I have enjoyed third person.

I enjoy looking at my character.

Congratulations! It sounds interesting.

Here is the logic behind the option of the Islands approach.

The game will be weighted towards the accumulation of power over time. Therefore we can reasonably expect that the older an area is the more powerful the characters that live in it will be.

Power will gravitate to stasis. Settlements will either be in a continuous Cold War with a hostile frontier constantly patrolled and defended with little movement, or the area will homogenize into a peaceable Kingdom where the power brokers all agree to get along. In either case there won't be a place for a new group of upstarts to plant a flag and start building their own empires.

So what will happen is that the upstarts will constantly move to the frontier. And as that happens the core will become more and more boring. Life in the core will be pretty much about crafting and socializing, not engaging meaningfully with other players. Everyone not a part of the stable core will find it hard to move through the core so travel routes will be around the perimeter rather than through the middle, further reducing the mixing of new and old populations. But it will also mean that interactions around the perimeter are more likely to be A->B->C rather than a matrix where a lot of factions mix it up.

Over the long term the game looks like a donut. And the perimeter might become mighty thin.

So that's a situation we'll have to monitor and try to avoid.

Interesting... I hadn't thought of it that way, but it is a very good point.

Very interesting. It looks like there will be many ways to play. So far, so good :)

Andas wrote:

I want to start immediately, but if I am out of the country on business I won't have the time (or inclination) to try to generate a character and login right when the game goes live.

I also hope GW allows us to create our characters and attach our Training Time to them before they flip the switch on.

I definitely would like this. I can take a long time playing with the different controls to get my character just right.

Being wrote:

It does not seem a problem to me that a 'character slot' could accrue xp that would be preserved for the creation of the character to fill it.

Good phrasing. I don't see a problem with that either.

I think you misunderstood my position.

That is essentially what I was trying to say. I want my subscription to start immediately and I want to accrue the experience until I have a chance to be in game.

If it is directly tied to a character (and not a slot) then I hope we have the opportunity to pre-roll the character so that it can be ready. I would hope for at least 1 week?

ie I want to start immediately, but if I am out of the country on business I won't have the time (or inclination) to try to generate a character and login right when the game goes live.

Andas wrote:

I know I would be disappointed if EE started while I was on a business trip or working.

Has there ever been an MMO that started your subscription when the game went Live instead of when you actually activated it?

As far as I know - EVE is the only MMO where your subscription or paid training time has anything to do with your character.

All the MMOs that I have played are level based and the levels are earned by killing monsters and completing quests.

I have never played a game where you get experience when you are not logged in.

I see. The proposal is:

You have your subscription and are paying for it. Once you are paying for it you start accumulating experience for 1 character (2 if it is a destiny twin account).

If for some reason you are delayed in creating your character (server instability, work, personal reasons) your character will accumulate this experience until you can get him made.

This makes a lot of sense. It takes the pressure off of GW. They do not have to worry about a specific time to open the servers and there is less worry that every body that is going to start EE tries to log on in minute one of availability.

It also lets people that want to get their specific look/setup have the time without worrying about falling behind.

I know I would be disappointed if EE started while I was on a business trip or working.

It seems like a win/win.

That is one of the funniest (and true) comics I have read in a long time.

-Water

I'd like realistic swimming and encumbrance, so if you fall in water wearing heavy armor, you would sink and drown pretty quickly.

As long as we could somehow retrieve the body I would be ok with that. It doesn't have to be an easy way, just a way.

Of course you didn't ask us for our mental or emotional age.

I knew that was useless :) I think of myself in my mid-twenties, but my wife has a different opinion, lol.

Nihimon wrote:

Commodore-64 with a tape drive. Taught myself Basic and Assembly, eventually C. Getting that computer was an eye-opening moment... life-defining even :)

When I saved up money and bought myself the Commodore-64 with a disk drive, I taught myself Basic with that too.

I eventually learned enough I wrote a program that generated 1E DnD NPCs. Selected Race, Gender, Class, Spells (if applicable), and equipment.

My first computer was an Apple II (not II+). It had 16k of memory and I had a cassette player that I borrowed from my mother to load programs. One of my favorite was "Beneath Apple Manor".

For that matter my mother cosigned on a loan for me to get this marvel of technology. If I remember right it cost about $2,000. I was in high school and I had to find a job quick in order to make the payments on the loan :)

LOL, well the 'seasoned' crowd explains why twitch combat is not popular :)

I just have to say - Thank god the monitors keep getting bigger rofl!

Hey all,

I was reading one of the threads and something piqued my interest.

I am curious on what the physical age people of people following PFO is.

Of course this is all voluntary and if you feel more comfortable leaving a range or ignoring this post feel free :)

I am 50.

I believe the idea is that veteran players will plateau their focused skill progressions and will then need to spread their skills around. A veteran is not always going to better than you at everything, they are just going to have more options they can swap out. If you both put on your fighter hats, you'll be about the same. But the veteran could also swap out for his wizard hat instead.

That is the way I understand it also. You can keep getting skills and abilities, but they might not actually make you tougher - they just give you more options.

I am fine with cosmetic items being on the 'outside' market. I would prefer if I could get them without having to spend real money.

A stipend as part of the subscription would be fine as long as it was reasonable. I wouldn't want to have to save up more than 6 months for anything, though.

Andas, no affiliation. Kickstarter backer at the buddy level (will be playing with my wife - take that anyway you want :) )

I lurk mostly - took a break from the boards when they went on blog hiatus for the conventions.

Now back and still intrigued by the game. I don't normally PvP so it will be interesting. So far I am liking what I read.