Can Evil Oracles Channel Positive Energy?

[KingofB]

Getting into a rules debate with someone. He says that an evil life oracle cannot channel positive energy because it says "channels like a cleric" and clerics can only channel positive energy if they are good or neutral. However, as I said, it specifically says you Channel Positive Energy, "like a cleric," meaning you channel positive energy, using the channel positive energy ability. Can someone clear this up?

[cartmanbeck]

You are correct, it specifies positive energy. Make sure to point out that positive energy is not necessarily "good", nor is negative energy "evil". A good cleric can prepare inflict spells, which use negative energy, and an evil cleric can prepare cure spells.

[blackbloodtroll]

Oracles have no alignment restriction when it comes to channel. Being an Oracle is more of a curse than a choice, so flavor wise, you are not restricted either.

[oneplus999]

I think the bigger concern is, why is an evil character an oracle of life? It's justifiable, but not something you would expect.

Definitely nothing limiting it by RAW, though.

[Mergy]

I could picture an evil oracle of life. He would be self-serving, and might enjoy watching his allies inflict cruelty. Maybe he could work as an assistant to a torturer to get the prisoners back in fighting shape for another round of torment.

[cartmanbeck]

Mergy wrote:

I could picture an evil oracle of life. He would be self-serving, and might enjoy watching his allies inflict cruelty. Maybe he could work as an assistant to a torturer to get the prisoners back in fighting shape for another round of torment.

In an evil party, an evil oracle of life would make perfect sense. Especially lawful evil. You're required to follow orders, and your orders from the higher ups is to keep your party members alive. Every society has healers, even inherently evil ones.

[Banecrow]

While it is not something you would normally see, it can happen. People are right that being an oracle can be considered a curse. As a side note if the player is some sort of neutral, such as Neutral Evil or Lawful Neutral or Neutral Good etc. they can also take the Versitle Channeling feat (think that is the name). It allows them to channel the other type of energy but as if they were 2 levels lower.

[darkwarriorkarg]

Banecrow wrote:

While it is not something you would normally see, it can happen. People are right that being an oracle can be considered a curse. As a side note if the player is some sort of neutral, such as Neutral Evil or Lawful Neutral or Neutral Good etc. they can also take the Versitle Channeling feat (think that is the name). It allows them to channel the other type of energy but as if they were 2 levels lower.

I read that as lawful neutral, true neutral and chaotic neutral only.

[Banecrow]

darkwarriorkarg wrote:

Banecrow wrote:

While it is not something you would normally see, it can happen. People are right that being an oracle can be considered a curse. As a side note if the player is some sort of neutral, such as Neutral Evil or Lawful Neutral or Neutral Good etc. they can also take the Versitle Channeling feat (think that is the name). It allows them to channel the other type of energy but as if they were 2 levels lower.

I read that as lawful neutral, true neutral and chaotic neutral only.

You can of course house rule it but by the rules, any neutral character is allowed to take the feat. Have a NG Oracle in my game who is all about the different channeling types who I let take it.

[darkwarriorkarg]

Banecrow wrote:

You can of course house rule it but by the rules, any neutral character is allowed to take the feat. Have a NG Oracle in my game who is all about the different channeling types who I let take it.

Apologies, you are correct.

What a useful thing to know...

[Mergy]

Banecrow wrote:

darkwarriorkarg wrote:

Banecrow wrote:

While it is not something you would normally see, it can happen. People are right that being an oracle can be considered a curse. As a side note if the player is some sort of neutral, such as Neutral Evil or Lawful Neutral or Neutral Good etc. they can also take the Versitle Channeling feat (think that is the name). It allows them to channel the other type of energy but as if they were 2 levels lower.

I read that as lawful neutral, true neutral and chaotic neutral only.

You can of course house rule it but by the rules, any neutral character is allowed to take the feat. Have a NG Oracle in my game who is all about the different channeling types who I let take it.

I think you're wrong about this. Yes, neutral good is a neutral alignment, so that would be kosher, except there is the last part of the feat:

Quote:

Note: This feat only applies to necromancers, neutral clerics who worship neutral deities, or neutral clerics who do not worship a deity—characters who have the channel energy class ability and have to make a choice to channel positive or negative energy at 1st level. Clerics whose alignment or deity makes this choice for them cannot select this feat.

From my reading of this, a neutral good oracle would be able to take this feat, but not a neutral good cleric who worships a neutral deity, because his alignment made the choice for him.

[KingofB]

My example of an evil character who is a life oracle is an anatomist. He goes around killing things like goblins, animals, bandits etc, so he can take their bodies and examine their organs. He will also take them alive, and literally vivisect them. (He is Vivisectionist Alchemist Godling with the Divine Portfolio trait, with Life as his Portfolio.) He actually has a genuine interest in life, but it's closer to a personification of evolution or predation: He is a lawful evil person who believes that the world should favor the strongest. His method of determining who is the strongest? Evolution. Who has the best traits? Keep them alive. They should reproduce. They should dominate. All other life should live in fear of the alpha predators.

[The Black Bard]

When you consider the kind of chaos and drama that usually breaks out when some "normal" person suddenly gains the ability to heal the sick and wounded and infirm, I'd say its more surprising that there aren't MORE evil oracles of life.

Desperation brings out the worst in people, and few are more desperate than the sick and dying.

[Austin Morgan]

Mergy wrote:

Banecrow wrote:

darkwarriorkarg wrote:

Banecrow wrote:

While it is not something you would normally see, it can happen. People are right that being an oracle can be considered a curse. As a side note if the player is some sort of neutral, such as Neutral Evil or Lawful Neutral or Neutral Good etc. they can also take the Versitle Channeling feat (think that is the name). It allows them to channel the other type of energy but as if they were 2 levels lower.

I read that as lawful neutral, true neutral and chaotic neutral only.

You can of course house rule it but by the rules, any neutral character is allowed to take the feat. Have a NG Oracle in my game who is all about the different channeling types who I let take it.

I think you're wrong about this. Yes, neutral good is a neutral alignment, so that would be kosher, except there is the last part of the feat:

Quote:

Note: This feat only applies to necromancers, neutral clerics who worship neutral deities, or neutral clerics who do not worship a deity—characters who have the channel energy class ability and have to make a choice to channel positive or negative energy at 1st level. Clerics whose alignment or deity makes this choice for them cannot select this feat.

From my reading of this, a neutral good oracle would be able to take this feat, but not a neutral good cleric who worships a neutral deity, because his alignment made the choice for him.

Mergy has the right of it. A NG Cleric has to channel Positive, and thus would be ineligible for the feat.

[Quandary]

Mergy wrote:

Rules wrote:

Note: This feat only applies to necromancers, neutral clerics who worship neutral deities, or neutral clerics who do not worship a deity—characters who have the channel energy class ability and have to make a choice to channel positive or negative energy at 1st level. Clerics whose alignment or deity makes this choice for them cannot select this feat.

From my reading of this, a neutral good oracle would be able to take this feat, but not a neutral good cleric who worships a neutral deity, because his alignment made the choice for him.

By my reading, Oracles can't take this Feat. They are not gaining Postivie Energy Channeling by the choice that neutral clerics must make, but by the class feature dictating it. In this case, the source of the Oracles powers is akin to 'diety' as referenecd in the last line. The feat is about a neutral cleric (or other class that neutral characters can make a choice re: their fundamental alignment to +/- energy) 'making the choice' to swing both ways... Life Oracles, evil, good, or true neutral, have no choice in the matter of their +/- energy 'allegiance'.

But yeah, evil characters can definitely be life oracles and take this power, I think that's kind of the point really... Honestly, I was surprised that Bones Mystery didn't have a Negative Energy Channel feature to match. Either way (when in the 'opposite' alignment) really is just emphasizing that the gods/the divine has forced these powers onto the Oracle, who with their humanity/moral choice must decide how to use these powers in the world.

Somebody said Evil+Positive Energy/Life Oracles would be an unusual, if legal combination.
I don't see why it's unusual... Nothing suggests any of the Mysteries are more often found in one alignment or another. They are not consciously chosen (like Clerics choose Deities to worship, in accordance with their own alignment), they are forced upon the Oracle, and nobody really knows how or why.

[Alitan]

Bones mystery provides Command Undead as a revelation ('undead servitude') but not a standard channel.