Things I Want to Buy, and Things I Hate to Buy


Pathfinder Online

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Goblin Squad Member

There have been a few Cash Shop threads, and the subject still pops up in other threads. I almost just posted this in one of those threads, but figured I'd try to get myself in the habit of not changing the subject in the middle of threads.

There are a lot of things I'd be very happy to spend money on in an MMO, and there are other things that I feel absolutely used when I'm forced to spend money on them. In general, it boils down to whether I feel like I'm paying for someone's work, or feel like I'm getting raked over the coals for a convenience that didn't cost anything significant to develop.

Please keep in mind I'm talking about Buying with Real World Money.

Things I Want to Buy:

  • Character Model Customization Options;
  • Non-Standard Races;
  • Non-Standard Classes (yes, even Paladins);
  • Any non-standard artwork for gear or Settlement structures;
  • Special Edition versions of player-crafted items*.

Things I Hate to Buy:

  • Keys to unlock loot boxes;
  • Extra bag/bank space;
  • Anything that makes the game easier that can't be crafted by players or purchased from NPCs with in-game Coin.

* I know this one's somewhat controversial. My reasons for supporting it are because it takes actual work by real people to create, and because Goblinworks deserves to make profit. It's also not a necessity or even a luxury that's more effective than something that can be acquired in-game without spending real world money.

Goblin Squad Member

I could see from a crafter stand point unlocking "packs". All black smiths have like 10 different looks for a breast plate... buying a pack would unlock 10 more.

I'd like to hear more on your opinion of what qualities would qualify an item as special edition.

I'd drop $50 right now to be able to play a Drow, or the option start EE as an Elf and once Drow is developed. I'll post more on this later.

I will say I like where you are going with this.

Goblin Squad Member

What about potions, scrolls and similar items?


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Screw that. Just charge me $15 a month an let me go wild.

Goblin Squad Member

Nihimon wrote:

... In general, it boils down to whether I feel like I'm paying for someone's work, or feel like I'm getting raked over the coals for a convenience that didn't cost anything significant to develop.

Please keep in mind I'm talking about Buying with Real World Money.

Things I Want to Buy:

  • Character Model Customization Options;
  • Non-Standard Races;
  • Non-Standard Classes (yes, even Paladins);
  • Any non-standard artwork for gear or Settlement structures;
  • Special Edition versions of player-crafted items*.

You're very consistent there - most of that is additional artwork, with the partial exception of the non-standard classes (I assume they'll need some art and animation). Dancey said recently that art is a major expense in game development. I wonder if store-bought non-standard classes (yes, even monks, though I want to play one) would pay for themselves.

Goblin Squad Member

Areks wrote:
I'd like to hear more on your opinion of what qualities would qualify an item as special edition.

In general, I consider it a "Special Edition" if an equivalent item can be crafted by players or purchased from NPCs with in-game Coin, and the differences between the Special Edition and the Standard Edition are cosmetic or insignificant.

I think this post from Ryan is talking about a Special Edition:

This is our current plan (not literally, but by example):

There are 5 horses you can acquire in the game. Red, green, blue, indigo and violet.

All the horse types are different from each other in some material way. You get them via in-game activities.

We sell a Red horse with a non-functional, purely cosmetic unicorn horn you can only get from MTX or trade with someone who used MTX.

_________________________________________________________

Areks wrote:
I'd drop $50 right now to be able to play a Drow...

This is exactly what I'm talking about. I have no problem paying extra in order to play something that takes real development effort, like an additional Race or Class.

Goblin Squad Member

George Velez wrote:
What about potions, scrolls and similar items?

*looks over his lists*

Dag-nabbit!

Things I Want to Buy:

  • Bundles of low-end gear (weapons, armor, potions, scrolls, etc.) that are also available from NPCs for in-game Coin.

I have no problem bying those items if they fall into the Low-End Gear category or the Special Editions category. If they fall into the "Anything that makes the game easier that can't be crafted by players or purchased from NPCs with in-game Coin" category, then I'd rather not see them offered.

Goblin Squad Member

Qallz wrote:
Screw that. Just charge me $15 a month an let me go wild.

I agree that a Subscription should give you access to all of these goodies at no extra charge.

Goblinworks Executive Founder

Nihimon wrote:

There have been a few Cash Shop threads, and the subject still pops up in other threads. I almost just posted this in one of those threads, but figured I'd try to get myself in the habit of not changing the subject in the middle of threads.

There are a lot of things I'd be very happy to spend money on in an MMO, and there are other things that I feel absolutely used when I'm forced to spend money on them. In general, it boils down to whether I feel like I'm paying for someone's work, or feel like I'm getting raked over the coals for a convenience that didn't cost anything significant to develop.

Please keep in mind I'm talking about Buying with Real World Money.

Things I Want to Buy:

  • Character Model Customization Options;
  • Non-Standard Races;
  • Non-Standard Classes (yes, even Paladins);
  • Any non-standard artwork for gear or Settlement structures;
  • Special Edition versions of player-crafted items*.

Things I Hate to Buy:

  • Keys to unlock loot boxes;
  • Extra bag/bank space;
  • Anything that makes the game easier that can't be crafted by players or purchased from NPCs with in-game Coin.

* I know this one's somewhat controversial. My reasons for supporting it are because it takes actual work by real people to create, and because Goblinworks deserves to make profit. It's also not a necessity or even a luxury that's more effective than something that can be acquired in-game without spending real world money.

I disagree for "Non-Standard Classes (yes, even Paladins);" (Even if would advantage me… I paid 500 to just give this game a chance, so 50 for a class wouldn't bother me).

I'd add mounts skins !

Goblin Squad Member

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Areks wrote:
I'd drop $50 right now to be able to play a Drow...

Look what happened in Neverwinter: the price was even higher and it still appeared as if every third character was Drow. Now, if Drow in PFO were locked into Chaotic Evil alignment... ;-)

Goblin Squad Member

Jazzlvraz wrote:
Now, if Drow in PFO were locked into Chaotic Evil alignment... ;-)

*That* would be a seriously gutsy game-design move.

As a compromise... What if they started with CE core and active alignment, and it was up to the player to shift them, through in-game actions, to anything else?

Goblin Squad Member

Urman wrote:
Jazzlvraz wrote:
Now, if Drow in PFO were locked into Chaotic Evil alignment... ;-)

*That* would be a seriously gutsy game-design move.

As a compromise... What if they started with CE core and active alignment, and it was up to the player to shift them, through in-game actions, to anything else?

I would be quite content if their Core Alignment always had to be Chaotic Evil...

Goblinworks Executive Founder

Nihimon wrote:
I would be quite content if their Core Alignment always had to be Chaotic Evil...

I agree. In MMOs, starting "malus" like this never quite work in the long run if one can change it with enough effort.

Goblin Squad Member

Urman wrote:
Jazzlvraz wrote:
Now, if Drow in PFO were locked into Chaotic Evil alignment... ;-)

*That* would be a seriously gutsy game-design move.

As a compromise... What if they started with CE core and active alignment, and it was up to the player to shift them, through in-game actions, to anything else?

I'd like to be able to shift. I certainly don't mind having to work from CE. Maybe make it twice as difficult to get out of Chaotic and Evil but once you did, alignment shifts returned to normal. If ever you returned to C or E then the double penalty gets reinstated.

If you want to play a good or neutral Drow, you should have to seriously work for it. If you are playing a stereotypical Drow, you're good to go =)

Goblin Squad Member

Nihimon wrote:
Urman wrote:
Jazzlvraz wrote:
Now, if Drow in PFO were locked into Chaotic Evil alignment... ;-)

*That* would be a seriously gutsy game-design move.

As a compromise... What if they started with CE core and active alignment, and it was up to the player to shift them, through in-game actions, to anything else?

I would be quite content if their Core Alignment always had to be Chaotic Evil...

I hate when any sentient creature is labelled as Always something. I would not mind something like Gains Good at 50%, as to apply the Usually tag. It should certainly be easier for such creatures to be evil. Maybe we can just ban them from dual-wielding scimitars instead?

As to Cash Shop... Never want to see Non-Standard Races or Non-Standard Role options show up. Mechanical differences should not be for sale. Perhaps Racial Variant skins that only change appearance but not statistical benefits could work. Along with weapon skins and armor skins. But I'd rather see cool item skins be the work of craftsmen and not require them to pay out for it.

Ultimately I am in the camp of "Don't cash shop me, bro!" I want to pay a subscription and have access to all of the cool stuff. Not pay a sub and then pay more to access all of the cool stuff. :(

Goblin Squad Member

Lifedragn wrote:
Nihimon wrote:
Urman wrote:
Jazzlvraz wrote:
Now, if Drow in PFO were locked into Chaotic Evil alignment... ;-)

*That* would be a seriously gutsy game-design move.

As a compromise... What if they started with CE core and active alignment, and it was up to the player to shift them, through in-game actions, to anything else?

I would be quite content if their Core Alignment always had to be Chaotic Evil...

I hate when any sentient creature is labelled as Always something. I would not mind something like Gains Good at 50%, as to apply the Usually tag. It should certainly be easier for such creatures to be evil. Maybe we can just ban them from dual-wielding scimitars instead?

As to Cash Shop... Never want to see Non-Standard Races or Non-Standard Role options show up. Mechanical differences should not be for sale. Perhaps Racial Variant skins that only change appearance but not statistical benefits could work. Along with weapon skins and armor skins. But I'd rather see cool item skins be the work of craftsmen and not require them to pay out for it.

Ultimately I am in the camp of "Don't cash shop me, bro!" I want to pay a subscription and have access to all of the cool stuff. Not pay a sub and then pay more to access all of the cool stuff. :(

I don't mind cash shopping as long as 3 to 6 months later it gets released. Kind of like an early opt in. I don't have loads of cash to throw at a game. I currently sub to none. I B2P or do F2P. I will be subbing to the game and feel like everyone should have equal access to features. At the same time, GW has to keep their revenue up and early access to features is a way to do that.

I think that would balance the market place enough to draw in more of those "don't cash shop me folks" who will get access to it anyway, but for those special things close to their heart, they'd be more willing to pay to have it first. There is very little that I would buy, Drow race, specific looking armor and weapon sets. I won't ever buy inventory slots. At the same time, I am very much willing to fork over cash for certain things... Drow as a playable race being on the top of my list.

Goblin Squad Member

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I look at it this way. If the choice is between me paying extra for something in a cash shop or it not existing I am for the cash shop. A sub fee doesn't really cover the cost of new or niche content. If I have to pay extra to get access to dwarf themed building skins so be it.

Goblin Squad Member

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Areks wrote:

-snip for length-

I don't mind cash shopping as long as 3 to 6 months later it gets released. Kind of like an early opt in. I don't have loads of cash to throw at a game. I currently sub to none. I B2P or do F2P. I will be subbing to the game and feel like everyone should have equal access to features. At the same time, GW has to keep their revenue up and early access to features is a way to do that.

I think that would balance the market place enough to draw in more of those "don't cash shop me folks" who will get access to it anyway, but for those special things close to their heart, they'd be more willing to pay to have it first. There is very little that I would buy, Drow race, specific looking armor and weapon sets. I won't ever buy inventory slots. At the same time, I am very much willing to fork over cash for certain things... Drow as a playable race being on the top of my list.

I am not anti-cash shop in general. I am just anti-cash shop + sub. F2P or B2P + Cash Shop I find to be acceptable as well.

Early opt-in cash shops would be very acceptable to me and is something I might support.

As for Elder Day's statement about subs not being enough to cover niche content development, I would rather they add a dollar to subs across the board to make up for that cost as opposed to cash-shop exclusives.

I may be in a niche, but I want to play a game to have fun. Not to manage my expenses. A set price that I can pay and forget is very much worth it to me over the stress levels of what optional stuff I might be missing out on if I only paid more money. When I have to think about money while playing the game, it just harms the whole experience for me.

Goblinworks Executive Founder

Making the cash-shop stuff "bind when used" could be interesting btw, in the spirit of EVE's PLEX.

Goblin Squad Member

Audoucet wrote:
Making the cash-shop stuff "bind when used" could be interesting btw, in the spirit of EVE's PLEX.

Though it would relate heavily to just how much advantage wealth gives a player. If the ability to sell such items is one step away from "Pay to Win" then we get into dangerous territory.

Goblin Squad Member

Back to the Hybrid model. I can work with that.

Goblin Squad Member

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Reincarnations

Change your character race and name but keep everything else. Hopefully there will be an identifier more unique than names which friends lists, company/settlement rosters, contracts etc. can go by.

This will save people a lot of headaches when new races are released down the road. All EE accounts should get one free reincarnation and Hobbs should get them on his DT for life since I'm sure they would go to a good purpose.

Goblin Squad Member

Reincarnation, some may want to come back without name recognition.

Whatever. However Reputation, Alignment, and properly sized equipment. I expect Half-orc to fit differently than human than halfling than gnome. To say nothing of Pixie/Nixies or Rack Trolls

lam

Goblin Squad Member

My biggest gripe with cash shop items has always been exclusivity. If I'm paying a sub, I want ACCESS to everything. Note I did not say EASY access, just access. The fact that 'my sub wasn't good enough' to have ANY hope of access to the pets and mounts in the WoW cash shop was a recurring thorn interfering with my ability to enjoy the game. As long as the unique stuff is tradeable/sellable I'll be able to handle it.

Considering the game's focus on economy, I'm leery of putting any craftable/harvestable items for regular sale. Even if it was low level consumables only, that would still distort that market and new players decisions regarding skilling in production skills. Additionally, low level items would reasonably be the most readily available crafted items. If you wanted some, but did not have the coin, it makes more sense to me to buy, and then sell, a PLEX equivalent and use the proceeds to buy what you want.

I wouldn't object too hard to racial variants, or special races, even if they included some mechanical differentiation or benefit. Such as racial attribute bonuses/penalties.

Cosmetic skins and character re-customizations would also be acceptable to me. I LIKE the town skin idea. It could even come with an equivalent to racial bonus/penalty combos (i.e. better market, but worse walls).

Hmm, how about 'pixie dust' that, when used on an item, reduced the skill or attribute requirements to use that one item (until it is worn out or consumed)?

I also would not mind quite a few things being in the shop that were part of the features of the sub fee. In fact, I could easily see highly useful features being the 'hook' that keeps high skilled characters subscribed after they reached 'good enough' levels of skill points. I could see this including things like character ability slots, inventory/bank slots, market order limits, crafting limits and/or speed, or settlement control features.

I would not like lockbox keys AT ALL. I LIKE being able to see what is inside containers!

The craziest cash shop item I ever saw was RENTING inventory bags! That one just blew my mind, but I understand such is more acceptable in Asian games.

Goblin Squad Member

I really like League of Legend's approach to paid content: The only things exclusively available from cash are purely cosmetic. Every piece of game mechanics is unlockable simply by playing, though cash can also help speed up the unlocking process.

In the context of PFO, I would see that as cash buying skins for equipment, characters, buildings, etc. (basically anything that involves new art, but no mechanical differences), and buying increased XP, but only up to a global cap that matches that of the 'oldest' characters. I'd feel cheated paying for a subscription yet still having meaningful choices about my character 'locked' behind spending additional money. However, I may be willing to pay additional money to change some of the choices I previously made about my character.

If and when new races are introduced, I'd prefer to be given an option to select it without cost, but only once, no matter how many new races are introduced. Beyond that, I'd think that changing my race or even resetting some skills is something valuable enough to me to spend additional money, if I wished.

Goblin Squad Member

Lam wrote:
Reincarnation, some may want to come back without name recognition.

I know they will but I would not advocate for a mechanic that allows people to pay their way out of outstanding bounties / assassination contracts, off exile and kill on sight lists etc.

That's why I like reincarnation as an RP justification. Different body, different name, same person.

Goblin Squad Member

One the one hand, as a player I don't like the idea of people being able to pay out the nose to 'catch up' to the oldest characters; every player's skill total should be based on time played, not cash spent. On the other hand, that could be a lot of money for GW from people who want that extra edge... I'm rather conflicted on that particular cash shop feature that deisum put forward.

One thing I like for the hybrid subscription/cash shop model PfO is going to take is for the subscription to include some amount of cash shop cash with it (say 5$ worth). This way if there are awesome cash shop things you really want, you don't have to feel cheated that you're 'already paying a subscription but missing out on content', because this small 'allowance' amount would provide you the means to get the extra things you really want from the shop. This was something I really appreciated with DDO's subscription.


Lam wrote:

Reincarnation, some may want to come back without name recognition.

lam

Absolutely and totally against this, it is purely and simply a license to be a jerk knowing full well that you can leave your meta reputation behind. What you do should haunt you for the rest of your PfO career.

Being able to anonymise yourself takes away the whole point of meaningful choices because you can just pay a few dollars and walk away from your meta reputation as a ninja looter/griefer/ rp harasser/guild thief etc

Goblinworks Executive Founder

I'm ok with rename IF there's a way to track it. I don't want a witness protection program on demand. :p

Goblin Squad Member

Tracker + long cooldown(6 months?) + medium-to-high cost on race & name change makes it a solid concept in my view.

Because:

  • sometimes RP-characters need to die, deleting the char might not be an option if you spent a long time developing skills
  • new races coming to the game
  • better that someone changes race/name when bored with the character than quits the game

  • Goblin Squad Member

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    The reincarnation is also prone to be used alongside character sales. Buy a character from someone you met on the internet; give it a new face and clean rep; forget to change your password; find account stolen and character missing. We've seen it, right?

    I'd like a cash shop annex doing legitimate character sales, with GW getting a fee based on total xp - and throwing in that reincarnation bit.

    Goblin Squad Member

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    I'd like to be able to buy additional characters. Alts in effect. Such as a merchant I could place in a starting town to engage in trading.

    I'd actually prefer to have to pay for additional characters than get them free. Having paid for a character I'm more likely to value it and spend more time and effort developing it.

    A couple of other crowd funded games I follow (star citizen, shroud of the avatar) have decided not to give players multiple free characters on the one account. The reason being doing so would result in disposable characters, consequential loss of immersion, and likely facilitate scams and undesirable gameplay (ganking).

    Goblin Squad Member

    @Kelpie,
    Since you have to pay for training time (experience) separately for all characters (except if you have a Destiny's Twin), all alts will cost money (if you want them to have any training at all).

    Or maybe you were thinking about some other aspect of alting?


    Wurner wrote:

    Tracker + long cooldown(6 months?) + medium-to-high cost on race & name change makes it a solid concept in my view.

    Because:

  • sometimes RP-characters need to die, deleting the char might not be an option if you spent a long time developing skills
  • new races coming to the game
  • better that someone changes race/name when bored with the character than quits the game
  • The rename would be more used by those looking for a get out clause from the bad karma they have acquired in my opinion. While I agree that the rp use you cite is a good use for rename I still feel that it is a function that will be more misused than used properly and therefore shouldn't be an option.

    They have said they will allow race changes they will just need to keep the name.

    As to the tracker, sorry not really a solution unless you want to have to check everyone you party with, everyone you trade with, and everyone you interact with.

    Before you say I havent been in the rp situation I can assure you I have, having deleted a character that was almost 2 years old in Eve.

    Goblin Squad Member

    If they did sell expensive Drow characters with a starting alignment of CE, even if they could shift later, then those Drow should get a high reputation PFO version of'Menzoberranzan'as their starting settlement, making the Drow a viable race to play seriously.

    If someone is so invested there should be little problem with them since they stand to lose that investment by being a jerk. It might well inject life into the game having some well-organized and hard-core, CE characters with a viable high rep infrastructure in place.

    Goblin Squad Member

    ZenPagan wrote:
    Wurner wrote:

    Tracker + long cooldown(6 months?) + medium-to-high cost on race & name change makes it a solid concept in my view.

    Because:

  • sometimes RP-characters need to die, deleting the char might not be an option if you spent a long time developing skills
  • new races coming to the game
  • better that someone changes race/name when bored with the character than quits the game
  • The rename would be more used by those looking for a get out clause from the bad karma they have acquired in my opinion.
    This could certainly happen and I think is a very valid arguement. With good name tracking it might not cause much of a problem.
    ZenPagan wrote:
    As to the tracker, sorry not really a solution unless you want to have to check everyone you party with, everyone you trade with, and everyone you interact with.

    The tracker could be in-game, obvious and easy to use. If the name of a "reborn" character in chat has a mark, like "Wurner•", maybe right clicking it will provide "name history" as an option which could yield the result "Gankaholic (130817-130904), Griefalot (130904-131029), Wurner (131029-present)".

    ZenPagan wrote:
    Before you say I havent been in the rp situation I can assure you I have, having deleted a character that was almost 2 years old in Eve.

    I would never say anything of the sort. I haven't RP:d much myself but a guild leader on my AoC server got a name change and rewrote his backstory after losing to a rival in a duel, I thought that was really cool and would love to see similar things happen in PFO.

    Goblin Squad Member

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    I think the best way to do it would be to have an account name be separate from the player name.

    So when running around in the world you might see "Roleplay Name" but when you add them to your friends list / hitlist / company roster they are added as:

    Roleplay Name(Account Name)

    And when the change their name it becomes

    Newroleplay Name(Account Name)

    The point is the account name is solid, unchanging, and the primary thing people who want to keep track of you for good or ill intent will go by.

    Goblinworks Executive Founder

    Andius wrote:

    I think the best way to do it would be to have an account name be separate from the player name.

    So when running around in the world you might see "Roleplay Name" but when you add them to your friends list / hitlist / company roster they are added as:

    Roleplay Name(Account Name)

    And when the change their name it becomes

    Newroleplay Name(Account Name)

    The point is the account name is solid, unchanging, and the primary thing people who want to keep track of you for good or ill intent will go by.

    I'd agree with that. BUT : What if the char' is sold to an other account if it's legit like in EvE ? One would just have to change name+account to have a clean slate.

    Goblin Squad Member

    I am fine with cosmetic items being on the 'outside' market. I would prefer if I could get them without having to spend real money.

    A stipend as part of the subscription would be fine as long as it was reasonable. I wouldn't want to have to save up more than 6 months for anything, though.

    Goblin Squad Member

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    Audoucet wrote:
    What if the char' is sold to an other account if it's legit like in EvE ?

    The answer here might be simpler: check the "reputation" of the character before you buy it, because it might come with baggage you prefer not to pay for. Characters with "issues" should be of dramatically lower value on a market.


    Andius wrote:

    I think the best way to do it would be to have an account name be separate from the player name.

    So when running around in the world you might see "Roleplay Name" but when you add them to your friends list / hitlist / company roster they are added as:

    Roleplay Name(Account Name)

    And when the change their name it becomes

    Newroleplay Name(Account Name)

    The point is the account name is solid, unchanging, and the primary thing people who want to keep track of you for good or ill intent will go by.

    I really don't see this as a solution I will not be tracking these people by having them on my friends list. This is a typical situation from what has happened in other games.

    Person X asks to join group, I recognise name from (guildies talking about person X being a douche,person X being a jerk in chat,person X being an idiot on forums, person X being a jerk in person)

    result is Person X doesnt get into group

    I do not want to have to add person y to a friends list before inviting him just in case he may be person X wearing a new name. In a sandbox game your name should bear weight, this may be good meta reputation such as someone like Chribba has or bad reputation such as some of the other Eve players have.

    An example of this is someone joined the forums a while back using their Eve character name (I am not going to mention it) but I recognised it, so did bluddwolf and a few others. We recognised it as belonging to someone who spends all their time awoxing

    (AWOXing is an eve term for someone who joins a corporation with the sole intention of killing as many corp members as possible because in eve you can shoot corp members without concord intervention)

    Bluddwolf then set about persuading that individual that PfO was not going to support that sort of gameplay and that he wouldn't be able to indulge in those tactics here.

    This is why I say what you do in game should be attached to your name and your name should not be changeable. People always claim to want actions to have consequences, either good or ill, well name recognition is one of them


    Given what we know about the Turbinesque business model, I'm hoping they have a subscription level of like $20 a month that includes EVERYTHING you would get at the cash shop.

    Goblin Squad Member

    Cash-shop and Craftable Items:

    I am strongly opposed to anything a player can make being sold in a cash-shop. Though some would argue that it's low rent gear and should not be a problem, it is still taking in-game business away from the harvester, refiner, crafter, and merchant who are all involved in the creation and sale of such items. If you desire a player (character) run economy, don't shoot it in the foot by allowing players to circumvent it. Yes, it would allow GW to make an extra buck and players without as much playing time to get the lower end gear that they need, but if GW puts the right items in the shop, they could make oodles of cash, and time-strapped players shouldn't be be cutting into other players' in-game content or profit because of their personal gaming schedules.

    Storage Space:

    In keeping with my comments above, I would want to see "in-game" storage space (such as PoI and settlement storage) be something that groups have to buy with gold and contribute raw materials in order to build and expand the size of buildings for storing their group's stuff. However, personal bank space strikes me as more of a meta-ish storage space - none of us can help build a bigger NPC bank, and since not everyone may be associated with a group to benefit from bigger and bigger group storage, I would place the ability to increase personal banking slots in the cash shop.

    Binding vs Gifting:

    Further up the thread, I read a suggestion to make at least some of the unique cash-shop items character bound. Personally, I dislike bound anything, but especially for cash-shop, binding such items would reduce GW profits. The ability to buy and gift items to others could produce even more revenue for GW and allow for another level of player interaction.

    Building Skins:

    Given that there will likely be a limited number of types of buildings craftable by players (town hall, smithy, etc.), one way of making one settlement different from another would be to take the skin idea (change the look of the clothing, weapons, armor, horses, etc.) and apply it to whole buildings. If a bare bones settlement is happy with the default structures, super. If that Dwarf settlement wants something a bit more Dwarfish, they need only buy individual Dwarf building skins or perhaps the whole Dwarf building super-pack (economy priced for buying them all, of course). You want a strong looking Dwarf wall to protect your elegant Elven towers, buy each separately. Given their size and the art involved in each, these items would have a heftier price tag than regular item skins, but if there's a mechanism for buying as a group...

    Cash-shopping in Groups:

    I've mentioned this in past posts, but I'll toss it up again. With the PFO emphasis on settlements and team play in general, I think GW could make scads more cash if they built into their cash shops a means to buy larger price tag items as a group. If the members of a settlement wanted to buy something more pricey (see Building Skins above), what if there was a kickstarter-esque mechanic where the leader of a settlement (the settlement and leadership all being trackable by the system) could open up a PFO cash-shop kickstarter for a particular large ticket item. Then settlement members could chip in as they pleased. Once the item was purchased, the ability to place the purchased item would be unlocked in the settlement government UI, a timer would start (to make certain the leader didn't tie up the group's investment indefinitely), and the leader could place the item (say, a new skin for the settlement walls). Upon placement, the investors' credit cards would be charged. If the kickstarter was abandoned or if the placing timer ran out, investors would not be charged. Given that GW would likely already have everyone's credit card info (if the game still plans to have a monthly fee), this seems doable. In that settlements will have hundreds or even thousands of members, this could potentially earn GW a very nice chunk of change.

    A Last Thought:

    To subscribe or to cash-shop? A friend made a point that struck me as the WalMart tactic for this quandary. Sell for less = sell more = make more in the long run. What if instead of a $15 subscription, which seems to be the standard, you charged $5 and then made the rest of your cash via really well thought out cash-shop sales? $5 may seem like a pittance, but that's the point. People feeling the economic pinch may cancel a game that costs $15 of $20 a month, especially if they have multiple accounts, but $5 is a drop in the bucket...pocket change. But it's $5 in the GW bank for every player, on top of the cash-shop sales. Moreover, speaking of those multiple accounts, if I'm paying $15 a month for one, I'm likely not going to pay $30 for two, even though I'd really like that second account. I just can't justify it financially. But $10 for two? Why wouldn't I pay $10 for two, or even $15 for three when it's costing me the same as the original subscription price of $15 for one account? I'm sure there may be some way this might imbalance the game by having too many alts all training skills at once, especially in that you can supposedly play more than one character at once (something I have no interesting in trying to manage), but I'm looking at this purely from a financial standpoint.

    Thoughts?

    Hobs

    Goblin Squad Member

    Hobs the Short wrote:
    I've mentioned this in past posts, but I'll toss it up again. With the PFO emphasis on settlements and team play in general, I think GW could make scads more cash if they built into their cash shops a means to buy larger price tag items as a group. If the members of a settlement wanted to buy something more pricey (see Building Skins above), what if there was a kickstarter-esque mechanic where the leader of a settlement (the settlement and leadership all being trackable by the system) could open up a PFO cash-shop kickstarter for a particular large ticket item.

    Don't know how feasible this is, but it's a brilliant idea!

    Goblin Squad Member

    While I'm again drawing from ArcheAge I think they have an interesting thingie that is relevant to this thread.

    ArcheAge allows you to apply your own custom image onto sails and cloaks. ( It may be cloaks, shields and banners or something more fitting in PFO ) But for every application of that image on an item it requires a special ink consumable. For reference they are sold in stacks of 5 for 4 bucks.


    Papaver wrote:

    While I'm again drawing from ArcheAge I think they have an interesting thingie that is relevant to this thread.

    ArcheAge allows you to apply your own custom image onto sails and cloaks. ( It may be cloaks, shields and banners or something more fitting in PFO ) But for every application of that image on an item it requires a special ink consumable. For reference they are sold in stacks of 5 for 4 bucks.

    Sounds like a good thing Papaver, my only reservation on this is the custom image part. Fine I think if vetted (maybe registering a custom image for use is a cash shop item itself and the price reflects the cost of some human signing off on it), otherwise I fear it will often be the case of the army of Zog approaches...we can tell by the male genitalia depicted on their banners

    Goblin Squad Member

    The 11 core classes and 7 core races should NOT be in the cash shop. They are the standard ones.

    The base/alternate/prestige classes and expanded races can be.

    Goblinworks Executive Founder

    Jazzlvraz wrote:
    Audoucet wrote:
    What if the char' is sold to an other account if it's legit like in EvE ?
    The answer here might be simpler: check the "reputation" of the character before you buy it, because it might come with baggage you prefer not to pay for. Characters with "issues" should be of dramatically lower value on a market.

    Wasn't my point. :)

    Goblin Squad Member

    Cash Shop anything is just b*$%+@@#.

    Ruins the damn game in the long run.


    Xeen wrote:

    Cash Shop anything is just b+!@&%#+.

    Ruins the damn game in the long run.

    Yea, I'd prefer they just go with a standard sub-model for everyone.

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