Will an invisible character provoke an AoO?


Rules Questions

Silver Crusade

If an invisible creature leaves a square threatened by a creature with scent does that provoke an AoO?

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

With 5 ft you have it pinpointed.

You can make an AoO when it leaves a square you have it pinpointed.

But you still have the 50% miss chance because you can't see it.


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James, you cannot perform an AoO on any creature that has total concealment. Pinpointing an invisible creature does not negate the total concealment.

CRB p197 wrote:

Total Concealment: If you have line of effect to a target but not line of sight, he is considered to have total concealment from you. You can’t attack an opponent that has total concealment, though you can attack into a square that you think he occupies. A successful attack into a square occupied by an enemy with total concealment has a 50% miss chance (instead of the normal 20% miss chance for an opponent with concealment).

You can’t execute an attack of opportunity against an opponent with total concealment, even if you know what square or squares the opponent occupies.

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

Gauss wrote:
James, you cannot perform an AoO on any creature that has total concealment. Pinpointing an invisible creature does not negate the total concealment.

Good point.

I'd forgotten that rule.


So the answer is: Unless you have some way of negating the total concealment (ie see invis or true seeing) then you don't get an AoO.

Grand Lodge

Lifat wrote:
So the answer is: Unless you have some way of negating the total concealment (ie see invis or true seeing) then you don't get an AoO.

How about a Seeking weapon, Snap Shot, and Scent?


Seeking negates miss chances, such as from Concealment. That doesn't meant that it negates Concealment entirely.


kinevon wrote:
Lifat wrote:
So the answer is: Unless you have some way of negating the total concealment (ie see invis or true seeing) then you don't get an AoO.
How about a Seeking weapon, Snap Shot, and Scent?

While a Seeking weapon would hit, it doesn't remove the total concealment from the target, neither does scent, so still no AoO.

I think you'd need Gr Blind Fight to reduce the concealment relative to you, or equivalent ability depending on exactly how they are concealed.


Archaeik wrote:
kinevon wrote:
Lifat wrote:
So the answer is: Unless you have some way of negating the total concealment (ie see invis or true seeing) then you don't get an AoO.
How about a Seeking weapon, Snap Shot, and Scent?

While a Seeking weapon would hit, it doesn't remove the total concealment from the target, neither does scent, so still no AoO.

I think you'd need Gr Blind Fight to reduce the concealment relative to you, or equivalent ability depending on exactly how they are concealed.

@Kinevon: I actually like your question. It comes close, but as scent only allows you to pin point the square that the person is in you are still suffering from total concealment, which means no AoO... Now the seeking ability would remove the concealment part when you actually fire... But YOU have to fire and that only happens when you have an attack, and scent simply doesn't grant you that, not even when combined with snap shot.

You could choose to houserule it though and both as a player and as a GM, I wouldn't mind that too much.

Grand Lodge

Hmmm. How about having cast a true strike?

Quote:
You gain temporary, intuitive insight into the immediate future during your next attack. Your next single attack roll (if it is made before the end of the next round) gains a +20 insight bonus. Additionally, you are not affected by the miss chance that applies to attackers trying to strike a concealed target.

Probably not...


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kinevon wrote:

Hmmm. How about having cast a true strike?

Quote:
You gain temporary, intuitive insight into the immediate future during your next attack. Your next single attack roll (if it is made before the end of the next round) gains a +20 insight bonus. Additionally, you are not affected by the miss chance that applies to attackers trying to strike a concealed target.
Probably not...

It runs into the same problem - inability to see the target. Attacks of Opportunity events presume that the character can see that their target has dropped their guard, enabling the free attack. Keep that in mind and these questions become fairly easy.

Your regular attacks may ignore the concealment, but in order to make use of the opportunity he gives you to make an attack, you have to see that he gives you one in the first place.

Sczarni

"A creature with the scent ability can detect an invisible creature as it would a visible one." Which begs the question: does that mean they can basically "see" them with their nose, negating the concealment?

Answer is "no." If you read the scent ability, they just have an easier time pinpointing the invisible person (and don't need to roll perception). The person is still invisible (50% concealment), just automatically pinpointed.


There seems to be some confusion regarding people thinking that a 50% miss chance results in Total Concealment. However the reverse is actually true, Total Concealment results in 50% miss chance.

This is an important distinction. While you can reduce or even negate the 50% that results from Total Concealment you are not actually negating the Total Concealment unless the ability states it does.

You cannot perform an AoO against a target that has Total Concealment regardless of the miss chance unless you actually negate the Total Concealment itself.

Example 1: True Strike will not negate Total Concealment although it will negate the miss chance.
Thus, you cannot make an AoO against someone with Total Concealment even if you have True Strike active.

Example 2: Greater Blind-Fight will negate Total Concealment because it states it treats it as normal Concealment.
Thus, you can make an AoO against someone with Total Concealment because, for you, it is not Total Concealment.

Summary: Altering the concealment percentage does not alter the category that percentage is derived from unless specific rules state it does.


That is an interesting distinction, and I think you are right. True Strike means that you can automatically bypass the miss chance if you take an attack, but it doesn't tell you about the opening.

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