so is the no THF while TWF thing official?

[Bill Dunn]

Robert A Matthews wrote:

I read through some of the threads on this and I have wondered something, why do people keep mentioning barbazu beard? It has nothing to do with two handed weapons. The barbazu beard is only usable when it hots with both claw attacks

Not the devil and his beard. The helmet weapon. Barbazu Beard

[Crash_00]

The barbazu is also an exotic weapon. It is a helm with a metal beardlike spike on it that you can attack with.

What makes it a special case is that it requires no hands (Primary or Off Hand) to wield, so your off hand is still free to be used on a two handed weapon.

To balance it's uniqueness, it provokes an AoO every time you attack with it, and it is treated as a natural weapon if you use it against something that damages things attacking it with natural weapons (because you'e essentially chin butting your target).

As to how explicit this was, it wasn't explicit at all. It was understandable if you carefully read the rules in their entirety, but the 3.5 devs eventually decided to go with what they felt was the route most people would understand (because so many people misinterpreted the rules) instead of the rules in the books. The Pathfinder team apparently decided to follow the way the game is written and how everything else in the game works. Props to them.

[Claxon]

All I know is I see a bunch of people whining about how they can't use their "sub-optimal" two handed weapon and armored spike builds anymore like you stole candy from some little kid.

I think the ruling that was made is the common sense interpretation of the rules, and only because of ambiguity with the rules as they were written did the two-handed/no hand weapon combinaiton seem viable.

[gourry187]

looking into it further, and I want to get this straight ... a shield (light or heavy but not buckler) fill the "off hand" as well. So if you are using a shield and a longsword (example), the only "off hand" you could make is a shield bash (assuming your primary attack was with the longsword)?

So ...
Two Handed weapons use both "primary" and "off-hand"
a shield fills up the "off-hand" when used in conjunction with another weapon (sword and board)

[Nicos]

gourry187 wrote:

looking into it further, and I want to get this straight ... a shield (light or heavy but not buckler) fill the "off hand" as well. So if you are using a shield and a longsword (example), the only "off hand" you could make is a shield bash (assuming your primary attack was with the longsword)?

So ...
Two Handed weapons use both "primary" and "off-hand"
a shield fills up the "off-hand" when used in conjunction with another weapon (sword and board)

Not by the book, not by the FAQ.

[Kryzbyn]

No, it's more saying that you cant TWF with a THW becasue both of your "hands" are occupied on a single weapon.

[Claxon]

gourry187 wrote:

looking into it further, and I want to get this straight ... a shield (light or heavy but not buckler) fill the "off hand" as well. So if you are using a shield and a longsword (example), the only "off hand" you could make is a shield bash (assuming your primary attack was with the longsword)?

So ...
Two Handed weapons use both "primary" and "off-hand"
a shield fills up the "off-hand" when used in conjunction with another weapon (sword and board)

It appears, for instance you could wield a longsword and have a shield as well as wield armor spikes. You could then TWF with a longsword and armor spikes I beileve, while keeping you AC bonus from the shield.

However, it seems like if you have the feats to spare (which I think only the fighter does) that it's better to actually use the shield bash.

[Crash_00]

A shield does not require you "off hand." Instead it creates a Shield Hand. Remember that off hand does not refer to an actual hand. It's just a mechanics term.

[Darth Grall]

Claxon wrote:

gourry187 wrote:

looking into it further, and I want to get this straight ... a shield (light or heavy but not buckler) fill the "off hand" as well. So if you are using a shield and a longsword (example), the only "off hand" you could make is a shield bash (assuming your primary attack was with the longsword)?

So ...
Two Handed weapons use both "primary" and "off-hand"
a shield fills up the "off-hand" when used in conjunction with another weapon (sword and board)

It appears, for instance you could wield a longsword and have a shield as well as wield armor spikes. You could then TWF with a longsword and armor spikes I beileve, while keeping you AC bonus from the shield.

However, it seems like if you have the feats to spare (which I think only the fighter does) that it's better to actually use the shield bash.

That's a weird way to think about it all lol.

[Claxon]

Darth Grall wrote:

Claxon wrote:

gourry187 wrote:

looking into it further, and I want to get this straight ... a shield (light or heavy but not buckler) fill the "off hand" as well. So if you are using a shield and a longsword (example), the only "off hand" you could make is a shield bash (assuming your primary attack was with the longsword)?

So ...
Two Handed weapons use both "primary" and "off-hand"
a shield fills up the "off-hand" when used in conjunction with another weapon (sword and board)

It appears, for instance you could wield a longsword and have a shield as well as wield armor spikes. You could then TWF with a longsword and armor spikes I beileve, while keeping you AC bonus from the shield.

However, it seems like if you have the feats to spare (which I think only the fighter does) that it's better to actually use the shield bash.

That's a weird way to think about it all lol.

True, but that does appear to be how it works.