To see, but not to see. That is the question

[Ravingdork]

Dominate Person spell description wrote:

By concentrating fully on the spell (a standard action), you can receive full sensory input as interpreted by the mind of the subject, though it still can't communicate with you. You can't actually see through the subject's eyes, so it's not as good as being there yourself, but you still get a good idea of what's going on.

Uh, so what exactly happens? Can you see or not? This paragraphs seems vague, confusing, and borderline contradictory. Does the creature's senses (darkvision, tremorsense, etc.) effect it at all?

In short, how is this actually meant to work?

[zieretole]

It's definitely an...odd wording. My interpretation is that it means you take their perception roll (including any vision/sense factors) instead of getting to roll your own, since you only would notice things that they notice. The wording is too vague for me to even call that RAI though, just the way I would houserule it.

[wraithstrike]

I would just say you have their knowledge of what is going on. As an example if they see and smell a giant then you know a giant is there, and you get the smell also, but you don't actually see what they see. The other sense work just as if you were there however.

[Lost In Limbo]

I agree with zieretole, you are being sent images from the dominated creatures mind, not actually directly using their senses.

So for instance, if they failed their save against an illusion you would see the illusion as real just as they're perceiving it. Likewise if they can't make out something far away because of a poor Perception check you're stuck with that blurry image.

[Imbicatus]

You get the knowledge of it, but not the actual sight. It's like reading cliff notes. You get a summary description, but you might miss key details.

[Calybos1]

It means you get a direct data uplink to Geordi's visor and see exactly what he sees, without the ability to interpret the signals.

No, wait... wrong system.

[Berinor]

You know about things the subject knows about, whether they're through its vision, tremorsense, etc. I think that's clear from "input as interpreted by the mind of the subject".

You can recognize things the subject can recognize. For example, you'd know their family on sight.

Things the subject can't recognize, but you can, will be a mixed bag. For example, I can speak English and German. If somebody were dominating me, they could understand text I could see that was English or German. If there were text in Spanish and the dominator understood that Spanish, we could probably get by because I can convey the words, if not their meaning. If there was something written in Greek or Russian, we'd have trouble because I don't have a means to convey the "words".

I can probably also recognize the king based on what the subject can tell. I might not be able to tell the difference between him and his identical twin brother, even if I know them well enough to recognize minor differences from my senses.

[Cuup]

I'm interpreting this like you're on the phone with the creature you've dominated, who's describing everything to you based on their perception of the situation.

Caster: OK, now what's happening?

Subject: Uhh, there's a big old skeleton laying on the floor. It has four arms, and an old satchel around its shoulder. It smells like rotten eggs in here, and the temperature keeps fluctuating.

Caster: OK, take the satchel. What's in it?

Subject: Ahh! I'm in pain!

Caster: Did something attack you??

Subject: I can't see anything! Ahh pain!!

Then the subject dies. If you were there, maybe you could have seen what happened, but as it is, your info is a little sketchy.

[Claxon]

I interpet it as, you are aware of anything the subject is aware of.

So, if the subject is looking for clues you will know of anything he finds, but if misses the knife in the corner you wont know it's there either.

For anything major that couldn't be missed, I would essentially consider it like being there and experiencing it yourself. It's the minutiae that might be missed.

[Dark Lord Fluffy]

zieretole wrote:

It's definitely an...odd wording. My interpretation is that it means you take their perception roll (including any vision/sense factors) instead of getting to roll your own, since you only would notice things that they notice. The wording is too vague for me to even call that RAI though, just the way I would houserule it.

^^This^^

Basically you get a feed of what the creature senses and what it knows about those senses. You can make decisions based on that knowledge and may know things about it that the subject doesn't, but you can't get details about the information the subject didn't perceive.

Going back to the language example, if the subject was trying to pay careful attention to someone speaking a language he didn't know you could make it out the words if you knew the language, though there may be some slip ups as it may difficulty perceiving unfamiliar sounds. However if you don't force the dominated creature to pay careful attention you would just get a string of gibberish with maybe the occasional clear word as the creature isn't properly processing the words it doesn't understand. In the opposite manner, if the creature is speaking a language you don't know, as long as the creature does you would get a full understanding of it even if the sounds don't make sense since the creature is providing the interpretation itself. For written languages I don't see in issue. Unless it's in a rush, it should have time to scrutinize and pass that information along just like the letters were a series of images.

[Cevah]

Dominate a rich person.
You don't see the servants except when they get in the way.

Dominate a bibliophile.
If there are books around, you see nothing but books.

Dominate an attack dog.
You see a few "known" wonderful beings, and lots of potential targets, but you don't notice the pile of gold coins because it is not food, a friend, or a target.

You "see" what the creature "sees" with their mind, not their eyes. If they pay no attention to the man in the corner, then you don't see him either.

/cevah