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Agyra Eisenherz's page
46 posts. Organized Play character for Agyra.
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So, how does Painful Injection now stack or not stack?
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Yes, it is a dwarven thing now. If you want to wear armor as dwarf:
Either you take unburdened and have now the huge advantage to... be exactly as slow as the other races. But you have to give up your heritage feat for it.
Or you take a more interesting heritage feat, then you lose completely because you are even slower than every other race.
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Falth from 7-98 was an interesting character, I would enjoy to see him again.
To give the pf2 "Paladin" some inquisitor-like abilities would really fit. But I don't think the "Paladin" should replace the Inquisitor.
I don't think this is a good idea. Inquisitors live from their spells, from their ability to ignore alignment restrictions and restrictions of their deity almost completely, from their versatility, from their divine infused offensive and defensive powers, and from their skills.
The pf2 Paladins have almost none of this.
Edge93 wrote: Agyra Eisenherz wrote: Hey, Excaliburrover, that were exact my thoughts as I saw our thread was closed. It was a "oh they do acknowledge our problem". I second every single word of what you say.
I was really burnt by Doomsday Dawn and particularly by my GM. But I still do trust in that they CAN make Pathfinder 2.0 great, if they change enough.
Every single update makes steps in the right direction. Dare I ask what happened with your GM? My GM was frustated by the amount of criticism we players had about many things in pf2. He defended pf2 bitterly and fought against us, finally in forbidding us to say anything negative about. I even started to feel guilty if I wanted to say something negative. So I finally stopped playing. But I will at least try pf2 when it's finished.
And so I am quite happy about that our concerns were acknowledged by Mr. Bulmahn in his friendly words.
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Hey, Excaliburrover, that were exact my thoughts as I saw our thread was closed. It was a "oh they do acknowledge our problem". I second every single word of what you say.
I was really burnt by Doomsday Dawn and particularly by my GM. But I still do trust in that they CAN make Pathfinder 2.0 great, if they change enough.
Every single update makes steps in the right direction.
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Time for my Priestess of Dispater to return home.
I would prefer 100 silver 1 gold 100 gold 1 platin. But I am fine with just using gold. I don't like the version used in the playtest, these silverpieces should just be the number after the dot.
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Yep. Casting in melee.
Yes, there are some enemies with reactions which will trigger, but I am fine with the risk and I am a bit curious of finding out if it has one on the hard way. I love it to stand with my storm druid right in front of my enemy while throwing Tempest Surges on him. And if I might get hit in return, I get hit. Fine with me.
Non-good Paladins
Spellpoints/Focuspoints
Casting in melee
Four Tiers of Successes
Blaster Druids
Channel Smite (the pre-nerfed version)
Inspire Courage
Healing in combat
Nettah wrote: If you go the paladin multiclass route wisdom will be very important because your spell point pool is determined by wisdom not charisma as a cleric, taking the paladin feats will just give an extra amount of spell points.
Actually both your channel pool and your spell point pool will use charisma.
Quote: If you already have a pool of Spell Points, you use the higher ability score to determine the pool, as normal, and your Spell Point pool increases by 1. Lets conclude:
Wisdom is used in offensive spells, the removal and dispel spells, for some static + on spells (which is often only a small factor).
It is used for the spell point pool if you don't multiclass.
That's all.
Of course Wisdom is a good thing for every character, but that is not cleric specific, and the cleric is already so MAD, that it is not really worth taking Wisdom.
Sure you can do a Wisdom-based fullcaster cleric, with having a few spells per day you are running out very fast and even less channel heals, and have to rely on cantrips (which are weak), so you will outperformed by almost every other character.
I am not saying Wisdom is useless, but it is not so important for the MAD cleric as Strength, Charisma and Constitution, and probably Dexterity.
What is the problem with "not allowed to lie"? In pf1 I have a paladin with the deception domain (Sacred Servant Archetype) and the legalistic curse (oracle dip) - circumventing truth with different truth and timed silence.
I think the code of the deity should come first, then all other codes.
But the most important thing is, and they should implement this strictly, as a Paladin you are not responsible for the actions of your team and as a (paladin) player you should not stop other players of playing what they like.
KujakuDM wrote: In a world of moral and ethical absolutes (where what they are are defined by deific will and ordained by gods) Assassination is controlled by evil gods and outsiders. As long as you have the empyreal lords of spies, vengeance, scars, determination, executions, death, I am fine with that.
As an adventurer you mostly get paid for killing people. Sentients, humans. And sometimes they are not even evil, but just mercenaries or standing on the wrong side.
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YES. TOTALLY THIS.
Wisdom does almost nothing for Clerics so it can be a dump stat. If you do not use offensive spells (there are almost none on the cleric list), Wisdom is not really needed. And charisma is more important than ever for Clerics.
Hey, you do not even need to lose your domain pool, if you use 2 class feats to take a dip into Sorcerer (or Paladin); this makes your spell point pool depend on charisma instead of wisdom.
I have played different clerics about 7 times in the playtest.
As a optimal cleric I want Str = Cha > Con > Dex > Int = Wis and a D12 weapon.
I think the channel nerf makes a special kind of Clerics more attractive, which is viable, but very, very strange: Wis 12 Cha 18 Clerics.
If you do not want to lose your spell point pool, take two class feats into sorcerer multiclassing to make your spell point pool charisma-based.
This is possible because the caster stat does not really much for casting, if you do not cast offensivly.
Siro wrote: Wermut wrote:
I disagree the rule is, if the casters are burned out of spell slots the adventuring day ends
One caveat to that is only if you have a merciful DM. Some DM's when resources are running low (Spells, HP, Items, ect) will give opportunity and allow the party to rest up and regain. For example, if they decide to rest, the DM will forgo rolling any encounters for the night, or during a losing combat, will allow the party to escape without to much effort. Other DM's will not care, you decide to camp a little ways from the road to recover, lets roll to see if there are any bandits and what not coming around, you just blew your last spell in combat and want to rest, the Pit Fiend you were fighting will help with your eternal rest.
Sometimes {depending on DM and situation} you just do not have the opportunity to end the day.
Then we could use the pfs scenarios as guidelines. They have about 3-4 encounters, often on one single day.
With my pf2 caster I have 4 highest level spells and 4 second highest level spells. All other spells are mostly useless in combat / only useful for buffing my weapon attacks with something like True Strike/Magical Striker.
So I have 2 spells to use per combat, the rest is meh. So the only real choice, if you want to contribute, is to use a weapon. As fullcaster. Yes.
Adventure Paths tend do have way more combats per day, then the problem is even more worse.
Spellcasters are nerfed to the ground, and they lose an amount of class feats. It just makes things worse. I played a lvl 12 cleric, and I couldn't take the expert weapon proficieny of the fighter prestige class because of the less amount of feats. That was very painful.
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I was playing my soothsayer Paladin of Erecura (Queen of the second layer of hell), who got a special negative boon after he channeled Cthulhu once. This means, he has a 20% chance to get affected by a nightmare from the Great Beyond when he sleeps, together with having an evil aura while he is affected.
Our characters were on a long way through the savannah, together with a Pathfinder with quite a real nightmare. After its manifestation and our successful attempt to kill it, I rolled his % chance for the next three nights.
Yes. Of course. He has nightmares EVERY night after this.
We already spoke before that about I should try to let his nightmare fight against my nightmare. But now it became obvious that my Paladin in fact absorbed the other nightmare.
Well, this is just another way to defeat the evils, right...?
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Almost every single skill feat is a trap. Some of us in Doomsday Dawn started after a few games to not choose them anymore, because they have so good as no impact to the game (and it was so boring and tedious to select them). There are some worthwhile like the Intimidate Feats, but they are the exception.
Mark Seifter, please explain it to me like I am 5 years old. How do resistance and weakness work against a weapon which deals multiple types of damage (like a weapon with cold iron, fire, good, and another good damage point from the paladin)?
In the current system Clerics of Lamashtu who chose Positive Energy should never, never take Channel Smite. They can select it (and why not), but it is against their anathema to use it.
Channel Smite wrote: [...]
If you channel positive energy, this action has the good
and positive traits. If you channel negative energy, it has the
evil and negative traits.
Good wrote: Good effects often manipulate energy from good-aligned
Outer Planes and are anathema to evil divine servants or divine
servants of evil deities. [...]
I do not think this is intended. Especially if there will be more deities in the future; good deities who allow negative energy, and evil deities who allow positive energy.
Draco18s wrote: Agyra Eisenherz wrote: If you managed to build a weak Cleric... how? What was your weapon, what was your domain? Or did you try using cantrips or spells? What did you do in combat? Which class feats do you have?
Because as far as I could see, the Cleric is the strongest class, even without using channel energy. I played Clerics about 7 times in the playtest, and every single time I outdamaged everyone at the table.
Take a look for yourself:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/el4joxq23ytjmvf/pf2_doomsday_3.xls?dl=0
Every spell I used is marked off (because we never rested). I did use cantrips when I had the opportunity. Deity was Cayden Cailean (so favored weapon Rapier, which I had and used). Thanks! Now I understand some things better. I normally see only the far too optimized characters of my group.
If you like to deal more damage, you might wanna use a D12 weapon instead. The difference is huge, and you should be quite on par with the fighters.
Megistone wrote: I think that having the rules as they are allow for more variation, for example the dwarven feat that says -2 Resonance or other feats that increase it. I do not think it is a problem to write in a feat, that you can have two magic items more or less.
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If you use a +1 weapon instead of a +3 weapon on lvl 15, you deal less damage than with a Cantrip (which is already very bad).
If you use a +1 armor instead of a +3 armor, you use 2 points of Saves and AC. This means, you have likely 10% more chance to crit fail a saving throw, and your enemies have likely 10% more chance to crit you on a attack.
(This is not true against underleveled enemies, but you already have not to worry about them).
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After reading the Resonance Test, I am merely confused.
If I understand it correctly, you can summarize all of the Resonance + Investing rules with:
Set maximum amount of magic items = 10.
(+ a rule which prevents circumventing this number by switching magic items).
If it is so, keep it simple. Don't write complicated rules about Invest and RP, if it is just a complicated rules construct for a simple thing. If you want to mark items as magic items, just put them into the right chapter.
I would like to see this as a skill feat.
If you managed to build a weak Cleric... how? What was your weapon, what was your domain? Or did you try using cantrips or spells? What did you do in combat? Which class feats do you have?
Because as far as I could see, the Cleric is the strongest class, even without using channel energy. I played Clerics about 7 times in the playtest, and every single time I outdamaged everyone at the table.
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Definitely B, then C, then A
Without B all of the low level spell slots are pointless, and making useful partial casters is impossible.
Without C it is impossible to build a useful wizard, regardless if he is a buffer, a conjurer, a debuffer, a blaster or anything. The wizard in playtest who tried to be a fullcaster found himself useless, because his best damaging option deals as much damage as the twohanded weapon of anyone else (he was baffled from the fact that it is better to attack the enemy with a knife than with a cantrip).
Without A you cannot do it all day (which I am sort of okay with).
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Well, we really think it should be immune, because it makes definitely no sense for a lich to be drained.
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Gaterie wrote: PCScipio wrote: A bard can make a good frontline character if you take Fighter Dedication. You can still cast Inspire Courage and Shield while wielding your bastard sword two-handed. My Doomsday Dawn part 2 character took armor proficiency (heavy) and wore full plate (retrained for the 1.3 update). ... Or you could play a fighter with bard dedication. You can cast Shield and, starting from level 8, inspire courage, and you're an actual fighter with weapon mastery and everything.
Right now, I fail to see any compelling reason to play a bard past level 8. A Cleric with enough Cha to multiclass as bard is a solid build, and with a bit of system mastery I'm quite sure it's possible to make an efficient Rogue/Bard or even a Fighter/Bard.
And I think the Cleric/Bard and the Rogue/Bard feel more "bardy" than a straight Bard (the first one is a strong support character while the second one is very good at skills, especially social skills).
Actually I played a Bard/Cleric on lvl 7. I bought myself the proficiencies with heavy armor and martial weapons with my general and ancestry feats. With my class feats I took Weapon surge. I never took a single bard feat.
I could inspire courage and deal more damage than the fighter (Inspire Courage+True Strike+Weapon Surge)... I had to haste myself to give me all my buffs, using them for one mighty single strike. (+2 to attack, +1+one Die to damage, rolling the attack twice). Surely I used a D12 weapon, even if I couldn't cast many things without taking actions to take the grip again.
I first tried to build a caster bard, but the caster bard was underwhelming, in comparison to this.
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If these items are free from flavor restrictions, you can flavor them yourselves. Instead of having a paladin wearing a Demon's Mask for Intimidating (which is terrible, and the reason why my characters never bought one).
And all these little boni these items give additional - they are far too situational to even think about them.
The little bonusses in PF2 look like the PFS1 Boons. If you played a specific scenario, you now have a +1 Diplomacy bonus against Nagajis. Will I think on this bonus when we actually encounter Nagajis in half a year? This is why I tend to ignore situational bonusses almost completely.
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I second this.
I think this would help to simplify the skill items without taking anything important away (some not really fitting flavor), and it would remove some needless complexity. (Or can you explain why which skill items have which level? I cannot.) I propose to let the players flavor their skill items on their own.
So, as long as every player follows the rules and does not try to abuse this for doing evil stuff, and everyone has fun on the table, there is no reason why your character should not follow a deity of any alignment.
It is the duty of both the characters of good deities and evil deities, and for the characters of lawful deities and chaotic deities, to cooperate and tolerate (not accept, but tolerate) each other, at least for the time of one scenario. If you both have fun on interesting conflict roleplay, then so be it, otherwise it probably might be better to play it cool.
Personally I have seen more non-religious evil-lite characters than religious ones, I do not think this is really a matter of being religious or not.
B.
Quote: I also changed how the stat block appendix looks. Rather than including all of the stat blocks in the same section and alphabetizing them, I broke down the appendix by encounter area, starting each one on a different page. Each encounter area's appendix now prints all of the stat blocks—both the ones already appearing in the adventure as well as every stat block necessary for scaling the encounter for larger groups. That way you can find all of the creature statistics all in one place, flipping pages less often or just printing off the pages you need. Yes, please! And please write the orders for the adjustments also in the appendix. This is exactly how I prepare the combats of scenarios. I am only printing these stat blocks for running it, to have them before me, while I read the scenario on the laptop.
A D6+1 looks always underwhelming if someone else deals D12+3 or D12+4 damage per attack.
But you truly do not need to be optimized for the Playtest - because if you really optimize, everything becomes a cake walk (I played 7 times, with groups of semi-optimized or optimized characters, and the optimized runs were quite boring.)
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I prefer to build my own party, so this has no impact to my playthroughs.
Sure, you are right. Noone wields his holy symbol in his hands. This is just a bit of flavor - you actually can cast while holding holy books in your hands. But normally you just have a hand free or take emblazon symbol.
(If you retrain Emblazon Symbol, you cannot use it thereafter - this is a class feat, not an item. They might want to clarify this.)
I would like to have a clarification for which spells and powers are counting towards the multiple attack penalty. This confuses me. Spells and powers with the attack trait do definitely count.
I think spells which require an attack roll or a Strike might also count.
What about blasting spells without the attack trait?
As an example: Harm.
Does the one-action Harm count towards the penalty?
What about the two action or three action cast, which do not require attack rolls?
Could you explain to me why some spells have the attack trait and others have not? It feels quite random for me.
Ideally, in my opinion, every spell and power which counts for the MAP should have the attack trait.
I have fun with my LE Druid of Asmodeus. You might want to corrupt others, not your own flora and fauna.
PossibleCabbage wrote: So did Irrisen stop existing because there are no rules for witches yet? I wouldn't say that. But it definitely erased my Cult of LN Diabolists in Absalom which I builded up with several characters, and I will miss them. They are half secretive, and half accepted by the good churches, because their main focus lies in gaining more personal power by improving the society, for example by building sanctuaries for homeless children (with a subtle indoctrination). They are more belittled than accepted by the church of Asmodeus.
The Hell in Pathfinder is not exactly that what the Hell in our world is. I am just concerned that the restrictions on many deities could be based on real-world concepts, and not based on Golarion-based theological principles. I do not want the rules to contradict the lore.
If Dispater and Erecura could not have LN followers in PF2, that would just show this point.
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The restrictiveness had some weird follow-ups. I played an evil character against my will (Cleric of Asmodeus). Sometimes I enjoyed playing neutral with evil tendencies, but now I really learned to hate being forced to evil deeds.
I only play divine characters, because I find religious depths interesting, especially in the corner cases (like Dispater, who is beyond doubt the least evil Archdevil ). In PFS1 I played some LN Diabolists, and so I wanted to play some Diabolists in the Playtest.
I really do not like to play evil characters, but now I am forced to write the E on my character sheet. Being forced to evil deeds - not by the deity, not by religious causes, but by the rules - felt very, very bad.
There is no reason why Asmodeus would disallow corruptable followers to worship him. Sure, maybe their alignment will drift towards evil over time, but there is no need for every worshipper of an evil deity to be evil theirselves.
And what is with the Order of the Godclaw, are they disallowed now, because their system of worship is not possible under the current rules?
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I played a Druid and a negative Channeler on lvl 5, with as good as only Heal spells prepped. In both cases we had a positive cleric as well, and it was necessary. I bearly had enough healing for myself (fair enough, I played offensive and was tanking by sole healing, instead of using shield). In both scenarios I used up all my Heal spells (lvl 1,2,3) in one single combat. I had Battle Medic + Natural Medicine and a Wand of Heal lvl 1.
In one of these scenarios I even overspent Resonance for Healing.
So even if you cast only Heal spells as Druid, it is not enough Healing for your entire group - in my experience.
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Page 280: Cleric Archetype - Advanced Dogma.
Quote: Gain one cleric feat. For the purposes of meeting its prerequisites, your cleric level is equal to your actual level. In every other Archetype it is scaling "equal to half your level", so I believe the cleric should scale like them.
Page 283: Wizard Archetype - Expert Wizard Spellcasting
Quote: At 14th level, add two level 5 spells to your spellbook, and
you gain a level 5 spell slot that you can use to prepare a level 5
spell from your spellbook. At 8th level, add two level 6 spells
to your spellbook, and you gain a level 6 spell slot that you can
use to prepare a level 6 spell from your spellbook.
Like in the Cleric Archetype, it should not be at 8th level (this makes zero sense) but on 16th level.
I shall not allow others with questionable alignment auras possess me. My General of Vengeance, I let this only happen because I had to give my sword away, and I cannot fight such evil with bare hands. Forgive me for I felt I needed these claws and this power. Not profane strength but thine is the only thing I need.
A glance on the other holy symbol on her chest, an uncomfortable prickling on her back reminded her how other, evil deities saved her, when she was in mortal danger. The old female dwarf sighed, unsure following Ragathiel beeing the right path, when his father did more for her than he ever did. But for one moment, there was a smile in her scarred face. Pride about slaying this creature without a weapon.
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