
GM Wicked |

Welcome back! Glad to see you. It's still raining.

Malorrem Dovar |

Welcome back!

Kwesi Akerele |

Whaddaya want?! I'm surprised I had ranks in Knowledge (anything)! ;)
Sorry for the delay - I laid down yesterday meaning to check in on my games after a nap...and woke up fifteen hours later, just in time for IRL Pathfinder night. Apparently I really needed that nap. ;) I'm working through everything now.

Kwesi Akerele |

Considering that before that I'd been going on four hours of sleep or so a night for about a week, yeah, the fifteen-hour nap was fantastic. ;)

Malorrem Dovar |

I am very jealous of that nap. I could use that.
And as to the skill ranks I will site that fact that I am a barbarian and did not give Mal a high int. Because I wanted to be pretty instead of smart ;)

Schist Goldcoal |

Sorry for my short posts! While I'm back, and I'm still scrambling to catch up with work and other things. I'll try to ease back into the flow of things and contribute stuff worth the reading as soon as I can...

GM Wicked |

No worries Schist! As long as you can post something quick to describe your actions we'll get by. Glad to have you in the game.
A friend (retired vet) passed away yesterday, and today is US memorial day holiday. If any of you have served your countries or are close with those who have, a profound thanks. I may not have a post up until tomorrow.

Malorrem Dovar |

Sorry for the delay. Since it was a three day weekend and I was finally mentally ready to run my game again my group wanted to play for two days. That led to a fair bit of scrambling on my end. But it was so much fun!
Monday was a busy and reflective day so I posted nowhere.

Shearwater |

To make my plan clear OOC: now would be a good time to go through the books for anything involving hags, specifically. We can grab the scrolls, the buckler, and any specific books that seem valuable, but I don't think we have time to get deeper into it, or a reason to move the entire library elsewhere. However, as it happens, there's already someone here studying the collection. Maybe we could check in periodically and see what Ryssina has found out, without having to stop doing the whole adventuring thing? I imagine Dima and Mal, at least, would rather be out kicking ass than stuck reading books.
Thoughts? Feel free to interject IC, but I thought I'd open this for discussion here as well.

Malorrem Dovar |

I can whole heartedly support this idea. Mal is not opposed to reading he just does it really slowly :D he is more opposed to reading in front of others. Having to sound things out out loud can be embarrassing.
He is actually more upset at questioning the rules he thought ruled the world. Monster are supposed to be evil.

GM Wicked |

Yikes, I realize I've jumped the gun without waiting for a vote. I guess it's not the end of the world (har) to spend a few hours in the library to get the info you want.

Malorrem Dovar |

We know we want the info so I am fine with it.

GM Wicked |

Mal, you got that right. You rolled one K(nature) check to "unlock" that info, then you can roll three additional checks to obtain information about each type of creature mentioned in the spoiler.
Since you've made the initial check, I'd suggest everyone with K(nature) make the rolls to try to obtain information about your enemies.

Kwesi Akerele |

Yikes, I realize I've jumped the gun without waiting for a vote. I guess it's not the end of the world (har) to spend a few hours in the library to get the info you want.
I was slow to post - I deserve to be botted. ;) That's what Kwesi would have wanted, regardless. After all, we came all this way.

Malorrem Dovar |

Woot! Dumb barbarian knows things :)

Shearwater |

Does using the library confer any sort of bonuses to our research? Or Ryssina's help, for that matter?
Also, I think Schist could aid Shearwater, since you can make DC 10 check untrained.

GM Wicked |

The book isn't very clear, unfortunately. The library should add a bonus, but I'll just add that in on my end (probably a static +5 per roll, or something like that). That could also mean that an untrained check could aid.

GM Wicked |

Yep shear you got it right. Very busy day, I'll post asap but might be tomorrow.

GM Wicked |

Once you've processed the information on the hags, the next question is whether to continue on to Aphelion Manor in search of more artifacts, or return to the enclave and rest. It's approximately 2am.
Remember, an ambassador of the Storm Readers is due to arrive and collect tribute in just over 24 hours, sometime that morning.

"Dima" Dimaratis |

Depending on how long it takes to get back to the enclave and rest, I'm leaning on going straight to the manor from the library. After all, I'd we run into a snag there we have some time options.

Kwesi Akerele |

I'm inclined to agree with Schist - I'd rather come to the meeting rested and ready to go with fewer artifacts than the opposite. We've got a couple of things to give them if need be, so I'm not that worried about hunting down more. We do need to make the call, though, on whether we want to let the meeting happen or try and act on our information and take out this hag while she's separated from the others.
Sorry I've been slow to post in Gameplay - between pain issues and poor sleep I'm pretty beat lately, and getting into character/composing a post hasn't been working out so well.

GM Wicked |

So, if we head straight for the enclave and sleep, you'd be able to get your 8 hours in and be ready to go by early afternoon tomorrow. Then, if you wanted, you could hit the manor and, depending on what happens, you might have time to rest again before the rendezvous with the storm readers the next morning.

GM Wicked |

Nope it's in just over 24hr. Erm, I always thought resetting spells, at least for sorc, could be done more than once in a 24 he period. Is that wrong?

Schist Goldcoal |

Nope, that's right! Once every 24.
Sorry I'm being so obtuse about this. So we have about 24 hours till our hag encounter, which means I get one more bout of memorization, which means we'd have to hit the manor straight away from here without resting, and save the rest for just before the hag?
If so, I think I have enough spells left to go one more round before resting...
In which case I think I'm not voting for a manor jaunt, then a quick stop home to rest before the hag.

Kwesi Akerele |

I'm good with deferring to the rest of the group's opinion on how to continue. I've got next to nothing in terms of limited-use abilities, so I'm not the one to make the call, haha.

GM Wicked |

Schist, I'm not sure you require a full 24 hours to reset your sorcerer spells... In this instance, my interpretation is beneficial to you! Here's why:
Each day, sorcerers and bards must focus their minds on the task of casting their spells. A sorcerer or bard needs 8 hours of rest (just like a wizard), after which she spends 15 minutes concentrating. (A bard must sing, recite, or play an instrument of some kind while concentrating.) During this period, the sorcerer or bard readies her mind to cast her daily allotment of spells. Without such a period to refresh herself, the character does not regain the spell slots she used up the day before.
All you need is 8 hours of sleep plus 15 minutes to meditate.
Clerics, on the other hand, are not dependent on resting at all:
A divine spellcaster chooses and prepares spells ahead of time, but unlike a wizard, does not require a period of rest to prepare spells. Instead, the character chooses a particular time of day to pray and receive spells. The time is usually associated with some daily event. If some event prevents a character from praying at the proper time, she must do so as soon as possible. If the character does not stop to pray for spells at the first opportunity, she must wait until the next day to prepare spells.
So if Shearwater interrupts his "rest" period to memorize his spells in the morning, e.g. 6am, he could do the very same thing in another 24 hours, and be ready for the Storm Reader visit.
Likewise, you could probably sneak in two 8-hr rest periods before then, and also be prepared. I.e. You can be full for both the manor and the Storm Readers Visit.
...Or am I completely bonkers?

Kwesi Akerele |

I believe it is still limited to once per day. The Magic section of the PRD says "Each day, sorcerers and bards must focus their minds on the task of casting their spells."

GM Wicked |

Yea I can definitely see the sense in that.
Another thing to consider is whether you plan to use violence at all, though I understand you want to be full just in case.
It's an interesting position to be in, trading artifacts for abilities, and I don't envy your choice here. I'll push forward tomorrow.

Shearwater |

I'm still game for ambushing the hag, though it might turn out to be a bad move. But hey, no risk, no reward! We should probably still go back and loot the manor after were done, though. No sense in missing out on magic items and stuff. That is assuming we don't get wiped out by a tsunami or something, of course.
As for preparing spells, I'm pretty sure the whole 24-hour thing only applies for divine casters. That seems to be the general consensus, or at least it has been amongst all the groups I've ever played with. In fact, this is the first time I've seen it questioned since my days of playing 3.5. With divine spellcasters, it's pretty clearly spelled out, whereas with arcane spellcasters it seems like a bit of a stretch.
This might be a bit pedantic, but the way I see it, "daily" simply refers to the time that you're awake. I mean, its not like all the wizards and sorcerers in the world are operating on the same timer that resets every 24 hours. Also, since they still have to spend 8 hours doing nothing, they don't really gain any special advantage, other than not being tied to a certain time each day. There is a certain asymmetry there that seems intentional, right?
(Not to mention that saying "daily spells" is way more convenient than "the allotment of spells you can prepare at once.")

Malorrem Dovar |

I would rather spend the time setting our ambush and leave the manor for after we are done.

Kwesi Akerele |

This might be a bit pedantic, but the way I see it, "daily" simply refers to the time that you're awake. I mean, its not like all the wizards and sorcerers in the world are operating on the same timer that resets every 24 hours. Also, since they still have to spend 8 hours doing nothing, they don't really gain any special advantage, other than not being tied to a certain time each day. There is a certain asymmetry there that seems intentional, right?
(Not to mention that saying "daily spells" is way more convenient than "the allotment of spells you can prepare at once.")
Where that can start to run into problems, though, is when you get things like rings of sustenance that let it only take two hours. A party might not be willing or able to pause for eight hours mid-day to let the sorcerer rest, but two hours is a lot more doable, and taken to extremes could potentially mean they're getting twenty or more ninth-level spells per day. I know they aren't on the same "timer" divine casters are with their spell preparation time, and I don't think they necessarily should be, but if you allow multiple rests per day things can get rather silly rather quickly.

Malorrem Dovar |

The group I play with tends to take that is you can only prepare spells once in a rough 24 hour period. A caster preps their spells and must wait 16 or more hours to try and prep their spells again.

Shearwater |

Where that can start to run into problems, though, is when you get things like rings of sustenance that let it only take two hours. A party might not be willing or able to pause for eight hours mid-day to let the sorcerer rest, but two hours is a lot more doable, and taken to extremes could potentially mean they're getting twenty or more ninth-level spells per day. I know they aren't on the same "timer" divine casters are with their spell preparation time, and I don't think they necessarily should be, but if you allow multiple rests per day things can get rather silly rather quickly.
You must take the eight hours, even if you don't sleep at all.
"If the character does not need to sleep for some reason, he still must have 8 hours of restful calm before preparing any spells."
"When he prepares spells for the coming day, all the spells he has cast within the last 8 hours count against his daily limit."
(As I see it, those are the only explicit limits on timing when it comes to arcane spells.)
To close this off on my end: In my experience, finding a place where you can rest for eight (or even two!) hours in the middle of adventuring is a rare treat. Even as the PCs get powerful enough to teleport away from dungeons and wandering monsters, it's still a trade-off. That gives the bad guys time to recooperate too, reset traps, get reinforcements, etc. With a good GM and players, there is little risk of abusing the system.
Of course, our GM is free to rule as they wish, but I presonally think that taking away this ability would be unfairly disadvantaging our sorcerer.

GM Wicked |

I'd just note that GM Rennai allowed sorceress-Anthuria to reset spells and abilities with only 2 hours rest, per her bloodline's photosynthesis ability that applied as though she wore a ring of sustenance.
A sorcerer or bard needs 8 hours of rest (just like a wizard)
This suggests a sorcerer should also require 8 full hours of rest, but...
The ring also refreshes the body and mind; its wearer needs only sleep 2 hours per day to gain the benefit of 8 hours of sleep.
So I'd argue that "gaining the benefits" means resetting spells and abilities.
But this is just making my head spin, and is probably unnecessary, so let me just make a ruling: Schist can reset his spells and abilities more than once a day if he can find a way to rest for 8 hours plus meditate 15 minutes. This would, *in theory*, allow for exploration of the manor AND allow both our casters to be "full" for the meeting with the Storm Readers.
If this looks like it's going to create imbalance I'll consider increasing the difficulty of the encounters. Shouldn't be a problem. Questions/comments?
Now, that said, would we like to head for the manor, or return to the enclave?

Shearwater |

I would like to point out that even if you read ring of sustenance as giving you back your spells after just two hours of rest, any spells you've cast during the last 8 hours would still count against your "daily" limit (as per the second quote in my last post). That's something we didn't really consider with Anthuria. Otherwise, I'm fine with the ruling.
Seeing as we have the option, I think we should explore the manor. I'm still good with either option, though.

GM Wicked |

Alright, but I guess you'll want to rest before hitting the manor? So my post will reflect returning to the enclave for a rest period, which will put you at the manor in the early afternoon.
Depending on how that goes, you should have time to return to the enclave and rest again before Orleva's arrival tomorrow (which would allow another reset for both casters).