I'm playing a ranger with a horse as my animal companion. During combat I'm frequently mounted on my horse so that I can fire off full-round attacks while still technically being able to move. There are a couple of things I'm unsure of with this strategy though:
1) Since the horse is my animal companion, I can command it with Handle Animal as a free action. That means I can tell my horse to move up to 50ft and then still make my full-round attack right?
2) If I am the target of a splash attack like an Alchemist's bomb for example, does my horse also get hit? If so, against whose touch AC is the attack made?
3) Since my horse is large, it occupies 1x2 squares, so if I am mounted on it, in which square am I considered to be?
4) Follow-up to questions 2 and 3: Since my horse occupies 1x2 squares, if one of the squares it occupies is the target of a splash attack, does it (after taking full damage from the main attack) also need to make a Reflex saving throw to avoid the splash damage that would normally affect the adjacent square that is also occupied by my horse?
5) If I use Handle Animal as a free action on my turn, does that mean that the horse's turn takes place "during" my free action? For example, my turn starts, I declare I use my free action to perform Handle Animal on my horse, telling it to use an Overrun attack. After that has resolved completely and my horse has moved as a result, I finish the rest of my turn by either doing a move + standard action or a full-round attack. Would that be how it works?
Thanks a lot in advance for any help you could offer with these questions.
5. I go by the general rule that animal companions/familliars/ et. al. act on the character's turn.
1. yes.
2. being mounted is irrelevant. if you are the target your horse would be hit by splash because it is adjacent to you. The ac targeted is based on who is being targeted.
3. you "exist" in every square your mount does. If they can hit any part of your mount, they can hit you.
4. primary targets can not take splash damage. They are not adjacent to themselves, they ARE themselves.
5. This is generally irrelevant as most tables keep companion and owner in same initiative and take same turn, you can break it up as you wish.
as a caveat to 5, if your table does not combine them, when you can give your mount int of 3 or higher, both of you can take swap initiative, have yourself always take the highest and delay down to mount if you wanted.
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1) Since the horse is my animal companion, I can command it with Handle Animal as a free action. That means I can tell my horse to move up to 50ft and then still make my full-round attack right?
Yes. Odd as it is you could use the "seek" command to do this..
or
DC 5 ride check: Guide with Knees: You can guide your mount with your knees so you can use both hands in combat. Make your Ride check at the start of your turn. If you fail, you can use only one hand this round because you need to use the other to control your mount. This does not take an action.
2) If I am the target of a splash attack like an Alchemist's bomb for example, does my horse also get hit? If so, against whose touch AC is the attack made?
One of you gets hit. the other will get splashed (since you share your mounts spaces)
3) Since my horse is large, it occupies 1x2 squares, so if I am mounted on it, in which square am I considered to be?
it occupies 2X2 squares. You are considered to be in all of them.
4) Follow-up to questions 2 and 3: Since my horse occupies 1x2 squares, if one of the squares it occupies is the target of a splash attack, does it (after taking full damage from the main attack) also need to make a Reflex saving throw to avoid the splash damage that would normally affect the adjacent square that is also occupied by my horse?
No. Splash attacks just work as either target or splash.
5) If I use Handle Animal as a free action on my turn, does that mean that the horse's turn takes place "during" my free action? For example, my turn starts, I declare I use my free action to perform Handle Animal on my horse, telling it to use an Overrun attack. After that has resolved completely and my horse has moved as a result, I finish the rest of my turn by either doing a move + standard action or a full-round attack. Would that be how it works?
As a legitimate mount, your mount moves on your initiative as you direct it.
Thanks everyone, all of your answers make a lot of sense (and they were precisely what I wanted to hear as well, haha!).
One thing though:
it occupies 2X2 squares. You are considered to be in all of them.
I remember reading in several places that horses and wolves are only large in the sense that they are "long", meaning they don't take up the usual 2x2 squares for a large creature, but only taking up 2 squares for its length, ie a 1x2 area.
Also note that your horse occupies 2x2 squares, not 1x2 as your said.
if you're doing melee combat then if your horse moves more than 5ft you can't full attack.
if you're mounted then you use mounted rules and ride, not handle animal.
long means that they don't get 10ft reach for being large.
The "long" or "tall" designation on sizes only affects their reach, space is not changed, large is 2x2.
Okay, thanks for the clarification people, so it does take up an area of 2x2 squares.
There still seems to be some disagreement on whether or not I'm allowed to use my mount to make a move action of 50ft and then make a full-round attack myself. I was under the impression that, even if you mount your animal companion, it still gets to complete an entire turn of its own.
Combat while Mounted: With a DC 5 Ride check, you can guide your mount with your knees so as to use both hands to attack or defend yourself. This is a free action.
When you attack a creature smaller than your mount that is on foot, you get the +1 bonus on melee attacks for being on higher ground. If your mount moves more than 5 feet, you can only make a single melee attack. Essentially, you have to wait until the mount gets to your enemy before attacking, so you can't make a full attack. Even at your mount's full speed, you don't take any penalty on melee attacks while mounted.
1) No. It is already a free action to direct your mount. The limitation against being able to full attack has nothing to do with the action to direct your mount and everything to do with the distance your mount moves.
With ranged attacks you will still get your full attack, melee only if your mount does not take a move action. This is stated exactly in the mounted combat rules.
There still seems to be some disagreement on whether or not I'm allowed to use my mount to make a move action of 50ft and then make a full-round attack myself. I was under the impression that, even if you mount your animal companion, it still gets to complete an entire turn of its own.
Your attacks happen while your mount is moving .
If you are making a melee attack you have to wait until the end and then can't full attack (unless your target is on the back of the mount with you or something)
You can use ranged weapons while your mount is taking a double move, but at a –4 penalty on the attack roll. You can use ranged weapons while your mount is running (quadruple speed) at a –8 penalty. In either case, you make the attack roll when your mount has completed half its movement. You can make a full attack with a ranged weapon while your mount is moving. Likewise, you can take move actions normally.
There still seems to be some disagreement on whether or not I'm allowed to use my mount to make a move action of 50ft and then make a full-round attack myself. I was under the impression that, even if you mount your animal companion, it still gets to complete an entire turn of its own.
Your attacks happen while your mount is moving .
If you are making a melee attack you have to wait until the end and then can't full attack (unless your target is on the back of the mount with you or something)
You can use ranged weapons while your mount is taking a double move, but at a –4 penalty on the attack roll. You can use ranged weapons while your mount is running (quadruple speed) at a –8 penalty. In either case, you make the attack roll when your mount has completed half its movement. You can make a full attack with a ranged weapon while your mount is moving. Likewise, you can take move actions normally.
It is implied here that you only take the -4 and -8 penalties if your mount takes a full move action or is running, respectively. I'd say if your mount performed a regular move action, you get to perform a full-round ranged attack without any penalties.
When in doubt about the rules, the best place to look is....the rules.
From the CRB Combat chapter under the heading "Mounted Combat:"
" If your mount moves more than 5 feet, you can only make a single melee attack."
That's for melee attacks only though, apparently you can make a full-round ranged attack after moving with your mount.
Also I know to check the rules, it's just that sometimes things can be a bit hard to find in there so I'd feel more comfortable checking here.
If you ride your animal companion it's now a mount and directed as such and not as a free animal to control.
Yes you do still need to make handle animal checks if you want it to be attacking, but for movement that's ride checks.
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5) If I use Handle Animal as a free action on my turn, does that mean that the horse's turn takes place "during" my free action? For example, my turn starts, I declare I use my free action to perform Handle Animal on my horse, telling it to use an Overrun attack. After that has resolved completely and my horse has moved as a result, I finish the rest of my turn by either doing a move + standard action or a full-round attack. Would that be how it works?
Something about that strikes me as suspect. You and the horse already moved during your turn, so you getting to move again is strange. On the other hand, many "move actions" don't involve physically moving. Dunno.
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Mount moves 0 to 5' - Full melee or ranged attack
Mount moves >5' to Speed - Single melee or full ranged attack
Mount moves >Speed to 2x Speed - Single melee attack or full ranged attack at -4
Mount moves >2x Speed - Single melee attack or full ranged attack at -8
The Mounted Skirmisher feat allows a full melee attack if the mount moves 0' to Speed. The Mounted Archery feat and a few other options reduce the penalties on ranged attacks when the mount is moving >Speed.
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Mount moves 0 to 5' - Full melee or ranged attack
Mount moves >5' to Speed - Single melee or full ranged attack
Mount moves >Speed to 2x Speed - Single melee attack or full ranged attack at -4
Mount moves >2x Speed - Single melee attack or full ranged attack at -8The Mounted Skirmisher feat allows a full melee attack at 0' to Speed. The Mounted Archery feat and a few other options reduce the penalties on ranged attacks when the mount is moving >Speed.
That would be a very useful table to print in the next edition of the CRB.
10' to speed, does that have a requirement to attack from the middle of the move?
1) Since the horse is my animal companion, I can command it with Handle Animal as a free action. That means I can tell my horse to move up to 50ft and then still make my full-round attack right?
Incorrect. When mounted you control your horse with Ride. Under the mounted combat section it states that is your mount moves more than 5 feet you can only make one melee attack for the round.
Mounted combat also covers mounted Archery which allows more/full attacks but has substantial penalties to hit when moving more than your mounts speed in a round.
If your NOT mounted, then yes you can command your mount as a free action and then take your standard and move and swift actions normally.
2) If I am the target of a splash attack like an Alchemist's bomb for example, does my horse also get hit? If so, against whose touch AC is the attack made?
If your character is specifically the primary target of an aoe or splash weapon your mount will get hit or splashed. In the case of the splash weapon your cited it would attack your mounts touch AC if that is the normal process for targets in the splash area for that attack.
3) Since my horse is large, it occupies 1x2 squares, so if I am mounted on it, in which square am I considered to be?
Large creatures occupy 2 x 2 squares. While mounted you area considered to be in all the squares your mount is in as well for combat purposes.
4) Follow-up to questions 2 and 3: Since my horse occupies 1x2 squares, if one of the squares it occupies is the target of a splash attack, does it (after taking full damage from the main attack) also need to make a Reflex saving throw to avoid the splash damage that would normally affect the adjacent square that is also occupied by my horse?
No matter how many squares a target is in size, one attack only hits them once. So if you hit 3 squares of a large target with a fireball, they only take the fireball damage once. It is one spell hitting one target. Not one spelling hitting many squares.
They would not be subject to splash damage form an attack that they are the primary target of because they suffered the primary effect. Creatures larger than one square do not get extra damage just for being big.
5) If I use Handle Animal as a free action on my turn, does that mean that the horse's turn takes place "during" my free action? For example, my turn starts, I declare I use my free action to perform Handle Animal on my horse, telling it to use an Overrun attack. After that has resolved completely and my horse has moved as a result, I finish the rest of my turn by either doing a move + standard action or a full-round attack. Would that be how it works?
If your asking if this is how it works WHILE YOU ARE MOUNTED the answer is no. Whenever your riding your must follow the mounted combat rules even with an animal companion. While you can command your horse to do an overrun while mounted, that counts as your mount moving more than 5 feet so that will impact your melee or ranged attacks as per the mounted combat rules.
If your talking about commanding your AC while your on foot, the order in which you resolve things is totally up to your and your GM. Everything happening in the same combat round is actually happening 'simultaneously', it is just the game system that makes things seem cyclical to facilitate game play.
So to answer your example, yes you could command your AC to overrun something as a free action and still have your move and standards left to do other things. The horses actions take place at the same time as all your actions do over the course of that 6 seconds round. The world does not freeze and the horse goes and then you go. That is just how the combat system for the game looks from our perspective. IN THE WORLD the characters are in this is all going on at the same time.
10' to speed, does that have a requirement to attack from the middle of the move?
From my understanding it would work just like it does for a character on foot. You cannot make an attack during your movement, only when you end your movement if they are within reach.
There are feats that cover this like Spring Attack for foot soldiers and Ride-by Attack to do so while mounted.