Unfortunately the pregens are all considered to be grand lodge. (Page 8 of the Organized Play guide.)
It came up with Way of the Kirin and Rivalry's End, that playing a pregen didn't get you the faction specific boons.
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Alright, just a word there. I appreciate when someone is straightforward and tells me they have already run the scenario I'm GMing for them, but I find unacceptable that the same player metagames to such an extent that it changes completely the outcome of an encounter.
I honestly don't care if characters live or die, I simply try to take time to create an enjoyable and challenging experience for the players. This is assuming the players won't cheat or metagame to force the issue of a scenario, even if they mean well by saving another character.
Since half the party understands the problem Kuraishimo is in, I might as well tell it to the remaining people so that everyone understands what I'm talking about and can give their insight on how to solve the situation.
Firstly the trap earlier didn't only inflict Charisma damage, but also laid a curse on those who failed their Will save (everyone did, if I recall correctly). The curse basically turns the next healing spell you get into damage... Nasty, I know. In the current situation, healing Kuraishimo would almost certainly kill him. Your healer PMed me saying that he wouldn't heal Kuraishimo on the grounds that it would kill him, and gave me a few in character reasons which I didn't agree with, but healed himself anyway. I didn't get it at first, but healing himself would trigger the curse too, and then give the party grounds to think that Kuraishimo is afflicted by the same curse. When he reminded me to tell the party how the cure spell would interact with his own hit point total, my slow brain finally understood the intent behind his move. In my book, that's a very metagamey thing to do. I know he means well (not killing another character), but I feel that his character wouldn't think like that, especially with an unconscious, bleeding character at his feet.
I'm very interested in having your opinion about this situation, and tell me if you think that I'm wrong in considering this move as metagame. Wakedown, please understand that this is not about pointing fingers, but it's about solving together a situation that doesn't feel right at all.
So I've GM'd Assault on the Wound and I know that if Kyra heals Kuraishimo that it's all but a given that she would kill him.
I'm usually not a fan of bringing someone from -9hp up to +5hp or so just to get hit for 20 damage and killed though.
But now that the BBEG has disengaged, it would make sense for Kyra to heal... or maybe not (since she can't deselect Brae-Haegen if he is still about and invisible).
Since she's at 40/59hp (down 19) and Bart is 35/50hp (down 15), I'm tempted for the "better good of the game" to have Kyra use a cure spell on herself or Bart.
I just wanted to give you a heads up, since it's a bit of an interesting conundrum, and I didn't want to appear as if I'm metagaming, but at this point it's very difficult as there would be a player death otherwise.
I could imagine even if I hadn't GM'd this before, that at a table you might ask a question like "Are you sure you want to channel when you can't exclude Brae-Haegen" and lead me into an action where Kyra discovers her healing is bad without killing someone first.
Hi wakedown,
I agree that it's hard not to metagame in your position. Seeing that Kuraishimo is still bleeding but not dead yet, I think that you should have healed him (you don't know how long he has to live, Hps are an abstraction, so is the Constitution score). You made your choice, and I don't quite agree with it.
To be honest, I can't see what could save Kuraishimo at this point, since he's bound to be healed sooner or later. Casting detect magic to sense the curse would be very bad metagaming in my book.
However, I do agree that channeling in this position would be a questionable choice at best.
Kind regards,
GM Lithrac
Ah, I don't want to be the player that killed another player with the knowledge I have though, so it's a bit of a difficult position.
You still need to post as a GM letting me know that when Kyra healed herself, that she actually did that in damage to herself.
I agree that he's potentially on the track to dying on his own, but at least it will be as a result of his rolls and not mine...
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Oh, I didn't know that. I agree it is a very metagamey move though a well intentioned one. And I understand feeling terrible doing something that you know would get someone else killed. Would there be a knowledge check or something to identify that we'd been cursed? I assumed he was tactically letting him stabilize because Kuraishimo has a lot of con and thus a lot of time to make that stabilization.
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I don't fault you at all for wanting to metagame a bit to save Kuraishimo's life, but I have to agree with the GM that that is not how Kyra would act. I've GM'd this as well so I knew about the curse and was waiting for something bad to happen but not being the healer I didn't have the unfortunate position to accidentally heal someone to death. But putting that metagaming knowledge aside and trying really hard to separate player knowledge from character knowledge, I think it's pretty clear that the most natural thing for Kyra to do would be to try to heal Kuraishimo and not herself. I'm sure Kuraishimo would harbor no ill will towards you as a player even though as a player you know it will kill him because Kyra does not know that and Kyra's intentions are nothing but good and pure in trying to save her companion.
In the end, no one can force you to play your character a certain way but I'm just putting my support out there for the GM's position that healing yourself to tip everyone off to the nature of the curse is way too metagame-y for my taste.
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I'm here to play Kyra to support you guys more than anything else, but certainly am in a bit of a bind with the metagame knowledge and doing my best to play through it without compromising the scenario.
Hopefully you guys don't see this as me being a metagamer, I'm very far and away from that, which is why I went with the PM to the GM right away asking for guidance. In this case at least - I'm certainly not metagaming for my personal benefit in any form.
I feel like it's smart and in character for Kyra not to bring up a PC that is right near death, right next to a BBEG only to watch them get hit again and killed (likely Kyra has seen that "oops" aplenty in her career).
I also feel solid about her not channeling when she can't see and exclude the BBEG who is potentially invisible and near death on his own.
But now we're at a round where she needs to figure out what she's doing, and that would most likely be healing herself, Bart or Kuraishimo. I could've rolled a dice to decide who to heal, but my desire to ensure "everyone had the most fun" meant I went with Kyra healing herself (and thus hurting herself and putting herself at the next highest risk of death).
In a situation like this in a store, I'd totally ask the GM to step away from the table and see what he/she thinks we should do. If they suggest that "Kyra would heal Kuraishimo, please do so", then that's what I'd do. If they suggest they "yeah, heal yourself so you can at least put into play awareness of the curse... who knows who has it or not..." then that's what I'd do.
I read Lithrac's message of "I can't see what could save Kuraishimo at this point" as "he'll be dead anyway soon enough" and originally went with Kyra healing herself as the "least bad metagame decision" to make (versus healing Bart as the other choice).
I certainly didn't want to be making the decision 100% on my own that Kyra steps up and adds 3d8+7 more damage to Kuraishimo because it's in character for her to do so, when there were arguments that it could also be in character to heal up those who are still fighting a battle and trusting the gods to see to Kuraishimo's goodwill.
This is certainly one of the most difficult and unique conundrums I've encountered after 200 tables of PFS.
My sense is that it is in character for Kyra to try to bring Kuraishimo back in the case that Brae-hagen is still lurking about and would employ some form of AOE damage spell. I'm going to post as such so we can put the metagaming to bed and not get stuck here too long. Hopefully everyone (most everyone) feels like I made the best decision I could.
My deepest apologies, Kuraishimo...
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Yeah, that's certainly the toughest decision I've ever seen in PFS. I don't envy your position but I think you're playing as well as anyone could.
Funny Kyra story to break the ice: someone playing Kyra decided to cast holy blight or some spell that hurt evil creatures a lot and neutral creatures a bit. They (wrongly) assumed that the nearby townsfolk were good-aligned and accidentally killed a few innocent citizens who were in the blast. The GM then had a tough decision on whether Kyra needed an atonement to get her clerical powers back (I wasn't at the table and can't remember their decision but I think the player voluntarily used their sling and scimitar the rest of the scenario). It was actually pretty funny because the player had no idea he was potentially hurting innocent people but now blames the mistake on "those dirty heathen townsfolk".
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We're not putting any blame on you wakedown, be it for your decision earlier or Kuraishimo's demise. It is, as you say, an impossible conundrum. Thank you for reconsidering your action, I think it makes much more sense now. I deeply appreciate the roleplaying you put into your post, as well as the effort you put into solving this situation.
Kuraishimo, I'm really sorry that it has come to this, but there's no way anyone could have known in character about the curse, especially since the trapped glyph the curse was linked to was actually invisible...
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No worries, itll make an awesome story.
Im on the road in portland so Ive only been partially following along.
No apologies necessary GM. I love when badguys are dangerously compotent.
Including GM credit Ive earned almost 400xp in PFS and only have had 2 characters die, Im certaintly due for a few more.
Ill have to double check my chronicle sheets when I get back, but especially with the magnimar half cost rez boon on this guy Im sure bringing him back wont be a problem.
Pregens can only sell gear to help clear their own conditions, not the conditions of others last I checked.
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Alright, here are the Chronicle sheets. Unfortunately, you only got 1 pp (the secondary condition was linked to your victory in the second battle) and less gold (the battle was lost and the loot wasn't found).
On the positive side, the Silver Crusaders got their boon!
Please let me know if there's anything wrong about the CS.
We'll need to resolve Kuraishimo's raise dead (and restorations) before the game is reported, however.
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Kuraishimo currently has 21 prestiege.
I'll use my Magnimarian debt boon to reduce the raise dead cost to 8pp, then I'll spend 4pp for each of the negative levels for a total of 16pp spent.
I have crossed off my Magnimarian debt boon and noted that it was used here.
No need for help on the costs, I appreciate the offers though.