Kisarta: Adventures Beyond Death (Inactive)

Game Master Seer of Shadows


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"It is a universal truth that all things must one day die and there are no exceptions; heroes, gods, and even the planes and stars themselves will all eventually pass from life into whatever existence lies beyond the veil. Universal though the existence of death is, the details of what comes after can differ drastically from cosmology to cosmology; the dead of Golarion begin their path through the River of Souls towards whatever fate awaits them, while those of the scorched world of Athas go to linger within the endless purgatory of The Gray. To those unfortunates who are born into these eternal cycles, living only to die, this is the natural order of things and few would expect anything different when they finally breathe their last.

But every system has it's flaws and the ever-flowing cycles of life, death, and souls are no exception. Sometimes, a soul becomes lost on the journey to it's final fate and drifts beyond the bounds of the cosmos. Other times it is shattered by forbidden magic or ravenous fiends and it's fragments vanish to parts unknown. And, as practitioners of pact magic would tell you, on very rare occasions a soul is cast out from, or rejected by, reality itself. In all of these circumstances, a lost soul will inevitably reconstitute a physical form from the aether and awaken within a realm beyond the bounds and borders of every multiverse: Kisarta."

- Ahman the Exiled, Scholar of Kisarta

Welcome, one and all, to a tale of life after death within the wondrous and terrible world of Kisarta.

The name Kisarta refers to both the Pale Sun and the eight infinite planes called the Dominions which revolve around it. Within this world, ruled by a group of beings known as the Black Circle whose power rivals that of the gods themselves, lost souls from the infinite cosmologies are given a second chance with reconstituted bodies of aether that mimic their mortal forms. It is in this world that your characters have found themselves and their new life will begin as countless others have before them: waking from their own graves in the Cemetery of Lost Souls, memories of their death still fresh on their minds.

Kisarta is a setting that allows characters to be from any cosmology or age within that cosmology. You could play a wizard from Netheril, a gladiator from Tyr, or nearly anything else. Almost any character can be rationalized in Kisarta. You were a mythic hero in Golarion? Your death and the rough transition to Kisarta stripped you of most of your power. Want to play as the ruler of a powerful kingdom whose treasury could have bought an entire world? None of that came with you in death and so there's no cause for me to deny that on grounds of party balance. Because Kisarta is completely disconnected from the spacetime of other cosmologies, you could even play as a character from a potential future that has yet to take place within your world's timeline.

Players do not need access to the setting to be able to play in this game. I have specifically designed the beginning of the game so that players do not need the books to formulate a character. They can learn about the setting organically alongside their characters as they explore the world. It should go without saying that I'm not arguing against those who want to buy the books, it's just not a necessity that they do.

Character Creation:
Allowances for First and Third Party Material and Fan Conversions: All first-party Paizo content is allowed without exceptions. Characters with a class that has both chained and unchained variants may select from either one.

All third-party content must be requested separately by listing the content's name, the name of the book it can be found in, and the exact page number it is located- or a simple link to the requested content in a legal SRD source like d20PFSRD or the Spheres of Power Wiki- in order to be considered. A single appeal can be made in the event that I do not rule in favor of a request.

Pathfinder fan conversions of content for Dark Sun, Eberron, and other campaign settings count as third-party content for the purposes of this game and are subject to the same clearance process.

3.X, PF2e, and any other content outside of Pathfinder 1e will not be allowed under any circumstances.

Level: PCs will awaken as 8th-level gestalt characters, irrespective of their power in life.

Ability Scores: Point buy (25 points). Following the point buy, choose one ability score as your primary stat and two others as your secondary stats; primary stats gain a +4 untyped bonus and secondary stats gain a +2 untyped bonus. No score may be above 26 or below 07. Point buys can be anathema a number of gestalt builds. The untyped bonuses are my way to alleviate this problem while also giving those with tighter and more streamlined builds something extra. I have wanted to use this for some time since I was first clued in to the idea and have only had cause to use in this game.

Races: All first-party races are allowed; third-party races are subject to the clearance process. I will not allow custom races or the addition of RP to existing races.

Classes: All first-party classes are allowed; third-party classes are subject to the clearance process.

Hit Points: Maximum plus one per HD; PCs apply either their CON or CHA modifier to their HP, whichever is higher. Charisma is the black sheep of the ability scores and doesn't provide a lot of benefit outside of social builds or those who have it as a casting stat. The idea of a person pushing through damage with nothing but the sheer force of will is an appealing one and helps provide some small bonus to CHA-dependent builds. This option does not invalidate CON since it still provides important bonuses to fortitude saves.

Traits: Two; a third cannot be obtained by taking a drawback. Not every drawback would make sense in Kisarta.

Alignment: Players can choose from any of the nine alignments. Evil characters must be team players and avoid falling into outright villain tropes during the campaign. Waking from death into a world that defies all that someone has been told about the afterlife has a way of changing people. Heroes may sour and harden into Byronic figures or outright antiheroes. Villains may see the error of their ways and begin the long and arduous climb out of damnation. Banning certain alignments would prevent the exploration of these rich and heady themes and I will not allow that.

Starting Gear/Wealth: Characters awaken on Kisarta with 33,000 GP worth of gear that replicates what they possessed in life to some degree; no one item may have a value above 13,200 GP. Any leftover gold will be near-useless in this campaign.

Crafting: Crafting is possible in this campaign, but you do not possess any pre-crafted gear at the game's start.

Class Companions: Companions granted a class feature or archetype are assumed to make the journey with their bonded PC due to the nature of their link surviving death itself. Kisarta's complete disconnection from the normal time-space of the infinite multiverses means the exact order your character and their companions died do not matter and they both arrive at nearly the same time.

Feats: Feats are gained every level rather than every other level.

Leadership, Cohorts, and Followers: Unlike class companions, cohorts and followers gained by the Leadership feat do not make the journey to Kisarta with the PCs. You may take Leadership at a later level, but only once PCs have made a sufficient name for themselves and that is going to require exceptional accomplishments in a world like Kisarta. This rule is in place because there are certain ways to get Leadership earlier than normal and being popular enough to attract a cadre of devoted followers as soon as you awaken is something I can't accept.

Monster PCs and Templates: I'm going to rule against both of those. The 'no monster PCs' rule is only referring to monsters that are primarily represented by CR and doesn't apply to monstrous racial classes like those in Rite Publishing's In the Company of Monsters series.

House Rules: Background Skills, Elephant in the Room Feat Tax, Fractional Base Bonuses, Psionic-Magic Transparency, and Stamina and Combat Tricks.

Description: Every submission must include details on your character's appearance and personality. These do not need to be elaborate or exhaustive, but they must be more detailed than "Krogan Armripper is a muscular orc with long black hair and a surly personality".

Background: There are three essential components to a character's background that will need to be included in their profile. The first is simply listing where they are from, including the region and world's names (e.g. Golarion's Katapesh region or Eberron's Sarlona region). The second is a generalized history of their days and deeds among the living that establishes them as a character, even if you do not intend for them to remember any of it. And the final component is a description of their death and their final thoughts as they exited the mortal coil. If you want to add more details than this, you are more than welcome to, but it is not required.

Game Details:
Application Deadline: The plan, which may be subject to change, is for the recruitment to be open five weeks. There are a lot of moving parts to the game and I understand that people have lives outside of internet. In the event that there are are a number of incomplete applications around the deadline, I will consider extending the deadline. Conversely, I may close the thread up to a week early if everyone has finished their application by that time.

Campaign Style: This campaign was designed from it's inception to be a semi-sandbox experience. From the moment players awaken and climb from their graves in the Cemetery of Lost Souls, they can follow whatever goals they so choose. I as the GM will provide plot hooks, but it is up to the PCs whether they choose to bite them or not. The "semi-" part of semi-sandbox comes into play because I want the party to stick together throughout most of this campaign. Exploration and discovery will no doubt a larger role in the campaign than combat, although there will likely be plenty of that as well.

Post Rates: A post a day would, in a perfect world where everything went off without a hitch, be ideal. Reality does not always work that way and so my expectation is for everyone to make five-plus posts a week. That should account for the random happenstance that occurs in people's daily lives. Advance warning for prolonged absences would be appreciated and I am willing to pilot someone's character for them temporarily. I will take temporary control of any character whose owner neither posts nor communicates for a five days. After a month of piloting characters whose owners have not communicated in any fashion, measures will be taken to phase them out of the plot in as organically as possible and recruit a replacement.

Encounters: I will strive to ensure that both combat and social encounters will provide a challenging, but ultimately fair experience. Exceptions exist and characters who overreach in exceedingly foolish ways may get to experience Kisarta's unique resurrection effect in short order.

Initiative, Perception, and Sense Motive Rolls: I as the GM will roll each of these for PCs as necessary.

Knowledge Skills: There are two very important things to note about Knowledge skills. The first is that Knowledge skills will not yield ANY results about Kisarta-specific topics unless a PC can acquire tomes in-game or they have spent sufficient time within the Dominions. Because Kisarta exists outside the bounds of the infinite cosmologies, it is impossible for a freshly-awakened soul to have acquired any of that knowledge. The second is that DCs to learn about things from other cosmologies- such as a wizard from Golarion rolling a Knowledge: Arcana check to learn about a magic item with Athasian origins or a druid from Eberron rolling Knowledge: Nature to learn about a fey creature unique to Faerun- will be higher than normal.

PC Selections: Four characters will be picked to participate in the campaign. I have no objective criteria that I use to judge PCs and what works in favor for one might not work in favor for another.

General Setting Details:
Bodies on Kisarta: Nearly every soul on Kisarta has a body formed of solid aether that appears identical to the one it possessed in life, both in form and function. This means that many of the normal rules of life also apply in Kisarta: most beings must eat, drink, sleep, and breathe to sustain their vital functions.

Commerce:Traditional currencies are generally only accepted by craftsman who desire their component metals or eccentric collectors, as condensed aether powder, aether shards, or the minted aether coins are the tender of the realm. Barter is an acceptable form of trade as well and some of the more exotic vendors within the Shadow Markets will only accept the most esoteric forms of tender.

Language: While the root cause is unknown, all beings on Kisarta mentally interpret spoken words in their native language regardless of the language actually being spoken, even though the words themselves may still sound foreign to their ears. This universal understanding does not apply to the written word, nor to the ancient language occasionally spoken by the Black Circle and Kisarta's oldest inhabitants.

Death on Kisarta: Death is not the end within Kisarta's Dominions. A being's form will gradually dissipate into the aether upon death before reforming elsewhere, usually somewhere that holds some significance to them. Each death damages their soul somewhat and they lose both a portion of their memories and their very essence (called Soul Points for game purposes). Those who die enough times will find that their soul shatters, turning them into an undead. Most of these unfortunates are weak beings known as the Hollowed and are one more death away from the complete oblivion of the True Death. Some of the most exceptional individuals whose souls shatter under the strain of their repeated deaths instead regain pieces of their former selves and become malicious undead of great power, such as dread vampires or devourers. Suffice it to say, death is not cheap in this world and it will always cost you more than you are willing to pay. Divine casters with access to Breath of Life will be a godsend, as this spell will halt the dissolution process and provide it's normal effects.

Brief Descriptions of the Eight Dominions (spoilers):
Limbo: Limbo is the first Dominion most souls experience as they awaken within the Cemetery of Lost Souls. The Dominion and the City of the Dead that spans nearly the entirety of it are both referred to by the same name and they collectively house the largest concentration of Kisarta's population within countless buildings, avenues, and parks. Cultures from a million disparate cosmologies exist incongruously alongside each other in the City of the Dead and form a strange tableau of beliefs, celebrations, and customs. The nigh-infinite city is the hub of Kisarta and palace-sized gates to each of the other seven Dominions, as well as numerous pocket realms, can be found throughout. Limbo has no Guardian and is instead ruled by the lords of Kisarta known as the Black Circle, who see all from within the Alabaster Tower that rises miles above the city.

The Howling Forest: If Limbo can be seen as a deathly reflection of civilization, then the Howling Woods are death's reflection of nature. Breathtakingly beautiful and terrifying scenes of natural splendor sprawl throughout this plane beneath the twin lights of the Pale Sun and the ever-full moon: dark forests, fetid mires, misty moors, frozen taigas, steaming jungles, and towering mountain ranges largely untouched by mortal hands can all be found here. The kingdom of the knight-queen Rowena was founded here eons ago and it's citizens must compete with the realm's unnaturally cunning predators and bloodthirsty nature spirits for survival. Yuul the Primal Fear, a primordial spirit of bramble and bone birthed from nature's dark heart and the nightmares of mortals, is the Guardian of this realm and wishes nothing more than to observe the weak being culled by the cycle of predator and prey's endless savagery.

The Ocean of Souls: Unfathomably deep seas, whose benighted waters lap melancholically at the shores of stony islands and sheer cliffs, comprise the Dominion known as the Ocean of Souls. Life in of the island-bound communities within the Ocean of Souls, at least on the surface, is unusually sedate and peaceful compared to that found in other Dominions. But arcane secrets and forbidden truths as deep and dark as the sea itself lie submerged beneath the placid waves and Grecian athenaeums, guarded by slumbering antediluvian horrors of a lost age that creation itself strives to forget. Lyriash the Mistress of the Motionless Tides is the beautiful Guardian of this Dominion and her tempestuous once-human heart has been claimed by the tides of a depthless melancholy that mirrors her sleepy domain.

The Nameless Abyss: The Nameless Abyss is an infinite void dotted with expansive floating islands, each of which house strange and wondrous creatures, magic, and technology from a million worlds. It's most distant reaches are filled with twinkling false stars formed from the last remains of dead gods from the infinite multiverses. Abandoned kingdoms and futuristic arcologies of great import, ruined temples that house the relics of long-dead gods, and the realm's innumerable eldritch anomalies are all sought after by those seeking adventure. Explorers and pirates alike sail the starry void with vessels of living wood that fly on sails of magic or, more rarely, interstellar starships that are piloted by ensouled AIs. Ylluvethar the Eternal, the Guardian of this land, is a dispassionate being of living energy and cosmic might who largely ignores his realm and it's inhabitants in favor of divining the unfathomable secrets of creation itself from the false stars of lost divinities.

The Whispering Desert: The endless sands of the Whispering Desert house deceptive splendors, seductive mysteries, and treacherous beauty. The gleaming, bejeweled cities that rise from the trackless desert house some of the most cultured and sophisticated souls in all of Kisarta and the countless bazaars and souks to be found here hold treasures that rival even those found in Limbo's Shadow Markets. Half-buried ruins resplendent with the glories and treasures of forgotten ages dot the landscape and the waters of the realm's shimmering oases faintly reflect the arcane runes that flow over the surface of the illusory sun. Few things in this Dominion are as they initially appear, however, and even the most innocuous of objects and creatures conceal hidden dangers. Mal-Val'ahm the Keeper of a Hundred Misleading Truths is the Guardian of this land and she weaves plots and intrigues like a massive draconic spider, entangling all within webs of deceit and intrigue.

The Radiant Citadel: The Dominion known as the Radiant Citadel does not seem like it belongs in Kisarta at first glance. Lush valleys and gentle streams sweep through ranges of majestic mountains. Idyllic cities nestled within this elysian land are lit by the golden light of a false sun and law-abiding citizens support the causes of order, light, and righteousness espoused by the Guardian. But a shadow creeps throughout this radiant Dominion and servants of an ancient darkness known as The Old One hide in places where the false sun's golden rays do not reach. Cyrthiur the Shadowless Light is Guardian of this realm and his merciless purity suffers no darkness to dwell within his Dominion, purging all that is deemed corrupt with faith, flame, and the sword.

The Crucible of the Damned: The Crucible of the Damned is a place of incomprehensible desolation, suffering, and damnation. The land is perpectually trapped within the upheaval of a never-ending apocalypse and it's blasted wastes, burning mountains, and lakes of bitter acid lie beneath a perpetually storm-darkened sky that shrouds the light of the Pale Sun. Resources are near-nonexistent and souls who find themselves within this land of eternal torment suffer the ceaseless cruelties of Kisarti fiends, warlords, and the Dominion itself until their very being shatters in this hell of hells. Malphaas the Ruiner of Realities is the infernal Guardian of the Crucible and every torment inflicted, every life destroyed, and every soul ruined beyond repair brings a sliver of dark joy to his empty heart.

The Pit of Eternity: While particularly brave souls may choose to throw themselves at the Crucible of the Damned for glory or justice, few ever journey to the Dominion known as the Pit of Eternity by choice. The realm is a maddening maze of underground tunnels, noxious bogs, fungal jungles, and ramshackle stalactite cities that all lead ever downwards into the Pit. An underlying decay suffuses every inch of this terrible place and seeps into the minds, bodies, and souls of those who have the misfortune of living here. Disease, mutation, madness, cannibalism, and corruption are common sights and grow ever more prevalent the further down one goes. No one has ever seen the Pit's Guardian, The Devourer, although it's whispers sometimes haunt the fevered dreams of the diseased, mad, and utterly depraved, promising tantalizing horrors and blasphemous decadences to those who seek it out down below... always just a little further down below in the eternal darkness.

Pronunciation Guide:
Kisarta: Kiss-arr-tuh
Yuul: Yoo-ull
Ylluvethar: Ill-oo-veh-tar
Mal-Val'ahm: Mal-vale-aam
Lyriash: Leer-ee-ash
Cyrthiur: Surth-ee-ur
Malphaas: Mal-fass


Dotting, will get details posted tomorrow :)


Quick gearing question. What are your thoughts on Automatic Bonus Progression (basic rule adjustments are half wealth per level but starting on level 3, you get innate/attunement numerical bonuses to weapons/armor/stats - so that you don't have everybody wearing a Cloak of Resistance + Stat-boosting item + Ring of Protection + Amulet of Natural Armor + etc).

Also, when is recruitment closing and when do you want to kick off the game?


Arrived here. This evening will build character.


Oooh, this sounds super interesting! Will need to give some serious thought to my concept!


I'll come up with something.


doot doot


Would it be okay to recreate a character from a CRPG? I would love to take my Watcher from Pillars of Eternity on new adventures.


Ere we go, lets actually level my wotr character up!

Liberty's Edge

Ever_Anon wrote:
Would it be okay to recreate a character from a CRPG? I would love to take my Watcher from Pillars of Eternity on new adventures.

Oooh this is a great idea!


I will work on this over the coming weekend. This should be interesting, some rules I've never tried out!


Instant questions from going through my current ideas:

Note, build rules are extremely generous, feel free to nope anything!

1: ABP would make a sizeable difference for one build, as it would make a belt of mighty hurling lesser be under the 13.2K gold cap for a single item.

2: Is it allowed to dip on either side of the Gestalt? For example by being a bard 8 on one side, and a gunslinger 7 Swashbuckler 1 on the other? (I am kind of trying to build not-Ciaphas-Cain)

Liberty's Edge

Would the Barfighter archetype Striker class from Spheres of Power be allowed?


GrinningJest3r wrote:
Quick gearing question. What are your thoughts on Automatic Bonus Progression (basic rule adjustments are half wealth per level but starting on level 3, you get innate/attunement numerical bonuses to weapons/armor/stats - so that you don't have everybody wearing a Cloak of Resistance + Stat-boosting item + Ring of Protection + Amulet of Natural Armor + etc).
Mightypion wrote:
1: ABP would make a sizeable difference for one build, as it would make a belt of mighty hurling lesser be under the 13.2K gold cap for a single item.

It would seem Automatic Bonus Progression slipped my mind. Players may take it as an option, should they so choose.

GrinningJest3r wrote:
Also, when is recruitment closing and when do you want to kick off the game?

The current plan, as noted in the Application Deadline section from the Game Details spoiler, is to have recruitment open for five weeks from yesterday. I'm willing to shorten or lengthen that period depending on how quickly people finish their applications. That makes May 15th the cutoff period as it currently stands.

The game will kick off after selections are made.

Ever_Anon wrote:
Would it be okay to recreate a character from a CRPG? I would love to take my Watcher from Pillars of Eternity on new adventures.

That is perfectly acceptable. It should prove interesting to see how the Watcher reacts once beyond the Wheel, especially if one takes into account the second game's ending.

Mightypion wrote:
2: Is it allowed to dip on either side of the Gestalt? For example by being a bard 8 on one side, and a gunslinger 7 Swashbuckler 1 on the other? (I am kind of trying to build not-Ciaphas-Cain)

Multiclassing on either side of the gestalt is permitted. Just be sure to take notes on what dips were taken at what levels to make deconstructing your character easier.

Crisischild wrote:
Would the Barfighter archetype Striker class from Spheres of Power be allowed?

Consider Striker and Barfighter cleared for use.


Would the clever godling or mighty godling classes from Rogue Genius Games be allowed?


TheWaskally wrote:
Would the clever godling or mighty godling classes from Rogue Genius Games be allowed?

Consider those cleared for use.


Can I just say Aroden being a sword and board wizard is very annoying to actually make work?


How will characters (such as clerics) who get their powers from divine/other worldly beings that do not exist in this world work?


TarkXT wrote:
Can I just say Aroden being a sword and board wizard is very annoying to actually make work?

It's never easy trying to translate an icon into a PC.

Liberty's Edge

TarkXT wrote:
Can I just say Aroden being a sword and board wizard is very annoying to actually make work?

What's holdin' ya back?


Crisischild wrote:
TarkXT wrote:
Can I just say Aroden being a sword and board wizard is very annoying to actually make work?
What's holdin' ya back?

Needing three hands.

Liberty's Edge

TarkXT wrote:
Needing three hands.

Indeed. What about a buckler with Unhindering Shield and you just pretend the buckler is a regular shield?


Aroden's Spellsword

It doesn't work for wands, but it's so fitting because it's your feckin' spell.


So I'm torn between two similar ideas and can't pick one. Anyone familiar with Pillars of Eternity want to take a look and put in your two cents?

Minor Pillars of Eternity Spoilers:
My Watcher was a Orlan Cipher who fought from range and did more shooting than casting. I've decided the best way to represent this is a hairier-than-usual Halfling Slayer/Spiritualist, which brings ranged combat, 2/3 psychic casting and the general speaks-with-dead-people shtick.

What I can't decide is between regular Spiritualist (Wisdom based, has a specific person as their phantom) and Fractured Mind (Charisma based, their phantom is a part of their own souls).

Regular Spiritualist: The Watcher dies at the same time as Edér. She drags his soul to Kisarta with her but he can't fully reform and becomes a phantom with the Kindness emotional focus. Pros: I get to continue adventuring with my boy. Cons: He has to die for that to happen.

Fractured Mind: The Watcher dies alone. When she wakes in Kisarta she finds the negative emotions she's shoved down for years have taken on a life of their own. I'd pick the Despair emotional focus and have the phantom mostly look like Maerwald ("No sleep for the Watcher") but occasionally Iovara, Thaos, or anyone else that seems appropriate. Pros: Charisma is a much better fit for how I played my Watcher than Wisdom. Cons: The Fractured Mind archetype loses most of the Spiritualist's Watcher-like abilities, (aka detect undead, calm spirit, see invisibility, and call spirit).

They both seem like a lot of fun to roleplay around. Any thoughts?


This sounds like an interesting setting.

Is there any guidance on what vague character archetypes and abilities might be particularly appropriate or inappropriate?

Eg. in some settings a "White Necromancer" is not thematically appropriate because necromancy is always evil. Mechanically, in some campaigns, enchanters and illusionists just do not work because the majority of enemies will be immune to their tricks.

So basically, any lore or mechanical pitfalls like that to watch out for? I guess this also goes for the "what favored Enemies should a Ranger pick" question for this campaign, though I don't plan to play a Ranger.


The beginnings of filling out the profile for submission.


Gah. I hate asking for exceptions. But I'm going to do it here since my build is almost complete and there is a simple and elegant (though technically illegal) solution. Hence, the 'exception'.

I'm dusting off a beloved character and one of his classes is uMonk. There are two archetypes that really fit his build like a glove: Scaled Fist and Perfect Scholar. They conflict on only one point, they both sacrifice Still Mind for other abilities (Draconic Mettle and Lore respectively).

Would you allow me to take both archetypes, lose Still Mind (naturally), and sacrifice Draconic Mettle while keeping Lore instead?


Oh, I’m super intrigued by this…

I’m going to spend some time thinking about character concepts (since we have time), but I’ll definitely put something together. All the talk about aether has me thinking about an aetherkineticist, but I made a godling one time that I was really excited about and never got to play, so maybe I’ll look at that again?

Edit: are the adept or eldritch godlings allowed too or just clever and mighty?


Veegees wrote:
How will characters (such as clerics) who get their powers from divine/other worldly beings that do not exist in this world work?

Divine casters receive their powers through an as yet undiscovered proxy, although their patron's absence is still felt. Kisarta has it's own unique faiths that many former agents of the divine adopt to fill in the emotional void.

Ever_Anon wrote:
They both seem like a lot of fun to roleplay around. Any thoughts?

Both of them have enough merits where I too am unsure of which I prefer. Perhaps you should examine the tone you want to set for your character? Do you want a game that begins rather grimly, where the Watcher's closest companion is nothing more than the darkest parts of their psyche given shape by their powers run amok? Or would you prefer a more bittersweet beginning, where the Watcher at least has the familiar comfort of her companion?

Storm Dragon wrote:

Is there any guidance on what vague character archetypes and abilities might be particularly appropriate or inappropriate?

...

So basically, any lore or mechanical pitfalls like that to watch out for? I guess this also goes for the "what favored Enemies should a Ranger pick" question for this campaign, though I don't plan to play a Ranger.

Not particularly. Nearly any concept could be made interesting within the confines of Kisarta's setting and, due to this campaign's nature as a semi-sandbox and the breadth of potential encounters within the eight Dominions, almost any ability or specialization could be consistently useful.

stormraven wrote:
Would you allow me to take both archetypes, lose Still Mind (naturally), and sacrifice Draconic Mettle while keeping Lore instead?

Here is my proposal: players may ignore one, and only one, instance of ability replacement by an archetype. The price for this is either one feat for majority of these potential replacements or three when it concerns those that would replace one of a class's primary abilities (e.g. an Alchemist's Bomb or a Paladin's Smite Evil).

That may sound incredibly generous on my part and it probably is when the extra feat progression everyone receives is taken into account. But that is the concession I am willing to make so that players can avoid having entire builds being invalidated due to a tiny incompatibility in archetype overlap.

Giant Halfling wrote:
Edit: are the adept or eldritch godlings allowed too or just clever and mighty?

Adept and Eldritch Godlings are cleared for use, albeit with a caveat: certain options they are able to take need nerfs and those will need to be cleared individually despite being part of the class itself. Those options may be cleared, nerfed, or denied. Most are not particularly problematic, but a handful are nightmares to design encounters around.


So I was thinking on adding some spells to the build, and since you allow Eldritch Godlings... I wonder what is nerfed and what not, so I guess I'll come up with a small sketch of what I'm planning to take (not today, though).

Moving on, I was here to ask: are the Metamagic Master and Magical Lineage traits allowed to be put into the same spell?

P.S. my aim is a Lightning Magus, probably a scion of the Duke of Thunder Himself, or some other cool reskinning.


Seer of Shadows wrote:
Veegees wrote:
How will characters (such as clerics) who get their powers from divine/other worldly beings that do not exist in this world work?
Divine casters receive their powers through an as yet undiscovered proxy, although their patron's absence is still felt. Kisarta has it's own unique faiths that many former agents of the divine adopt to fill in the emotional void.

What would happen to a cleric (or similar class) if they changed alignment or did something else which would usually result in a loss of powers? Like a cleric who worshipped an evil god in their original world but begins to lose faith once in Kisarta and starts to shift towards good, would they lose their powers or would they still oddly retain their powers?


Seer of Shadows wrote:
Here is my proposal: players may ignore one, and only one, instance of ability replacement by an archetype. The price for this is either one feat for majority of these potential replacements or three when it concerns those that would replace one of a class's primary abilities...

Works for me! Thanks!


Its coming together for me. My daring gunslinging swashbuckler will most likely end up a noble fencer 1/pistolero 7 on one side with a straight bard 8 on the other side.

His spell casting will be limited to non somatic spells in combat, but for a bard thats not as big of a deal actually.


Just want to check.

Knowledge skills, will only be of use for identifying creatures, traps, and the like. Yet useless for the lore of Karista. This would make the nobility, local and history knowledge skills rather bad choice, yet may be very important in previous life.

What is your recommendation regarding knowledge skills?

I am reading correct per level, it is max value of HD plus 1 plus Con/Cha modifier?


Right, another question, this time for the other side off the gestalt.

There's this archetype, the Primagus. Is it allowed? And, if it is... Well it states you get to use your Charisma for spellcasting and calculating your Arcana pool. It doesn't mention anything else, like bonuses calculations for specific Arcanas or whatever, but I guess that was taken for granted. I mean, it makes no sense to use two different attributes to calculate your class features. Shall I assume that?


too many ideas! But I'll get to work.

here's a few that I have some concepts for. (take your time if you need to)

Aegis
vitalist

mageknight
doomblade
soul-weaver
symbiat
hekatonkheires
synapse
protokinesis-feats
sphere-magus


Turns out Aroden's shield was already broken so I don't need it.

In any case i was already writing as this went up and the work continues. Need to spend gold and get the ole swordfighting diviner, leader, smith, general, fisher, farmer, interplanar traveler, hater of all things lichy and demonic going.


An my very much in progress submission:

Background: A Galtese hero of the Mendevian crusade! He who shot Baphomet in the balls! But who killed him? Nocticula? Mendev? Cheliax? The Grey Guardians? He has memories of getting killed by all of these, and he is very much aware that he shot the demon lord of treachery in the nuts!

He is now elsewhere, no longer mythic, and sizeably depowered, but he will have answers, convenient that he still has his gun!

Mechanical TLDR (I did the math, need to input it into character sheet etc.).

Mechanical TLR:
--Very significant DPR via rapishooting from an arcane striking pistol.
--Great face, tougher then he looks because CHA to HP
--Can shoot his pistol into close combat via sword and pistol style
--Backup lore monkey because bard, also a buffbot because bard.
--In combat casting is limited because no free hands, but some key spells dont need vocal components.
--Opportune parry and pretty high dodge ac means he is fairly hard to hit, 3 good saves.

Weaknesses:
--Doenst like being grappled, relies on his swift actions, is dead meat if paralyzed, uneffective beyond his first range increment. Will save is eh until he picks up Steadfast personality.

Personality:
--Paranoid teamplayer. Yes, if you are a loner you get backstabbed even more!
--Will jump at any plot hook concerning his death
--Feel free to have dead famous people from Golarion


Jereru wrote:
Moving on, I was here to ask: are the Metamagic Master and Magical Lineage traits allowed to be put into the same spell?

Yes. Metamagic Master has a 3rd level spell or lower stipulation, so I don't foresee that becoming an issue later on.

Veegees wrote:
What would happen to a cleric (or similar class) if they changed alignment or did something else which would usually result in a loss of powers? Like a cleric who worshipped an evil god in their original world but begins to lose faith once in Kisarta and starts to shift towards good, would they lose their powers or would they still oddly retain their powers?

So there are two answers to that question, one with spoilers and one without. The version without spoilers is that they still lose their powers, but will be able to atone or switch faiths as normal.

Spoiler-Filled Answer:
The Black Circle are partially responsible for supplying divine casters with their powers on Kisarta. They care much less about morals and the tenets of gods, whom they predate by untold eons, than they do about the strength of a being's convictions and willpower. Those who claim to base their lives around their faith and then waver in their convictions clearly did not believe as strongly in it as they thought, and so the Black Circle removes their powers to see what they choose: to return to the faith or to abandon it in favor of something else.

Ikatarii wrote:

Knowledge skills, will only be of use for identifying creatures, traps, and the like. Yet useless for the lore of Karista. This would make the nobility, local and history knowledge skills rather bad choice, yet may be very important in previous life.

What is your recommendation regarding knowledge skills?

There are three answers to that.

Characters will not be the only beings from their cosmology in Kisarta, so Knowledge skills will still be applicable in certain circumstances.

As noted before, PCs will be able to acquire tomes that allow them to begin making knowledge checks on some Kisarta-specific topics. These tomes are not comprehensive and some topics- a Guardian's personal history, the true identities of the Black Circle, Kisarta's nature, et cetera- are not something a mere tome will provide you.

My recommendation for knowledge skills is to take whatever you would normally. The tomes you can acquire, in gameplay terms, only make it so that you can begin using your existing knowledge skills on Kisarta-specific topics. Think of it like real-world academia: having frames of reference granted by a given topic makes learning about similar topics easier; your existing knowledge skills are the frame of reference and the information from the tomes are chunks of information about similar topics.

Ikatarii wrote:
I am reading correct per level, it is max value of HD plus 1 plus Con/Cha modifier?

You are correct. Bodies of aether are inherently a little more durable and that's why the extra hit point was added to each HD.

Jereru wrote:
There's this archetype, the Primagus. Is it allowed? And, if it is... Well it states you get to use your Charisma for spellcasting and calculating your Arcana pool. It doesn't mention anything else, like bonuses calculations for specific Arcanas or whatever, but I guess that was taken for granted. I mean, it makes no sense to use two different attributes to calculate your class features. Shall I assume that?

Primagus is cleared for use and you are correct in your assumption regarding what ability score you use for calculations.

Philo Pharynx wrote:

here's a few that I have some concepts for. (take your time if you need to)

Aegis
vitalist

mageknight
doomblade
soul-weaver
symbiat
hekatonkheires
synapse
protokinesis-feats
sphere-magus

I am intimately familiar with all of those except the Hekatonkheires archetype, which required a quick read. Consider them all cleared for use. Just remember that content adjacent to those, such as psionic feats or archetypes, need to be cleared individually.


TarkXT wrote:
Turns out Aroden's shield was already broken so I don't need it.

This is indeed a significant plot point necessary to the context of two Adventure Paths lol.


Storm Dragon wrote:
TarkXT wrote:
Turns out Aroden's shield was already broken so I don't need it.

This is indeed a significant plot point necessary to the context of two Adventure Paths lol.

Well thats what happens when you let people borrow your things. First they break it, then lose it, then it turns out the skinny goth kid you used to bully is using it to build a death ray.


Hmmm... do I have the time to join another game, because this sounds interesting...


Is the no templates rule solely for balancing reasons?
Like if I offered to take a hit to one of my class levels (so I'd be a level 8 cleric and a level 6 fighter for instance) would you consider letting me take something like the vampire or half-dragon template? Or something along these lines.
Or would you prefer to just not deal with templates?


If we end up with both a familiar and an animal companion, could we gestalt them and just take an animal companion and give it the bonuses a familiar would get too?


Now that is interesting question regarding companions (whatever it may be). Considering I have a drake companion. Even though companions are single classed, do we just apply the max HD +1 per level? What about extra feats, considering characters getting 1 every level?


Gonna see if I can go with a bit of a weird character archetype. Just kind of an alien monster that's not really evil or anything but does have a very weird culture/inhuman perspective on certain taboos (like cannibalism).

I'd like one of his classes to be the Spheres of Power Shifter, taking the Braineater feats from the Alienist Handbook (details are also listed on the Shifter page). Maybe with Martial Shifter, maybe not. Not sure if I wanna go the Champion route, but probably will.

Second class I'm less sure about.

Maybe Prodigy? Since you're familiar with Spheres I'm sure you're already aware of Prodigy's reputation, so I'm not sure if you think it's OP in some manner or not.

I'm also mulling over just Incanter or Conscript.

This would also come with a request for the following Spheres themselves:

Alteration (obviously)
Mind
Life
Blood
Wrestling
Brute


Okay, so for our GM's approval, here is a sketch of how the Eldritch Godling part of the Gestalt would go, more or less, and the 3pp feat I would be requesting. All 3pp options are included for you to decide.

Spoiler:

Eldritch Godling

Spellcasting Attribute: Strength
Spell List: Cleric/Oracle
Favored Class Bonus: +1/2 Divine Trait

1st LEVEL
Ascendancy
·Major Ascendancy: Uncommon Element (Su): Choose one of the following damage types: acid, force, sonic. Whenever the godling casts a spell from her godling spell list that deals hit point damage, she may change the type of damage it does to the selected damage type. The spell loses any of the following descriptors: acid, cold, electricity, fire, force, and sonic. It gains the type of damage it now deals as a descriptor. (Sonic)
·Minor Ascendancy: Talent for Mysticism (Su): You gain a bonus Scion talent.
··Scion Talent: Force of Brawn (Su): You may add your Str mod, rather than any other ability scores, to your saving throws.

2nd LEVEL
Lineage Domain
·Weather Domain
+1 Divine Trait (FCB)

3rd LEVEL
+1 Divine Trait

4th LEVEL
+1 Divine Trait (FCB)

5th LEVEL
Ascendancy
·Minor Ascendancy: Eldritch Magic (Ex): [i]You may add one spell from any spellcasting class’s spell list to your class spell list. A cleric/wizard spell becomes a godling spell of the same level. A druid or witch spell becomes a godling spell one level higher. Any other spell becomes a godling spell three levels higher. The spell is simply added to your godling class list, you do not automatically learn it.

6th LEVEL
+1 Divine Trait (FCB)

7th LEVEL
+2 Divine Traits

8th LEVEL
+1 Divine Trait (FCB)

DIVINE TRAITS (Total: 7 points)

·Divine Portfolio I: (Nature Mystery) The godling selects one oracle mystery. He gains one revelation from the mystery. He must meet all the revelation’s prerequisites. The godling treats his godling level as his oracle level for this revelation (including fulfilling the revelation’s prerequisites). (1 Point)

·Mystic Inheritance I: (Orc Bloodline) The godling selects one sorcerer bloodline or wizard arcane school. If the godling selects a bloodline, he gains the bloodline arcana and the bloodline power gained at 1st level. (1 Point)

·Mystic Inheritance I: (Goblin Bloodline) The godling selects one sorcerer bloodline or wizard arcane school. If the godling selects a bloodline, he gains the bloodline arcana and the bloodline power gained at 1st level. (2 Points)

·Mystic Inheritance II: (Orc Bloodline) The godling selects one sorcerer bloodline or wizard arcane school he has already selected with mystic inheritance I. If he selects a sorcerer bloodline, he gains a power granted by the bloodline at 7th level or lower. (2 Points)

1 leftover point (will see if I can get a free one somehow to buy Divine Portfolio II).

3PP FEATS
Elemental Boost


As someone how's also submitting a godling gestalt, I can't wait to see Jereru's submission!


TheWaskally wrote:
As someone how's also submitting a godling gestalt, I can't wait to see Jereru's submission!

It's just a Shocking Grasp spamming Magus, only with 3pp luxuries. Honestly, I just felt like playing this over some uberpowered thing. The extra shenanigans allowed me to get what I wanted more easily.


Hmm... I was looking at the PDF I have for making sphinxes a playable ancestry, and realizing it's not easily accessible anywhere... Perhaps I could PM you the basic stats?

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