So what are the odds these 3.5 gems will come back in Pathfinder?


Pathfinder RPG General Discussion

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Mindflayer / Illithid: Psychic brain eating monster from Cthulhus fan-art collection. I know actual D&D holds a copyright on these guys but come on. We have Psychic classes in the game now and need some Psychic monsters. And these guys are THE Psychic monster. I am sure someone can come up with a replacement version for Pathfinder. Maybe they have proboscis instead of a mouth, tentacles for hair, three eyes, eight fingers per hand, neon-blue skin, and five arms the fifth being in the middle of their chest, and bone like scythes for its four legs. There take it and make some Psychic brain eating monsters.

Sadly, mind flayers are not OGL. They have been copyrighted, even thought they are blatantly plagiarized from H.P. Lovecraft, who invented old ones in 1926. One of the s$@+tiest moves Gary Gygax ever made was claiming the he invented the things.


WhiteMagus2000 wrote:
Mindflayer / Illithid: Psychic brain eating monster from Cthulhus fan-art collection. I know actual D&D holds a copyright on these guys but come on. We have Psychic classes in the game now and need some Psychic monsters. And these guys are THE Psychic monster. I am sure someone can come up with a replacement version for Pathfinder. Maybe they have proboscis instead of a mouth, tentacles for hair, three eyes, eight fingers per hand, neon-blue skin, and five arms the fifth being in the middle of their chest, and bone like scythes for its four legs. There take it and make some Psychic brain eating monsters.
Sadly, mind flayers are not OGL. They have been copyrighted, even thought they are blatantly plagiarized from H.P. Lovecraft, who invented old ones in 1926. One of the s++$tiest moves Gary Gygax ever made was claiming the he invented the things.

The phrenic scourge from Dreamscarred Press covers this, rather well.

You'll even find winks and nods to them existing in some of the monsters that are related, but not copyright protected, such as the Neothelid.

I actually just got done running a whole campaign based on them, and I used different versions from homebrewed updates (from Lords of Madness) and the existing versions that I found in my copy of Psionics Unleashed.

I could see one of the newer races that got introduced to go along with the psychic stuff being incorporated into something bigger, I think the Astomoi was one of them? Perhaps there are better examples.


Diffan wrote:

"Monkey Grip: Let you hold a two-handed weapon in one hand. This one was OP as hell but you could probably balance it out with a STR 18-20 requirement or worse... probably worse."

OP? You take a -2 penalty for an average of +2.5 or 3 damage (large longsword does 2d6, odds are you roll a 7). Nah its not that bad.

Yep. It's a pretty bad feat. Until you get into size category bootstrapping, or put it on a much larger creature.

If you're getting multiple size boosts, the damage boost can become much more significant. Start with a butchering axe (3d6), get Monkey Grip (4d6), cast Enlarge Person (6d6), so now you have a feat for +7 damage at a -2 penalty. But it's such a specific condition that there are few ways to really take advantage.

If you're allowing Path of War, stack that Primal Rage stance that treats weapons as two size categories larger, put it on a Rageshaper Shifter for +3 size categories at max level, and I see nothing in Devastating Form that prevents it from stacking with Enlarge Person. That Butchering Axe becomes 16d6. Monkey Grip would take it to 24d6. And, while we're drawing from 3.X, heavy weapon proficiency would make your Colossal+1 golden butchering axe deal 32d6 damage. Also, you're literally a kaiju at this point.


I'd like Benign Transposition and Malign Transposition to come back as spells. I loved the tactical possibilities of those spells, allowing you to switch the positions of willing allies on the battlefield, for the former spell, and of anyone on the battlefield, for the latter spell.

Sczarni

I did like the fact that the Zen Archery feat from 3.5 made it into PF, albeit as a monk archetype instead of a feat. One feat I kind of wished would make a comeback though?

Flying Kick
Prereq: Improved Unarmed Strike
Benefit: When you charge and end in a unarmed strike, you do an additional 1d12 damage.

It's such an elegant answer to the question of "what does a monk do when he's not close enough to flurry?" as well as a flavorful option.


Silent Saturn wrote:
I did like the fact that the Zen Archery feat from 3.5 made it into PF, albeit as a monk archetype instead of a feat.

It's still a feat if you're a priest of Erastil.

Grand Lodge

Silent Saturn wrote:

I did like the fact that the Zen Archery feat from 3.5 made it into PF, albeit as a monk archetype instead of a feat. One feat I kind of wished would make a comeback though?

Flying Kick
Prereq: Improved Unarmed Strike
Benefit: When you charge and end in a unarmed strike, you do an additional 1d12 damage.

It's such an elegant answer to the question of "what does a monk do when he's not close enough to flurry?" as well as a flavorful option.

Check out the Pummeling Charge feat and the Unchained Monk's flying kick style strike.


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WhiteMagus2000 wrote:
Sadly, mind flayers are not OGL. They have been copyrighted, even thought they are blatantly plagiarized from H.P. Lovecraft, who invented old ones in 1926. One of the s++@tiest moves Gary Gygax ever made was claiming the he invented the things.

Lovecraft wasn't the only (or even the first) writer from the pulp era who created tentacled monsters with psychic powers; he just created the ones whose names are most widely known today. IMO (as a huge Lovecraft junkie), mind flayers are different enough from any specific Cthulhu Mythos creature to justify Wizards of the Coast reserving them as their own intellectual property. (To be fair, they didn't have to create the OGL at all, did they?)

I, too, been looking for a suitable substitute for mind flayers in Pathfinder. One of the v.3.0 books for Green Ronin's Freeport setting included a mind flayer pirate, but the one or two references to Cuttleblack in later books couldn't give his race or stats. I'd love to find a way to update him to PF in a fully OGL-legal way. That Phrenic Scourge might do the trick.


Tim Emrick wrote:
WhiteMagus2000 wrote:
Sadly, mind flayers are not OGL. They have been copyrighted, even thought they are blatantly plagiarized from H.P. Lovecraft, who invented old ones in 1926. One of the s++@tiest moves Gary Gygax ever made was claiming the he invented the things.

Lovecraft wasn't the only (or even the first) writer from the pulp era who created tentacled monsters with psychic powers; he just created the ones whose names are most widely known today. IMO (as a huge Lovecraft junkie), mind flayers are different enough from any specific Cthulhu Mythos creature to justify Wizards of the Coast reserving them as their own intellectual property. (To be fair, they didn't have to create the OGL at all, did they?)

I, too, been looking for a suitable substitute for mind flayers in Pathfinder. One of the v.3.0 books for Green Ronin's Freeport setting included a mind flayer pirate, but the one or two references to Cuttleblack in later books couldn't give his race or stats. I'd love to find a way to update him to PF in a fully OGL-legal way. That Phrenic Scourge might do the trick.

There's also the Thulid, from the Book of Forbidden Lore, for which I believe forum guidelines require me to advise a Google search.


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There's so much good, well-balanced 3pp for Pathfinder, and it's sad that more people don't allow it.
The problem, I think, is that back in 3.0/3.5 the bulk of 3pp was total garbage, that companies rushed into production just because they could try and make a buck off the OGL. This left such a bad taste in peoples mouths that they won't give the new 3pp stuff a chance...which is understandable, but also a real shame.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

It's also a matter of play-accessibility.

I play a bunch of PFS, because I can find games to play.

The 'home' group (we're at home and connected via the Internet when we play?) has pretty much burnt out on d20 systems.

This means that my chances to utilize any 3PP are between zero and none.

This is not to say that the 3PP has worsened or improved over time, but that I am unfortunately not their target audience.

Please do not presume that it's a quality issue when the reasons could be more complex than that.

Sczarni

Has Paizo ever released an equivalent to the Favored Soul? I never actually got to see that one in use in 3.5, except when I briefly played D&D Online-- none of the groups I played with had whichever book it was printed in originally. I'm not even sure I'd recognize PF's interpretation.


Silent Saturn wrote:
Has Paizo ever released an equivalent to the Favored Soul? I never actually got to see that one in use in 3.5, except when I briefly played D&D Online-- none of the groups I played with had whichever book it was printed in originally. I'm not even sure I'd recognize PF's interpretation.

isn't that what the oracle is, cha based spontaneous divine caster?


Wei Ji the Learner wrote:


Please do not presume that it's a quality issue when the reasons could be more complex than that.

Please do not presume that it's not a quality issue when the reasons could be just that simple.

But seriously, I appreciate that your experiences were different than mine, and I hope that you eventually find a way to utilize some of the awesome 3pp content out there.


Silent Saturn wrote:
Has Paizo ever released an equivalent to the Favored Soul? I never actually got to see that one in use in 3.5, except when I briefly played D&D Online-- none of the groups I played with had whichever book it was printed in originally. I'm not even sure I'd recognize PF's interpretation.

Favored Soul was basically Oracle without class features, and with a split casting stat. It wasn't bad, but it was dull.

Paizo Employee Customer Service Manager

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Removed a post and replies. No need to get insulting over what books other people enjoy.


There were a fair few magic items in the 3.5 item compendium that never seemed to get equivalents in PF, mostly ones that were out of combat fluff - e. g. Magic Bedroll, Personal Oasis, Spool of endless rope and my favourite, the Ring of Arming. There were also item sets, where wearing multiple components of the set gave additional bonuses

Overall I think PF is a better system, but there is something missing in terms of frivolous/flavour items that aren't overly expensive.


Neriathale wrote:
Spool of endless rope

We have the robe of infinite twine in UE.

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