Myths and Legends(Heroes of Golarion)

Game Master Monkeygod

I will be very surprised if I don't accidentally misspell it at least once. :P

With my current plans, I can get Compliant Column all the way to 160 ft tall, dealing 6d6 damage. Presuming the enemy sits there while I buff. :P

I'm sorry- I know I've been waffling in my declared interest... I'm going to officially (and permanently) bow out. Opportunities for games like this don't come up very often and it would be fun to be in on it but honestly I don't have the time for something on this scale, especially headed into the holiday season (and trying to build a gestalt level 25 mythic character on my phone is going to kill me I'm pretty sure). Happy adventuring to the brave champions who do get in! I may stalk your gameplay thread when I get bored.

Thought of the day: With Bonded Mind, Solo Tactics, and Signature Skill: Sense Motive, I can effectively communicate telepathically with anyone in sight range, even in an antimagic/antipsionics field.

Build incoming.

Nifty.

Right. Here is a character!

-Thunderbeard

My signature item is my longsword, which has a really cool story behind it:

It was originally Iomedae's weapon when she was a mortal. However, upon completing the Starstone and rose as a deity, she discarded her mortal arms and armor(This is already in canon, as the Truefaith Crown from Artifacts and Legends). Due to them being with her during her time inside the Starstone trials, its believed they gained some small measure of divinity as well.

Soon thereafter, one of Iomedae's servitors retrieved her longsword, which was kept in her armory in Heaven until recently, when she bestowed it upon Davin as a gift and blessing for his service and deeds done in her name.

Working hard to find something that she can use as a weapon.
I have an idea but need to build it with psionic weapons rules if I can.
worked out I can get the armor things V the Psionic skin she has.

Really trying to keep her as much Psionic as I can even with items.

So taking the Superheros of Golarion
We have so far posted as alts. [just doing alts as interest and outlines is much more work, and this is just for fun. And only the best analgesic types I could come up with, I bet others can come up with better.]

Sūn Xíngzhě AKA 孫悟空 / The Monkey King (China Mythic)
"The nature of Monkey is irrepressible!!"

DarkTempest AKA Jedi Master DarkTempest (starwars)
"The Force is strong in this one"

The Invincible Lord Rook AKA Mumm-Ra (ThunderCats)
"I see all"

The Sapphire AKA Professor X (X-Men)
"Wolverine, play nice or you will spend the rest of your life thinking your a 6 year old girl"

hehe

Because I was asked by Sapphire:

Prismatic sphere normally follows you around. However: "You can pass into and out of the prismatic sphere and remain near it without harm."

Lord Rook steps out of his prismatic sphere and keeps it in a Portable Hole when he's not using it, otherwise donning it like a raincoat when he suspects trouble is near and stealth is not useful.

At least, I *think* this is how permanencied Prismatic Sphere works?

prismatic sphere is specifically immobile... it can't follow you around because it can't move. also, you can't put it in a portable hole because it can't move (and even if it could the violet layer would destroy the portable hole when it came in contact with it).

I was thinking the same, sorry I just wanted to know if I had missed a rules change.

It would be insanely powerful if you would just have yourself inside it and walk around. Walk into any Anti-Magic/power area and switch it off. Just think of a cannon with delayed prismatic sphere cast on the cannon balls Yikes!.

Ok...breakdown of Tempest's Hilt:

I'm not usually the one in our gaming group that creates the party's stuff, so let me know if I did something wrong here...

well, that's a pretty hefty minor artifact. I'd suggest figuring out what you would like now, and what it would build into. Or how much of it you would buy your self.

Keep in mind, most items are limited to $200k before being deemed epic.

That's just an intelligent magic item. Giving it artifact level thing would be way worse. But, I can lower it.

I'm curious to see what Iomedae's sword's breakdown would be.

DT plans to buy and build it himself. With a 1.2 million pool for equipment, that's easily do-able.

Alright, getting rid of the bonuses vs caster stuff, that drops the item value to 173150, ego 32.

So, I guess I'm just building items that a 25th level person with the time, skills and funds could make. If there are caps other than no more than half the starting gold (1.2 million) on any one item, then we should clearly define what those caps are, and what we are going to define as "artifacts", minor or other wise.

Right now, his highest cost item is the hilt, reduced to 173k.
His mask was going to be a combo of a psi crown, a hat of disguise and true sight goggles, which end up being 142k
his robes are master work robes with inertial armor 3/day at ML 9, and a constant freedom of movement at 65k.
He'd fill out the rest of the slots with existing (book) items.

So, for instance, the mask is combining 3 wonderous items into one item. Is it now an artifact?

Okay scratch that I missed the word "immobile." I guess the prismatic sphere will live on the demiplane, or get swapped out if I can.

@Kryzbyn: Crystal Hilts aren't really a thing with Automatic Bonus Progression. ANd I thought we had to take an ACTUAL minor artifact?

They are being used as a base, because they are an item that exists to serve as a physical means to focus a mind blade through, and aren't providing any enhancement bonus themselves, even though I'm paying for them as if they were (+1 is bare minimum, but his native bonus for being a soul knife of his level overrides it anyway). It's a mechanical thing he can not make use of. They are just the base of the item being enchanted, as I explained earlier. You'll notice there's no enhancement bonus listed anywhere in the description.

It's "signature item equal to a minor artifact" not "choose a minor artifact".

If the crystal hilts are really a problem, I can just replace them with any old hunk of deep crystal, and further reduce the cost.

Case in point...a deck of many things is a minor artifact.
If we assume each card is at the minimum a wish spell, that's use activated, and never goes away (the cards return to the deck). Not including the cost of the ivory or velium they are made out of, that's 3.9 million gp value for each deck.

Staff of the magi is a minor artifact...

None of the artifacts in the CRB have a gp value listed, but if you were to try to re-create them, it would cost a ridiculous amount of gold.

I hope I'm not making anyone angry with this.
I'm trying to illustrate that I operated based on an assumption because the words "minor artifact" were used.

So, we need to iron out what is meant by "signature item equal to a minor artifact".
I'm not trying to cheese anything, just operate within the rules given.

I didn't exactly get any feedback on the Compliant Column. I presumed I could enchant it as per any normal quarterstaff, at normal cost to me, and that the signature part was just its special abilities.

I will try and post up my sword later, but its base is a Holy Avenger. Obviously some part of it comes out of my APB.

Cool, thank you.

I would hope that picking certain specific artifacts and pointing out their value is not how you are determining what your signature item should be worth.

I had asked that signature items not provide direct attack/damage bonuses. It would be nice if some consideration was given to making them more than an expensive magic item.

Even though we have a lot of cash, there is no "you may spend half on one item" caveat.

It has not yet been decided to what extent epic level items may be available. Therefore, as previously noted, items would be restricted to less than 200,000 gold.

If you are designing custom gear, and you do not have the crafting feats, you do need to account for the full retail price of the item. Your followers, fellow players, cohorts, etc may not craft on your behalf.

I would like to see that the signature item (please note that it is a signature item, not an artifact. Said signature item should be viewed as if a minor artifact) is something that is unique to the core of the character. Since many aspects of the character haven't been completed or approved yet, developing a signature item at this juncture may be premature. The signature item should be unique to what your character is. It should not be the linchpin upon which your character will be cried as unplayable for the loss of the item.

Hopefully Monkeygod will be making the group announcement soon. The character approvals can then begin.

First up will be the race/template selections
Followed by class/feat selections
Then gear approvals, with the signature item.
Followed by the remainder of the crunch.
Background and story details will then need to be flushed out.

Why do I work in a step process like this?

I've had a lot of experience with players providing a completed character, and after pointing out that some aspects of their character are not approved under the game rules, those players have expected, and demanded that their completed character be allowed anyway because they already finished it and it would completely destroy their wonderful concept.

I'm sorry, but if the game is old west and you present a modern day james bond, it just ain't happening. I'd much rather deal with fine tuning the pieces, both for game balance, and aesthetics.

"I had asked that signature items not provide direct attack/damage bonuses."

You are aware that Monkeygod's is a sword yes? One more boss than a Holy Avenger, apparently? I think it's going to be a mite more effective than punching.

Guess we'll have to see what makes it more than a holy avenger.

Indeed, its primary special ability could be entirely flavor. We'll see, and that could really clear up some issues.

Picking out the minor artifacts was to show that 173k was tame in gp value (and power) to a minor artifact, that's all.

DT's character as written has no bonuses from equipment at all, and I'd be happy with playing him that way. The hilt, mask, and robes were just to add utility and defense. Hilt adds nothing to attack or damage. I feel I followed the spirit of the instructions, I just had misunderstood the minor artifact comment.

He has the skill and a mythic ability to craft the hilt. The other things other players had said they would craft on my character's behalf. If that isn't allowed, fine.

Asking to see Monkeygod's sword wasn't a challenge, either. I just wanted to see an example of what you guys are looking for, and I can scale my stuff to fit.

This really isn't in any way a big deal, nor will I "cry" if it's not allowed.

I will be honest, Kryz's hilt seems OK to me. My suggestion is keep it as is for right now and if selected be open to any alterations we deem appropriate.

I think a cap of around 250-300k on one item sounds reasonable. We are epic after all, so I think a bit more of a higher than average limit is acceptable. But this is not final atm.

Finally, Fnords review process works for me.

That works.

I apologize if I came across as being antagonistic to you kryzbyn, that was not intended.

I was speaking of what I have seen in the past.

The reason I want to avoid the direct offense/defense is that I will have enough issues with challenging encounters with the characters as is.

I like the crystal hilt allowing to change damage type. This isn't increasing the damage done.

It's alright, I understand. I'm running a high powered game and know how easy it is to lose control of the game.

So aside from the base Holy Avenger, it will have Speed and Keen as well, which will obviously come out of my ABP(I believe this is possible). Those equal +4, so I will probably add one other interesting special property.

Beyond that, I'm thinking that while Bane is in effect, its crit multiplier is increased(this isn't fully necessary). It will also have the following extra effects when it crits, based on type struck:

Evil Outsider: Banishment, with the sword being treated as if it were 3 items the fiend hates/opposes.

Undead: Widened Undeath to Death, with perhaps no cap on HD affected.

Evil Dragons: Thinking some sort of breath weapon suppression effect, perhaps coupled with a lowering of their SR. Both would be temporary.

I have a few other ideas, but this is currently what I'm planning.

I was thinking of going a whole other root with Sapphire and have a signature item linked to her very mind. I had this made idea yesterday when someone said your PCs like a mix of the scarlet witch and The Vision.

That got me thinking what of the Elan Council and attempted the Elan transformation on an Android (16 RP) you would end up with this made mix. A Psionic capable built Construct, with its mind held in its signature item some from of mind-stone / power-stone, holding its Mythic power.
This artifact was part of its creation processes. She would become one of a kind. What other things it dos, I have not thought fully about yet. But thinking it helped her with ML or getting past SR/PR or adds Meta-Psionic feats in some way, with some paid for stuff from the Psionic universal items list. But in a nutshell the Mind-stone gives her, her Metamind mythic powers. Losing it would strip away her mythic ability's.

I'm also going to blend her race now to make an Android-Elan, with 40RP that's more than do-able :) mad idea but fun.

Well, a base Holy Avenger would require you to have two points in Legendary Gift weapon to be able to use it as a +5 Holy Weapon. At base, it'd just be a +3 Holy Weapon.

It'd require a total enhancement bonus of +11 to allow you to have +5 Holy Speed Keen.

Whenever the item you're wielding has special properties, it reduces the enhancement bonus. That's how the ABP rules work. "For example, if a character with a +3 enhancement bonus from weapon attunement wields a keen scimitar, she subtracts 1 point of her enhancement bonus (for the cost of keen), leaving her with a +2 keen scimitar."

You forgot the following paragraph Illia, literally right after the one you quoted:

In this system, adding bonus-equivalent special abilities to items costs significantly less because you are paying only for the special ability, not for a base enhancement bonus (see the table below). To determine the price of specific weapons and armor, remove the flat enhancement bonus and reduce the item's cost by the amount listed on the table below. For example, a flame tongue is normally worth 20,715 gp, but under this system, it would lose its +1 enhancement bonus and its price would be reduced to 18,715 gp. Specific weapons and armor can be attuned; they then grant the character's enhancement bonuses from weapon attunement and armor attunement as normal.

Thus, I can pay out of pocket, for Keen and Speed, if I didn't have enough points via the ABP bonuses.

Thus, I can pay out of pocket, for Keen and Speed, if I didn't have enough points via the ABP bonuses.

ButI think you're missing:

"For example, if a character with a +3 enhancement bonus from weapon attunement wields a keen scimitar, she subtracts 1 point of her enhancement bonus (for the cost of keen), leaving her with a +2 keen scimitar."

If you want +5, Keen, and Speed, you're absolutely taking some legendary gifts, no matter how much you pay.

Also, putting all those at-will SLAs on crits adds a pretty ridiculous amount of value to the weapon. Just for the first two you mention (Heightened Banishment + Widened Undeath to Death) you're paying 612k to stick at-will on an item; while "crits-only" seems like a limitation, it lets you cast spells as a free action, about once per round, making it easier to use than command word.

I've avoided creating new at-will spell items (instead combining existing items, with cost rules) as I know I personally would have far too much to abuse if I let myself. (This is especially true with psionics, where the biggest power limitation is the inability to take both a bunch of high level powers and a bajillion levels in other things)

Am I the only one reading the above quoted paragraph as allowing you to add on special properties via spending the difference?

If I am somehow wrong in my interpretation, what teh heckie is that paragraph for then?

Also those aren't at will spell likes. There will be more limitations as I work this out, and they won't really be as useful vs CR appropriate foes, more just nifty ways to handle weak stuff we can roflstomp as is.

However, please bear in mind: For 25k gold, any enemy has a flat 75% chance to negate these effects via Heavy Fortification.

As I plan on basing this on Inquisitor, since it keys off of Bane, I will be using my levels in that class for my caster level check to beat SR.

Which means, the total maximum I can get is +37 which is the exact same any normal 17th level character would get without all these crazy rules.

A base Pit Fiend has SR 31, which means I need to roll a 14 or higher. However, the mythic pit fiend has a SR of 36, and that's without any on the fly bonuses.

There's lots of ways to defeat these abilities, and as I said, they aren't intended to be effective against encounters of our level.

It's only special properties that *DON'T* add +N to your weapons/armor; those are handled differently. (Hence you can't just spend 25k to get fortification; you also lose -3 off your armor bonus)

I'm not saying you've chosen necessarily always powerful abilities (they're REALLY not, the save DCs will be terrible), just that they're wayyyyy stronger and more costly by the core system than any normal minor artifact. Maybe swap them out for something more general; e.g. casting "dispel evil/good/law/chaos" on a crit against an aligned outsider, dispel magic on any spellcaster, and bane against any other enemy.

* * *

Also, the item needs a caster level. You definitely can't use your class CL vs SR for an item's caster level check; otherwise the Inquisitor's Penetrating Inquisition would let you abuse it.

Geez, part of the first post seems awfully familiar to another big game, MG. :p

Profile, now with hand drawn pic!

Hello! This is Fendrith. MonkeyGod gave me permission to limp in with an entry several days ago. I've been dragging my feet because of thanksgiving. I saw the post by Fnord that covered what was expected in the character concept post... there was no statement about formatting so I used the Ten Minute Background format. It's a bit expanded. I also haven't included the memories component yet.

I wanted to get a general response on the character concept before I started bothering with statting out a 25th level gestalt mythic character. Let me know what you think!

*Edit* - Background etc are in the profile. The Plan is to Kensai Bladebound Fiendflayer | Arcanist/Eldritch Knight. Still working out the details pending general concept approval.

I should also note that I certainly made up locations and storylines in the background that aren't unique to Golarion - those aren't essential, obviously.

Perhaps I missed it, but do we know when final player decisions will be made? If I make it I plan to dive head first into this no doubt lengthy character creation process.

auran, eldritch knight is not allowed unless you take it on both sides. Any classes that effectively combine two classes (especially a caster class) are not allowed in gestalt only on one side.

Sorry, my GM typically houserules that's not the case, so I forgot. Essentially makes EK, Mystic Theurge, Rage Prophet, and other such classes worthless as they're significantly devalued over just taking two separate classes in a gestalt system.

If it's classes in general, that makes the magus count as two sides as well?

Perhaps I missed it, but do we know when final player decisions will be made? If I make it I plan to dive head first into this no doubt lengthy character creation process.

No, not yet. Soon, though.

@Auran If that makes you feel better.

1) Magus isn't a prestige class.
2) Magus isn't a full caster class.
3) Your GM's houserules don't apply here.
4) A gestalt character can’t combine two prestige classes at any level, although it’s okay to combine a prestige class and a regular class. Prestige classes that are essentially class combinations-such as the arcane trickster, mystic theurge, and eldritch knight-should be prohibited if you’re using gestalt classes, because they unduly complicate the game balance of what’s already a high-powered variant.

1. That is, specifically, why I asked if this applied to general classes as well since you didn't specify prestige or not in your original post.

2. Obviously. You didn't specify *full* caster either in your original post.

3. Double obviously - I was simply stating that I had a momentary lapse due to this being different than what I'm used to.

4. I'm familiar with the gestalt rules. As I said, I was just used to it being house-ruled differently.

Anyway the EK isn't a clincher of my build that's a deal breaker. No problem at all. Some feedback on the character concept would be appreciated.

You forgot the following paragraph Illia, literally right after the one you quoted:

In this system, adding bonus-equivalent special abilities to items costs significantly less because you are paying only for the special ability, not for a base enhancement bonus (see the table below). To determine the price of specific weapons and armor, remove the flat enhancement bonus and reduce the item's cost by the amount listed on the table below. For example, a flame tongue is normally worth 20,715 gp, but under this system, it would lose its +1 enhancement bonus and its price would be reduced to 18,715 gp. Specific weapons and armor can be attuned; they then grant the character's enhancement bonuses from weapon attunement and armor attunement as normal.

Thus, I can pay out of pocket, for Keen and Speed, if I didn't have enough points via the ABP bonuses.

You are indeed incorrect. The purpose of that paragraph is to allow you to have special abilities at all. Normally, you can't unless you use Legendary Gifts.

"If a character doesn't have enough of an enhancement bonus to afford the special ability (such as a 4th-level character with a vorpal longsword), she can still use the weapon's power on its own, but the weapon gains no enhancement bonus."

You put +6 worth of bonuses on your sword, and you have an ABP value of +5. When you pick up that weapon, it's still got +6 worth of bonuses... But +0 enhancement.

In other words, the bonuses you put on your weapons with money, and the bonuses you put on your weapons with ABP don't stack. You take the better progression.

Which is why I'm going to skip the whole issue with Greater Magic Weapon if that's still in the game.

Hmm. That said, I've got some extra cash left over from prismatic sphere being invalid, so I might buy a specific magic armor/weapon power (since I didn't realize that was an option to stick on my ABP)