Near, to me, implied in the wilderness, some smuggler place maybe. I will leave it to you. We may also need to explain why we deliver the furs landbound without pack animals... *shrug*
But you will come up with something. Just saying it slighly complicates matters if the dear captain meant to sail south with the sealskins...which is why i brought it up. If you see no problems, i will trust your judgement.
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Oh, also:
- We have an average Charisma Score of 18.
- Our main cast is three females.
- We have a male boss.(Thorne)
- And a male Sidekick.(Grumble)
- We're involved in intrigue and mystery, and operating undercover
We're totally Asmo's Devils.
*chuckles*
Pretty much.... only evil. Now if we are a bunch of teenage girls working for a spy organisation with an old man handler, we'd be called Totally Asmo. XD
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Love it!
Will update tomorrow after work. Been a weird few days. I'm enjoying the blossoming romance, by the way. XD
Drafted like 1000 posts in reply and scrubbed them all. Bear with me...
You two lovers enjoy yourselves XD
Hehe, no worries, I'll wait.
Just to be perfectly clear: No expectations, there ^_^
Just in case you(Hecate) were feeling pressured.
Now my turn....I will write back :)
It's not so much that I don't know what I want to write, but rather that I found no time over the weekend - I'll post tomorrow
Was at a concert yesterday, and very busy today with work and at home. I'll make sure to post tomorrow as soon as I can. Sorry for the delay :)
Worth the wait! :-)
OK, how about this as a plan for isolating the captain:
The Cardinal said he was greedy. Why don't we let him "overhear" a conversation that makes him think the Cardinal has left a cache of money buried for us at our destination? He confronts us, demands a share, we protest but eventually tell him to wait with the ship while we go get it - at which point he'll probably insist on accompanying us.
As soon as we land, Robin starts summoning her companion and we attack him as soon as it arrives.
I'll hit him with Lemures, Robin hits him with fire (which Lemures are immune to) and Saranda greases his feet from under him, and greases his weapons out of his hands.
Thoughts?
Good idea...we could go further: Instead of assuming his greed is sufficient to make him insist on getting some money...
Why not claim that we want to pose as merchants - that this was the reason we bought the stuff from the natives, and would also like the pelts they hunted, at a good price.
Paying from the funds that the Cardinal had placed for us near our landfall destination(same as your idea) by a local accomplice, together with a Cart we can use to transport the goods.
So his guys can stay and unload the boat for us, while he(and maybe a helper) accompany us to where the money supposedly is.
(If he wants us to bring it to the boat, we play dumb and claim we are unable to find it, promising an even greater share if he helps with his skills of navigation to find the cache).
Basically the same as your plan, just giving him an extra-reason to want to have the money besides greed, AND clearing the ship from any valuables except the payment received from Thorne(which we will need to retrieve)...meaning no collateral damage when we off the sailors.
When we return to the Frosthamar, we can even claim the Captain betrayed us, wanting to take all the money for himself, and demanding his cash as compensation, leaving the ship to his crew.(and then burning it down).
When Sakkarot comes to, we should ask if they have something like Lamp Oil. Surely the ship will take on Water, or Rum. Mixing in a Barrel of a highly flammable substance would certainly make things easier ;)
I'm so sorry to hear that. :-( If one of my kitties was in the same situation, I'd be absolutely devastated. Take all the time you need, and if there's anything I can do to make life better, please let me know.
Likewise. Look after yourself.
Sorry about your cat. Just recently lost my dog a few weeks back. It's always hard to deal with a loss like that.
I'll be travelling with work for the next couple of days.
Please bot as required.
If any of you happen to GM, you should check this out.
Humble Bundle
Think we're ready to move on to the next stage - killing the Captain; unless there's anything we still need to do here?
Sorry about the delay; I've been busy preparing for the holidays. Speaking of which, we may need to reassess the state of the campaign soon. If people aren't back by the end of the month, we can discuss bringing in more PCs, continuing as-is, or some other option.
I'm still here - just waiting to see who else is, I guess.
Same here. For now, assume you're in a solo game. Robin, I'm sure, will come back at some point, but I don't know where Saranda is. Possibly busy with holiday stuff. Like I said, we'll consider our options in another week or so.
I am back. Basically.
Did come back to the boards 2 days ago, still busy catching up with the more active games, and haven't posted anywhere except in the game I run before today.
Thanks for understanding. But forget that stuff about a solo game.
Glad to have you back, Robin. You've been missed. Hopefully the grief's subsided a bit and the hole in your heart's begun to heal.
Solo game is officially off the table. :-) We'll still discuss options if Saranda hasn't checked in by the end of the month, though.
Glad you're back, Robin :)
Sorry for what you've been through :(
Thanks. It was very hard...still is, at times. Every evening, she came to cuddle with me...I miss that.
But yeah, the worst grief has passed.
@Saranda...aye, it seems most of her characters have not posted in a while. But there's still another week left before the end of the end of the month, so here's hoping.
@Discuss options: I know there is still time, but as it seems Saranda may be gone from the boards(checked a few aliases, last post about 20 days ago on all of them...or more than 10 days on the alternate account), I could not help but ponder the consequences.
I would definitely prefer if she shows up again for our girl-team.
But if not?
I think with the relationship blossoming between Robin and Hecate, new people brought in may have a hard time...since our (perceived) respective focus will be on each other, making it hard to find "in". If so, we should probably do it by invitation, not recruitment, to make certain we pick people capable of handling this.
Alternatively, it might be easier to move us, as a couple, to the other WotW-game. But...that feels a bit off as well.
Of course, there's the option of running with gestalt, but with 2 people, action economy and staying power will be bad(one disable hits half the team by default), plus the options that make sense are very limited(I see neither Hecate nor Robin suddenly wielding a Greatsword and armor...(pick up a full martial side).
Most likely pick would be something like Summoner(for both of us).
Robin is, either way, locked into picking a different Cha-Based class(and Paladin is out *smile*), while Hecate could also excel in a skill-based class(Investigator would probably be a better fit than UC Rogue?)...
As mentioned, Saranda coming back would be the best option. and a lot easier...but if not, there's some difficult decisions to make ahead, so I would like to know what WOULD be on the table, and Hecate's thoughts on the matter.
Moving you to the other WotW game isn't a great option. There's already 6 PCs there, and that includes a Witch and an generalist Incanter with a conjuration companion. Too much overlap for my liking.
Best option, naturally, is Saranda coming back, but as that's looking increasingly unlikely, here are some possible options.
1) Stick with the Devilish Duo. I'll increase your durability and lower the overall difficulty.
2) Recruit another PC or two. Selective invites are definitely better here. I do have a RoW PbP that's been running for well over 2yrs with the same group of PCs, so that's a possibility. I could also invite some of my Zeitgeist PCs.
3) I can bring in a GMPC. With a lower point-buy and a relatively passive personality, it wouldn't overshadow the party but could cover a missing role or two.
4) Each of you creates and runs a second PC. I'm not a huge fan of this option, but you're both good RPers, so I'll allow it as a last resort.
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We're not making any decisions at the moment; just reviewing our options in case Saranda doesn't return by the end of the month.
Everything that you have both said sounds sensible and I don't have much to add.
Well, it's December, and there's still been no word from Saranda. I think it's best that we move on without her for now. How do we want to proceed?
Possible Options
1) Continue with just the two of you. I'll give you a boon to up your survivability (profane bonus to saves/AC, more HP, and an upgrade to your Devil's Mark feat). If you check my campaign history, you'll see that I have a fair bit of experience GMing solo/duo games, so no need to worry about random death or whatnot.
2) I supply a GMPC built to your general specifications. The character would have a "follower" personality and a reduced point-buy so s/he doesn't overshadow anyone and would be used to shore up party weaknesses.
3) We try to add 1-2 more PCs. I know of several solid players who might be interested, and we're currently at a good place to insert them story-wise.
4) Each of you runs a second PC. I'm not a huge fan of this option due to the extra workload for each of you, but I'll go along with it if this is your preference.
5) Abandon the campaign here. This is also known as the "make the GM sad" option.
Not (5), and I don't have time for (4). (2) would work, or we could go for (3). Option (1) is possible, but a couple of bad dice rolls and it's TPK time...
Depends if you have time/inclination to make and run a DMPC.
I concur on not (5). Totally not happening.
4.: i dislike for one simple reason. Despite having the time, this campaign is "Robin"'s. Anything else would, at most, be a cohort, an attachement to her, not a true individual. I do feel capable of running two PC's, but in that case, I would prefer to design them as a "team" from the beginning(e.g. I have 2 characters in other games with siblings that provide potential replacements in case of character death...would be easy enough to play both siblings as equal partners. That is not gonna happen here. (I could of course introduce a character into the whole thing but it would still feel forced, not natural...Robin is...special)
3.: Not totally fond of this one. It's an option, certainly, and probably a good one. If we pick that one, I would not want anybody from the Zeitgeist-Campaign, though :P I know it's totally my fault for sticking with a risky concept, but I totally wanted to get in there and having someone else then instead get in here, too, would make me slightly bitter. -_- I'm petty, I know.
2.: Totally an option. Although we could combine that with Option a.: below.
1.: more survivability in terms of saves/ac/hp is not bad. But I feel that we would need more options to cover certain aspects. E.g. I burned down doors, certainly, but that's not always an option, and things may be trapped. I'm currently sinking talents into making a tank companion, but that ultimately blocks me from picking up other utilities. We have blasting and control, but single-element and only moderate melee. Our healing is lackluster, as well.
If we go with only 2 of us, I would heavily suggest either picking up gestalt(even if we end up with me as summoner and Hecate as Investigator, that will give us more options to work with(I could re-train the conjuration sphere into healing, still have a great buddy with us, Hecate could rock most of the skills...)
In general, I trust you to be capable of running a 2-player game, and it would allow for Saranda to come back. But I think more options would be good, not just more stats.
a.: Basically option 2/4, but in a different way: A free altered leadership. We both get to "pick up" a cohort, as customized or cookie-cutter as desired, that is not a full fledged PC.
Gladly with a GMPC, too, so we could have a bodyguard, a healer and a sneak and keep Hecate and Robin exactly as they are, covering all other aspects.
All at one level lower, reduced point buy, all "followers", not overshadowing or showing much initiative. Basically this would be Hecates and Robins Story, with them as (replaceable) extras. IF Saranda comes back(or one of the other players), they could also be phased out again(or control of the GM-one transferred for 3 players with 3 "cohorts").
Hm. I don't think gestalt helps with the two key problems of easy TPK (2 failed Will saves takes out the entire party) or the action economy - even gestalt classes only get 1 standard action a turn.
Plus, Hecate is a wizard. I'll have enough paperwork just levelling her up as it is, never mind adding in a whole other class. I'm just not interested in doing that.
Let's take gestalt off the table.
Also, I don't have time to run a cohort. More paperwork? Blech.
I trust YBD's judgment - if he makes a DMPC (ideally a melee type with some ranged attacks) that's fine; if he brings in more PCs that's fine too - I trust him to find the right ones :-)
@Action economy: True enough.
But as said, even that is only half the rent. Right now, a simple locked door could foil us.
I trust that he is capable of balancing combat/action to make TPK less likely...but if so, we still lack options. Lockpicking, Trap Disabling, Healing, DPS...Unless we cheese things with summons, and that's more bookkeeping than the alternatives.
So, you take gestalt off the table, and the possibility of a cohort off the table.
I am not too keen on bringing in more PC's. At least unless we get to handpick and invite people ourselves(with GM making the final call, of course).
We both refused option 5.
So that leaves, without opposition from either of us, the GMPC.
If so, my "general" specification would be the following suggestion:
Slayer(maybe Velvet Blade?), Dex-based Switch-hitter, picking up Trapfinding?
Some tankiness, some DPS, some skills,...we'd still lack healing, but a warpriest of asmodeus would not be a "follower" given the circumstances ;)
Sorry, wasn't clear - I'm happy for you to run a cohort, and that might work; I just don't have interest in that.
Sooo... maybe you run a fighty type cohort (ideally with some ranged capability) and YBD runs a sneaky type DMPC who can scout, find and disable traps, open locks, stealth, that sort of thing?
Oh, i understood it right, but it would feel wrong to do that kind of thing asymetric - even if you'd be okay with it.
As in, if I get "something", you should get it too, and vice versa. I may eventually pick up leadership and get a proper cohort, if allowed, if only to provide more flexibility and cover another aspect.
But right now, we should find a solution that works out "fair". Plus it would feel weird to be the only one with a neglected semi-NPC-pre-made follower tagging along *smile*
(honestly, I would probably simply adapt one of my un-used characters fitting the job description to the proper point buy and level)
I suppose mostly I wanted to run with the cohorts because I hope Saranda comes back, allowing us to flexibly ditch them or keep them. *shrug*
Certain other options would make that more difficult(e.g. getting buffed up).
At work but will make a better update in a few hours. Both of you can summon, so there isn't a huge need for a meatshield. Some sort of Ninja/Slayer/Rogue sneak/trapmonkey would be ideal.
Also, I have it on good authority that Saranda's gone for the foreseeable future.
@Summon: Mine is delayed. I take a minute to call him in...and smart enemies will ignore Hecate's Summons and aim for the summoner, before she brings in more...
Those 2 aspects combined don't make me 100% comfortable disregarding a Meat Shield...but hopefully, Grumble comes back from the Bugbears after our infiltration of Balentyne is complete.
So, I concur with other aspects being a higher priority. As said, I would pick the dex-based Velvet Blade Slayer out of those. Rather straightforward, able to hold their own, not too squishy, not dependent on sneakyness, fitting our MO, and able to do traps.
(Plus I see the alteration of studied target as a bonus, as it makes them less dominant in combat, while full BAB still makes them decent.)
Dunno how Hecate feels about it.
Pity about Saranda.
I see where Robin is coming from and I agree with what she's said. Velvet Blade Slayer sounds cool, too :-)
Cult Leader Warpriest might actually be a better option. It's still sneaky but can also buff/heal the party.
Edit: if you want him back, Grumble can return after Balentyne. Unless you want him with you right now. ;-)
Yeah, but, officially, the Cult Leader does not have Trapmonkey-potential, while the slayer can pick up the package deal easily.
Inofficially, the Cult Leader position is our job. That is, I don't see a religious "leader" take a passive role, and IF Leadership is allowed later, then we would clash thematically :) Because I sure as hell(hehe) would have a religious following.
Only half-serious, but I would still slightly prefer the Velvet Blade, even if Warpriest would be convenient, too. (Divine magic would be convenient, but Slayer has more skills, better BaB and HP...and most of all, is more "straighforward" for us(all) to keep track of and you to provide as a tag-along char, over a spellcaster)
Plus, and thats most important: War Priest is dependent on a casting stat, and as such, MAD.
If you use a reduced point buy for the GMPC, that will make him either a weak caster or weak in combat.
Slayer could be SAD on Dex after picking up Weapon Finesse, providing ranged combat, melee combat, and AC as a package deal.
So... many... archetypes...
Agreed, actually - cult leader looks a good fit, mechanically and thematically.
I'll do some more digging over my lunch break. There's probably an archetype that does exactly what we want, and I have loads of 3pp. The Velvet Blade really didn't wow me, but I do have a large bias against UI, which may be contributing to that.
What, precisely, are the two of you looking for from a mechanics standpoint? So far I'm seeing a desire for healing, tanking, and locksmithing/trapfinding. Don't worry about fluff; that's easily altered. :-)
Hehe, it's not supposed to wow you :P
I understand what you mean, though.
Basically, I now saw healing as a extra, as optimally, both of us should not take much damage, and we can handle it via wands, for now, and later pick up other options.
Tanking in terms of being able to hold their own in close combat. If an enemy closes to one of us, all we can do is get away, letting them close again. Having one among us that does not need to fear being in melee would give us more options there, by "blocking" an enemy(or threatening an AoO).
Locksmithing/Trapfinding is a issue, yes. While you can go easy on the traps, I do expect we'll run into locked doors, and burning them down is not always an option :)
It's one aspect I'd definitely like covered.
Lastly, our current deal is infiltration of Balentyne and destroying them from within. But honestly, I could see deception, betrayal, and lies be part of our knots modus operandi down the road, too. A good number of problems could be approached that way. Having someone with us that fits that approach would be a boon.
At the same time, as you said, the character should not overshadow us. I am aware there are archetypes that make builds excel at some of these points, and a Treasure Seeker Rogue picking up Healing Sphere may cover a lot of these aspects, for example...but I'd prefer for the abilites to be solid, but not outstanding.
E.g. with social skills, it's no good to always have to send our "follower"-personality person forward because they happen to have supercharged social skills with skill unlocks.
The Velvet Blade was a simple way of "defusing" Studied Target while adding a bit of flavor to the infiltration part, where the char could reliable assist, not draw attention, or, on command, initiate the first strike.(note that betrayer does not need to be used to benefit...a Level 7 Slayer with accomplished Sneak attack does 5d6 sneak damage simply by opening a surprise round, which may be enough to dispatch NPC guards silently. With Sap Adept/Master, that would be 10d6+10 nonlethal sneak damage - I figured with getting in and out of places, that could help. But of course, we could probably use magic to the same effect ^_^
But in general, I'm very open and curious as to what you'll come up with.
I lack access to most things during work, but here's a bunch of options for your perusal. All can fight competently in melee and/or range. Most are stealthy and have trapfinding. I've also made sure they can do at least a bit of magic to keep with the mage-centric party theme. :-) Lastly, I have no problem playing anything on the list, so no worries about my getting overwhelmed.
Cipher Investigator
Seditionist Slayer
Cult Leader Warpriest
Crypt Breaker Alchemist
Trap Breaker Alchemist
Cloaked Wolf Inquisitor
Infiltrator Inquisitor
Arcane Healer Bard
Songhealer Bard
Umbral Weaver Bard
Commando Ranger
Hidden Blade Rogue
Nightmage Rogue
Counterfeit Mage Rogue
Eldritch Scoundrel Rogue
Phantom Thief Rogue
Nightblade (Ascension Games Path of Shadows)
Or, I can rebuild my original WotW PC. A gestalt Ninja/Dread with godlike stat rolls. #notserious
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Character will use 20pt-buy OR Elite NPC array. No traits or special boons, and I'll build at your level OR level-1.
I'll look over your suggestions a bit more.
Things I like would be e.g. Umbral Weaver Bard...alas, they are MAD if you want to have multiple competencies.
The kind of thing I specifically attempted to avoid was something like Phantom Thief.(which gives up quite a bit, to absolutely supercharge an array of skills)
Honestly, I would tend towards picking one of the weaker archetypes and letting it be built at equal level, rather than one of the stronger ones and level -1.
If Hecate has a preference, feel free to speak up. Otherwise I'll try and ponder them until monday.
Take your time. I've given you a lot of options. :-) MAD-ness isn't a problem if I'm not hyperspecializing in any one thing. As a generalist, 14-16 in primary stats is sufficient. For example:
STR 10
DEX 15
CON 14
INT 8
WIS 12
CHA 13
Before racial stat bumps is a perfectly servicable Bard that can buff, switch hit (with an agile weapon), do some light tanking, and open most locks. It isn't nearly as good as a PC at any of those, but it'll get the job done. :-)
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Once a class is decided upon, the two of you can pick the gender, race, and spellcasting method (Vancian vs spherecasting) if applicable. I have easily-ported-over fluff from one of my old aliases.
Looking over them, one I would consider as a good addition would be Trap Breaker Alchemist(picking up Infusion@Level 2).
It would cover Traps. It adds some ranged combat options(with bombs providing different elements through discoveries), with the fun part of setting "Traps" via Landmines.(Plus they last 1 day/level, so if we end up with some downtime or spare bombs after a days work, we can always "trap" our hideout or place of residence for possible assaults)
It is an Int-Based class with 4 skills, which is not bad and would allow spending some points in social skills to keep up with our bluff/act.
With ranged combat and Int being a factor, Elf would be a prime race candidate, also bringing with it the ability to wield a longbow(with good dex and mutagen) for when bombs are not great, or even a longsword if needed in melee.
In this case, Grumble's role as melee tank is also not compromised when he comes back.
Alchemist also provides a number of options for Healing through discoveries.
In keeping with the spirit of girl scouts, I would make her female. And while Alchemical spherecasting would be amusing, some aspects interact with other abilities. (e.g. Heal Bombs, which are a flat upgrade of single-target healing if multiple people are wounded(even at minimum, due to level-based healing, it's decent), and things like "Extra Bombs" make easy Feat Choices for when nothing else seems needed(Probably Weapon Finesse is a good pick, regardless, especially until Grumble returns.).
That would be my pick. It's not the strongest, not the weakest, it does several of the things we needed, while adding a couple interesting options as well.(as infusions can also be made of personal spells)
Plus, the alchemists "artificial improvements"/"chemical advancement" stick could be a vast contrast to the Elven "natural way"/"chilled patience" thing, giving her a reason to have fallen from grace from her community and turned rogue.
But of course I'm interested in Hecate's opinion, as well.
I'm down for that. There's a fun series of Transmutation spells (3pp) that allow Alchemists to temporarily "pass on" racial traits via harvested body parts. Dwarf beards grant stonecunning, for example. I avoid spherecasting on Alchemists/Investigators, by the way.
What does Hecate think? Also, would you prefer point-buy or Elite NPC array? Lastly, do you want her at party level or level - 1?