Iron Gods for PF2E by DM Doctor Evil

Game Master DM DoctorEvil

Anri Cahir is a human Liberation Champion of Iomedae with the Insurgent background.

This looks like an approved concept to me. We may have to work out some of the details and simplify the backstory a bit (can't have been to experienced in insurgency and be level 1...) but we can work on that after the party is fully selected.

You may want to think or work with others to develop how the group has formed as well. I realize all ideas in that regard are merely exploratory at this point.

This is who i had in mind Bravestarr

And why i had the companion idea, so Inventor/Gunslinger type deal

I think if you want to make an Inventor, and the innovation is a mount perhaps with a projectile weapon, that may work at first level, but you will have to closely follow the invention/innovation rules and may not be what you want right out of the gate.

That said, based on the text, you will be spending a ton of time both IC and OOC working on your innovation, and the time spent as a "lawman" might suffer greatly. The Inventor class description basically says it takes all your time and attention to build and keep in working order.

Up to you if you want to proceed down this path, but there will be limitations and it already is borderline to me, though perhaps technically possible.

My concept is for a female elf barbarian, amnesiac, wielding a large axe and with some lingering magical abilities.

I am fine with this idea. And am fine with the Amnesiac background, if you want it. The story here can be quite interesting, but it may be best if you don't really know her past, and it comes back in GM-driven flashbacks in small bits and pieces. We may have to have some PM dialogue about how this works and how you want to see it play out.

I can see a whole arc about the exploration of your real backstory, if you want to go down that road eventually.

As I understand it, you will not have wizard spells or abilities out of the gate? But the ability to multiclass later?

When I say should with an asterisk because this AP happens in 4714 and the rules of PF2e Guns and Gears are at least from 4721 onwards. Up to the GM if Ustalav is already advanced enough to have inventors around. The same is true about gunslingers.

Numeria shares borders with Ustalav, so it isn't a stretch to have a character from there, even if between Ustalav and Torch we have Numerian Felldales, which I think is a fairly dangerous place. IMO, a construct from Ustalav would have an early steampunk vibe, while Numerian one would be more like something cobbled together with scrap parts.

From the setting, building constructs should not be trivial, otherwise we'd have them everywhere. Seems to me something that requires a lot of dedication and study. I'm having some trouble seeing such a smart inventor also being a lawman roaming around.

I agree with almost all of this post, as I expressed above.

I don't think we can get very hung up on the timeline for this game, since the PF1 APs are supposedly already played out canonically before the Age of Lost Omens begins, and PF2 is technically viable.

We may have to suspend disbelief a bit, and make the assumption that while some of the stories and known history may cause chronological paradoxes, we will have to assume the events in Numeria, at least, have not yet occurred. Placing our AP exactly on the timeline is, perhaps, not my intention. But we shall see how that hand-waving goes....

I will change and go back to drawing board

Ok, its late, and I am off to bed. More updates and commentary in tomorrow evening. Thanks for your interest! My brain is working on how to accommodate the interesting expressed so far.

I'll wait for SoT, since I have a strong preference for it.

So a current new idea.

White skinned orc. Druid with eventually going barbarian dedication. I'm thinking he was cursed. Travelling around being shunned by his own people, and feared/cautioned by everyone else

Sir Longears wrote:

My concept is for a female elf barbarian, amnesiac, wielding a large axe and with some lingering magical abilities.

I am fine with this idea. And am fine with the Amnesiac background, if you want it. The story here can be quite interesting, but it may be best if you don't really know her past, and it comes back in GM-driven flashbacks in small bits and pieces. We may have to have some PM dialogue about how this works and how you want to see it play out.

I can see a whole arc about the exploration of your real backstory, if you want to go down that road eventually.

As I understand it, you will not have wizard spells or abilities out of the gate? But the ability to multiclass later?

Hey! Great! I'm totally fine with me not really knowing her background prior to the attack. To be honest, I was hoping for this but did not want to assume so as it could be seen as me "cheating" my background just so I don't need to write one lol!

I'd leave the importance of her background to the plot to you. I don't have main character syndrome for sure and so do not want to detract from the plot or the experience for others. I'm ok with the stakes and revelations being personal and emotional only. Sometimes, trying to connect too many dots could leave the story feels cheaper with "too many coincidences". Up to you.

We can change this to PMs when/if you feel necessary, but I'd rather keep this at a minimum until you make your decisions as I do not want to be/feel privileged in any way.

About the multiclassing, the mentioned heritage would give me the first dedication feat from the beginning, so this would mean a spellbook (something partially ruined, as it would just have four cantrips) and the ability to prepare two cantrips. That is it in terms of abilities.

The wizard multiclass archetype is already converted to the new rules, while the Barbarian class has already been released but not updated online yet.

I could see her reading her spellbook over and over again as she lives with the barbarians as if it was also a diary and hoping to regain her memories. She could have understood the spells enough to cast them and this being the thing that unblocked the first flash of her memories and also filled her with fear. On the other hand, if you prefer for her to start not knowing how to cast the spells and delay these features, I'm also ok.

Let me know!

Alright... Think perhaps Baba Yaga patron would fit best, with an eventual Inventor Archetype, under the tutelage of Khonnir? That'd leave someone who a) doesn't have an animal familiar, leading to the credibility of being a bard, and b) has a reason to introject into any adventuring group as soon as it forms, once it's known they're going for Khonnir

Would that work? Could trade out the Witch patron for Resentment, but would lose some.flavor of a false Bard.

MothDad wrote:

Anri Cahir is a human Liberation Champion of Iomedae with the Insurgent background.

This looks like an approved concept to me. We may have to work out some of the details and simplify the backstory a bit (can't have been to experienced in insurgency and be level 1...) but we can work on that after the party is fully selected.

You may want to think or work with others to develop how the group has formed as well. I realize all ideas in that regard are merely exploratory at this point.

Yeah, the Insurgent background felt like the best fit for what I had in mind, but it is one of those ones that implies a level of experience that seems odd for a level one character. It could even be as simple as him publically being open about his wanting to take down the Technic League, but I'm open to ideas

Sir Longears wrote:

Ira kroll wrote:

I'm thinking a very traditional (almost stereotypical) halfling bard.

Mostly support for others, and occasional direct intervention (attack spells, picking locks, etc.)

Background:

Originally a slave in Cheliax. Was freed through the Emancipation in 4722. Now looking to free others -- or at least help them. Looking for a sibling who was sold by slavers and rumored to be in Numeria. A very excitable, distractible hafling. And, even for a bard, very absent-minded.

Unless the GM decides to alter things, the Iron Gods AP takes place in 4714. Not sure how easy it would be to alter the timeline.

I'll tell you, Ira is a heck of a story teller, I'm sure it can work one way or the other. Rome wasn't built in a day, Emancipation probably wasn't either. Like there was probably some badass abolitionist in 4714 who freed Linzi ... oh sorry, who freed the "very traditional halfling bard" and maybe even gave them clues to help find their sibling.

Fast forward to the end of Iron Gods, and it's actually 20th Level Linzi Kroll who comes back and frees all the slaves!!! I love this!

Well, since it is the PF2/Remaster, I just was thinking that the time was moved up also. Still, it is easily modified for the halfling bard to have been freed through the BellFlower network.

So a current new idea.

White skinned orc. Druid with eventually going barbarian dedication. I'm thinking he was cursed. Travelling around being shunned by his own people, and feared/cautioned by everyone else

I can see Bravestarr as a druid build. Wildform with eagle/puma/bear/wolf aspects. Howl of the wild has the wild mimic archetype, but I have only glanced at it. I understand that you have moved on from Bravestarr of course, but it doesn't diminish it as a starting point :)

Seth86 wrote:

So a current new idea.

White skinned orc. Druid with eventually going barbarian dedication. I'm thinking he was cursed. Travelling around being shunned by his own people, and feared/cautioned by everyone else

I can see Bravestarr as a druid build. Wildform with eagle/puma/bear/wolf aspects. Howl of the wild has the wild mimic archetype, but I have only glanced at it. I understand that you have moved on from Bravestarr of course, but it doesn't diminish it as a starting point :)

A white-skinned orc is a great image. :)

Thanks, yeah, the idea is great in my mind, but i also understand its not what our GM is aiming for

as for the orc, i think any animal he transform into will be the Albino equivalent of the species

Phase Two starting points
I will admit that giant green glowing sword held by a technic league captain in the Inner Sea World Guide is what drew me to Numeria in the first place. (then I learned about the space-crash and was hooked :).

I read the player's guide yesterday and two things caught my interest. The Numerian Archaeologist and the Starmetal Smith. Whatever ancestry and class I settle on will likely have this same backstory. With a large family in Torch, this story should be flexible enough to accommodate other backstories. I shall call her/him/them Phase Two Concept (they) for now.

Phasetwo is a Torch local with relatives working the famous forge. Phasetwo has not done any actual smithing themselves as the forge is dangerous and they have not yet (l-?) earned the minimum safe skill set.* However they have been exploring enough on family outings and has discovered their very own piece of fancy metal. Though it is only half the size of a coin, Phasetwo grew up imagining it will someday be a great sword. Or a fantastic amulet. Or a someone to help them stoke the forge because they really hates that and why learn it anyway when there is a magical forge right there? I mean right there!
Finding this scrap might have been the impetus to start their crafting training. As a kid they never had much focus. *Is it the lack of focus or the lack of intelligence or the lack of experience that they have not yet earned the skill set. Some of this will be determined the class & background choices, I am leaving room for character development here see?)

I won't lie, I'm glad to see so many others wanting to play casters. I've played plenty in the past, but being pretty new to pbp gaming I'm trying to stick with purely martial characters. I know the Champion I've suggested here has some magic, but it's not much and easier for me to track while I get into the swing of things.

Curaigh, are you thinking Phasetwo would invest in the Crafting skill as they level based on the background? And one possible connection there is my character having bought his equipment from your family. Obviously it isn't starmetal, but I can't imagine that everything made there is made with starmetal.

I usually play a melee build. So barring champion druid seemed like a good mix between support/frontline

I will start working on more details when the idea seems more plausible by our GM.

Being an outcast. And mostly a willing, I guess he could have easily fallen in tow with almost anyone heading there.

Tend to prefer martials, especially switch hitters. Decided to try a caster in PF2e, but needed something to tie an Occult caster to an Arcane one... hence the eventual Inventor Archetype.

Regarding my android cleric of Brigh, I have a more established backstory ready to go, their reason for arriving in Torch when they did is an effort to find out why the fire of Torch has gone out and help if they can.

As an apprentice blacksmith, cleric of Brigh and recently brought online Android, their inquisitive nature and newness to the world I think helps with them not being a "um, actually" type of character regarding the techology and what not. Base they start off knowing Androffan, but I am okay with not starting off with knowing it though, to help maintain some of the mystery.

But if you're pretty set on no androids, I can just as easily switch over to being an human apprentice cleric of brigh that lives in Torch and has received a vision from brigh to help uncover the mystery of the torch having gone out.

I made a bit of progress because of looking at details regarding the class

Ba'hahk. The White Orc Druid. Shunned and cast out from his tribe due to his unique looks and strange affinities. Wandering the wastelands alone. Fending for himself most of the time. Avoiding other settlements in fear of being hunted and killed. Made a connection with the very land he treads on. Feeling something call to him from deep below. He is currently seeking the answer to this draw and pull that is weighing on him

Hint: his companion at level 2 will be a metal elemental

I've been going around and around with concepts since I have so many I want to try. A few of the ones submitted are close to some that I came up with, which slowed me down some, but in a good way.

The idea that I have is a local resident of Torch, preferably an Amruun (catfolk), but I can go with other Ancestries, but not human since I play too many of them and want to explore more elements of Golarion.

The idea is kind of Western-themed, since Numeria is a badlands with no real law in much of it, which reminds me of the old west. She'd have a job in town, something normal, but when there was trouble, she'd be one of the people who would be asked to look into it.

Class wise, she'd be a precision ranger, preferably with a firearm, since that fits the concept best, but a crossbow would be workable. Probably with Crafting skills, and more Cha than you'd expect, as she would try to talk people down before trying violence.

@Codanous: I think an Andriod cleric of Brigh would be amazing.

Figured more things out for Karina:

She'd be under the tutelage of Khonnir Baine, and would presumably be one of the first town members to offer herself up for the job, even potentially without a reward offered.

If she needs a proper job in town other than working with Khonnir, I could see her working with the church of Brigh. Something akin to a Clockmaker in terms of profession, but not (yet) dealing with the animating magic that fuels these clockwork constructs.

As a result, I imagine she'd be pretty well acquainted with anyone associated with the local Church of Brigh? That, so far, would only include the Android Cleric and potentially NPCs.

I'll wait for SoT, since I have a strong preference for it.

I will remove you from consideration, thanks!

Alright... Think perhaps Baba Yaga patron would fit best, with an eventual Inventor Archetype, under the tutelage of Khonnir? That'd leave someone who a) doesn't have an animal familiar, leading to the credibility of being a bard, and b) has a reason to introject into any adventuring group as soon as it forms, once it's known they're going for Khonnir

Would that work? Could trade out the Witch patron for Resentment, but would lose some.flavor of a false Bard.

This looks like a sound concept. Why the fake bardness? Just to cover up from being exiled before?

also, if there are things the group doesn't need to know, you can either spoiler or PM them to me. Typically, I don't like having secrets from the get-go, but sometimes its needed.

I'm going to throw put some possible ideas for how different characters or the party as a whole may know each other just to give everyone some ideas to bounce off of.

My concept is a young kitsune (or if that's not allowed, human) woman from Goka in the western reaches of Tian Xia who prefers to fight with martial arts.

either a Monk or a Fighter with Martial Artist Dedication, with either the Barkeep or Servant backgrounds.

I would prefer this be human vs Kitsune, but won't tell you cannot. Be prepared to be looked at strangely in Avistan. Will you speak Common(Taldane) or will there be communication issues?

I've got two character ideas I'm kind of tooling with at the moment. An escaped Technic League android, either a magus or a wizard

A human metal kineticist,

I like both these ideas. Hard to see how we have more than one android in the party, but this is a good use of that ancestry given the setting. I like the idea of growing/learning while he gains experience.

The sort of anti-hero smith is also good for me. Having some ties to Torch can help anchor the other PCs also.

Perhaps you see how the rest of the group forms up before deciding fully.

First, no direction has been given by DM Doctor Evil on who out of Phase 1 is “successful” and so all of the conversations here attempting to build “a team” are essentially tilting at windmills

Now it may be the DMDE isn’t making any “cuts” and is taking into account both Phases and possibly another as yet undetermined Phase 3 (or 4 or 5 etc). All of which is to say that this seems at least to me to add *more* confusion to attempts to “achieve cohesion” rather than less.

Appreciate your perspective, but the group is doing just what I intended. If there were cuts from Phase 1, I would've made that clear. Given there are just 11 in Phase 2, I don't think its warranted at this point.

If there is confusion, please let me know, but throwing concepts out and seeing how they may work together is how I expected this to go, with a significant amount of back and forth. And as I said, this will be sandbox-ish, without clear cut rules.

There will be Phase 3, just to be clear.

Originally a slave in Cheliax. Was freed through the Emancipation in 4722. Now looking to free others -

Unless the GM decides to alter things, the Iron Gods AP takes place in 4714. Not sure how easy it would be to alter the timeline. [/QUOTE

Well, since it is the PF2/Remaster, I just was thinking that the time was moved up also. Still, it is easily modified for the halfling bard to have been freed through the BellFlower network.

Sorry the time thing is a bit of snag, but we can work through it. This idea is good with me, and we can just assume either some kind of insurgent emancipation (Andoran guerillas?) or an escape. Plenty of opportunity for freed slaves even before the changes in Cheliax, and might support the sibling sold to Numeria idea better. Just a thought.

White skinned orc. Druid with eventually going barbarian dedication.

as for the orc, i think any animal he transform into will be the Albino equivalent of the species

This seems like a fine idea to me. What makes him white-skinned? Is he true albino or just a strange mutation? Does that make him an outcast in his own society?

Do you mean full Orc? That may cause some acceptance issues in Torch just so you know. And why is he in Torch again?

The Numerian Archaeologist and the Starmetal Smith. Whatever ancestry and class I settle on will likely have this same backstory. With a large family in Torch, this story should be flexible enough to accommodate other backstories. I shall call her/him/them Phase Two Concept (they) for now.

PhaseTwo has some development left, but the idea is sound, and again there is some anchor points for other PCs since they are form Torch. Will be interesting to see how you finish the thoughts out.

The late night caught up with me again. Have a dinner meeting tomorrow evening, but will try to get the caught up on the rest of the posts, and perhaps give a summary of what we know about the potential PCs so far.

Appreciate the engagement, and thoughtful concepts. More to come!

Seth86 wrote:

White skinned orc. Druid with eventually going barbarian dedication.

as for the orc, i think any animal he transform into will be the Albino equivalent of the species

This seems like a fine idea to me. What makes him white-skinned? Is he true albino or just a strange mutation? Does that make him an outcast in his own society?

Do you mean full Orc? That may cause some acceptance issues in Torch just so you know. And why is he in Torch again?

Thanks so far. I did expand a bit more later in the thread.

Twilight Hunter wrote:

Alright... Think perhaps Baba Yaga patron would fit best, with an eventual Inventor Archetype, under the tutelage of Khonnir? That'd leave someone who a) doesn't have an animal familiar, leading to the credibility of being a bard, and b) has a reason to introject into any adventuring group as soon as it forms, once it's known they're going for Khonnir

Would that work? Could trade out the Witch patron for Resentment, but would lose some.flavor of a false Bard.

This looks like a sound concept. Why the fake bardness? Just to cover up from being exiled before?

also, if there are things the group doesn't need to know, you can either spoiler or PM them to me. Typically, I don't like having secrets from the get-go, but sometimes its needed.

Mhm, that's the major reason.

Out-of-character: it'll be fun to roleplay one class hiding as the other, haven't seen it done much.

In-character: She's extremely paranoid that she'll be kicked out for being a Witch, again.

As for things that'd be spoilered? I figure that it would be obvious to the players themselves from the get-go that she's a Witch due to the hexes. Figure I should be up-front about Karina being a Witch.

Would it be?

If someone doesn't know anything about magic, would a Hex look different from any other spell?

Bards cast spells. Karina posing as a Bard casts a spell. Why would it be automatically known that it was a witch spell?

I think the class posing as another class is a really fun-sounding concept.

Oh, I know that. It's the players who would find out straight out of the gate, the characters would presumably not know anything.
Even someone who knows about the spell traditions in-character wouldn't be able to tell: both are Occult!

i just realised i didnt answer one question our GM asked about my character:

Why is he in Torch?

So to expand on my more sketched out idea, what ever is calling him, the thing from the earth itself, has lead him to Torch, still reasons unknown to him why he has this feeling

I agree with Lia.

Since archetypes were introduced in 1e, the whole idea of "classes" started to erode. Using the hex as an example, while it started as a "witch thing", soon we had bard, cleric, inquisitor, magus, mesmerist, oracle, rogue, shaman, summoner, etc all with access to it.

It has reached the point that classes aren't a thing in game anymore, so IMO the characters won't really be able to notice it.

It would be different if you'd go for a more drastic ruse, like pretending to be a cleric or a non-caster.

The GM asked if there's anything I should ask in DMs, which there isn't because given the abilities, the players themselves would know that she's a witch. The characters very likely wouldn't, except barring maybe a Bard or a Witch who would know where the powers come from.

Like, the moment I bring up the Rimefrost Familiar ability out-of-character, you, the player, are going to be instantly aware that the character is a Witch.

i know in 1e you had a razmerian priest that was a sorcerer that disguised their spells to be divine

Based it off of the False Priest from 1e, actually! Clerics pretending to be Alchemists and Witches in places like Rahadoum. This is an easier job, though.

And as for how you'd have known her, as opposed to just her joining literally any party that'd save Khonnir? She'd probably be known as a local performer around Torch, owing to the whole Bard disguise.

And as for how you'd have known her, as opposed to just her joining literally any party that'd save Khonnir? She'd probably be known as a local performer around Torch, owing to the whole Bard disguise.

Oh, that's really good. Especially considering many performers are also going to be sociable and open to talking with others, it is very likely the other party members would have, at the very least, seen her around town and listened to a performance if not outright had a conversation with her. I can imagine some wanting to discuss specific songs or stories or even just asking to hear a specific song.

i just realised i didnt answer one question our GM asked about my character:

Why is he in Torch?

So to expand on my more sketched out idea, what ever is calling him, the thing from the earth itself, has lead him to Torch, still reasons unknown to him why he has this feeling

I've always liked the idea of characters being drawn to a place but not understanding why. It can play out in so many different ways and they are all good. Is something calling him specifically? Are the threads of fate pushing him to go there? Is it a general call and there are others who feel it as well? Only the GM knows, and that's fun!

Hidden Priest, not false Priest. Wrong name, curse you Razmir. And thanks for the complement, MothDad. Could definitely see people having met the somewhat-outgoing Witch Bard (Cha +2, probably?), and maybe recognizing her from her performances at local taverns.

She probably wouldn't try to make a living off of being a performer, though, so she'd probably only be known about in Torch.

Supreveio wrote:

My concept is a young kitsune (or if that's not allowed, human) woman from Goka in the western reaches of Tian Xia who prefers to fight with martial arts.

either a Monk or a Fighter with Martial Artist Dedication, with either the Barkeep or Servant backgrounds.

I would prefer this be human vs Kitsune, but won't tell you cannot. Be prepared to be looked at strangely in Avistan. Will you speak Common(Taldane) or will there be communication issues?

As someone who grew up in an inn in a port city, I feel like she'd have plenty of opportunity to learn Taldane since they'd likely serve merchants and sailors from Avistan.

And the heritage I'd plan to take if I go with kitsune would be one that has a humanoid alternate form. So if she needs to lay low, she can disguise herself.

I think I'll wait on the Strength of Thousands before creating a concept. Got several ideas in mind.

I think I'll wait on the Strength of Thousands before creating a concept. Got several ideas in mind.

thanks Scranford. Will see you over there later

The idea that I have is a local resident of Torch, preferably an Amruun (catfolk),

The idea is kind of Western-themed, since Numeria is a badlands with no real law in much of it, which reminds me of the old west. She'd have a job in town, something normal, but when there was trouble, she'd be one of the people who would be asked to look into it.

Class wise, she'd be a precision ranger, preferably with a firearm, since that fits the concept best, but a crossbow would be workable. Probably with Crafting skills, and more Cha than you'd expect, as she would try to talk people down before trying violence.

I think you may have to start out without a firearm, but who knows what you will find along the way? I'd lean against a catfolk character, but will allow you to present it if you wish.

Here are the players and concepts all in one tidy post for your review. If I have misrepresented something about your thoughts, please let me know.

Sir Longears - female elf barbarian, amnesiac, perhaps was a wizard?

Seth86- white-skinned orc druid, drawn to something in the ground around Torch

Lia Wynn - precision ranger from Torch; maybe a firearm, maybe a catfolk; perhaps a little western flavor

Supreveio - Tian Xia monk runaway

Twilight Hunter - bard, no a witch. Exile on the run

Moth Dad - liberation champion of Iomedae; slave freer

Ira Kroll - halfling bard, former Chelish slave; looking for a missing sibling in Torch

Codanous- android cleric of Brigh; curious about synthetic spirituality

Ollie Twist 1) android wizard pilfering spell knowledge or 2) smith from Torch who is metal kineticist

Curaigh - PhaseTwo maybe Starmetal Smith; maybe Archeologist. no class selected so far, but has something burning a hole in their pocket

There are only 10 players left in the running for now, and most have the start of a concept together or are working towards it. Given those facts, i would like to close Phase 2 (not PhaseTwo) tomorrow night. Please tell m if you need more time to proceed comfortably.

Phase 3 (I think there will be 4 phases) will be writing samples in character with some ability to work together as a group and play off each other. It won't be long, but should help flesh out who your PCs are, and how they might (or might not) work together. Spend some time think about your concept - their mannerisms, voice (not speaking voice per se), alignment (even if no longer a direct game concept) and values. These may be tested during the scenario I put in front of you.

If all goes well, we may be done by the end of the weekend, and ready to empanel our set of heroes.