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Yes. Some people are frightened that people different from them exist, because it challenges their own tiny, fragile, barely formed sense of identity because they've lived their lives learning to try to be what other people expect instead of serve their true selves. And it makes them jerks. And it's stupid.
Absolutely. The "I can't imagine anyone might be even vaguely different from me" mindset is disturbingly common.
All too true about so many other aspects of life in general :(
I've had friends try to "convert" me from being a stay-at-home loner glued to the computer screen. They just don't grasp the fact this is who I *am*. :) My brain is just wired to reject masses of people in noisy environments, I can't change that and I don't think I'd ever want to either.Realizing that about myself early on is, I think, one of the things that made me more understanding towards differences in others. We're all different people, and as long as we're not actively harming anyone else in the process we all have the right to be whoever we are.
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Although not in as a socially damaging way... usually... we gamers do it to each other all the time. "You LIKE 4th Edition? You are a scourge that needs to be wiped from the Earth!" "How DARE you enjoy playing a rogue and claim you did well in your party, you are clearly playing the game wrong and are an idiot and we must spam this thread with how wrong you are to mock you until you cower in shame." It really gets first-world-problems levels of ridiculous especially when you find the level of utter rage surrounding some mere differences of opinion or preference.
The "we must all be the same" attitude amongst geeks CAN be socially damaging when you get stuff like, for one example, a certain kind of male alpha geek doing the fake geek girl shaming thing. "You look different from us and focus in a different way on the hobby we share, therefore you are clearly interlopers and must be shamed, threatened, stalked, and silenced by any means necessary." That s!&+ gets mind-bogglingly scary.
Think how much nice most gamer conversations would be if we all just went, "Hey, we have the same hobby, but we experience and enjoy it differently. Isn't that neat?"
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Oh, and Matt Thomason -- while I try not to glue myself to the computer screen constantly, I HAVE taken to quick accessing THIS on my phone and cue it up whenever someone either tries to pressure me into doing something social when I am social-ed out, or ask me if "I'm okay" because I'm being quiet (which drives me crazy). (I also want to carry flashing neon sign in airports/airplanes/train stations/trains that says "I am not reading this book as a conversation starter.")
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Would anyone mind confirming this for me? After the Carrier Pigeon/Stork incident I don't trust any birds bearing messages.
Would anyone mind confirming this for me? After the Carrier Pigeon/Stork incident I don't trust any birds bearing messages.
Precisely.
Hey guys! If there is anyone supporting/playing Pathfinder Online, we are a LGBT+ally guild that will be playing. Here is the Paizo thread:
Charter Company: Full Metal Syndicate
And our website:
Full Metal Syndicate
I am trying not to be distracted by the word "douchecanoe..."
But anyway.
Yes. Some people are frightened that people different from them exist, because it challenges their own tiny, fragile, barely formed sense of identity because they've lived their lives learning to try to be what other people expect instead of serve their true selves. And it makes them jerks. And it's stupid.
Tribalism is a story as old as time. I worry we're returning to it in a way with targeted advertising--that is, we only see around us what is familiar.
It's one of the reasons that, as we gradually meet others who are different than we are and come to see them -as people-, then the hatred and fear decreases. I may have posted this earlier; I forget. :)
This American Life recently did a podcast which touched on tribalism and some of its modernday well, silliness.
Although not in as a socially damaging way... usually... we gamers do it to each other all the time. "You LIKE 4th Edition? You are a scourge that needs to be wiped from the Earth!" "How DARE you enjoy playing a rogue and claim you did well in your party, you are clearly playing the game wrong and are an idiot and we must spam this thread with how wrong you are to mock you until you cower in shame." It really gets first-world-problems levels of ridiculous especially when you find the level of utter rage surrounding some mere differences of opinion or preference.
The "we must all be the same" attitude amongst geeks CAN be socially damaging when you get stuff like, for one example, a certain kind of male alpha geek doing the fake geek girl shaming thing. "You look different from us and focus in a different way on the hobby we share, therefore you are clearly interlopers and must be shamed, threatened, stalked, and silenced by any means necessary." That s@$& gets mind-bogglingly scary.
Think how much nice most gamer conversations would be if we all just went, "Hey, we have the same hobby, but we experience and enjoy it differently. Isn't that neat?"
----
Oh, and Matt Thomason -- while I try not to glue myself to the computer screen constantly, I HAVE taken to quick accessing THIS on my phone and cue it up whenever someone either tries to pressure me into doing something social when I am social-ed out, or ask me if "I'm okay" because I'm being quiet (which drives me crazy). (I also want to carry flashing neon sign in airports/airplanes/train stations/trains that says "I am not reading this book as a conversation starter.")
It's the sorts of posts you're referring to that make me think we need an Everything Wrong with RPGs community. I've seen communities like these start up for other mediums...and they usually turn into horrible, awful cesspits that turn on themselves. The real benefit though, is it becomes sort of a sloshbucket that you can ignore.
On the other hand, it also helps the trolls find eachother.
On the other hand, it can make the trolls more easily dismissable for everyone else.
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I am trying not to be distracted by the word "douchecanoe..."
But anyway.
Yes. Some people are frightened that people different from them exist, because it challenges their own tiny, fragile, barely formed sense of identity because they've lived their lives learning to try to be what other people expect instead of serve their true selves. And it makes them jerks. And it's stupid.
Tribalism is a story as old as time. I worry we're returning to it in a way with targeted advertising--that is, we only see around us what is familiar.
It's one of the reasons that, as we gradually meet others who are different than we are and come to see them -as people-, then the hatred and fear decreases. I may have posted this earlier; I forget. :)
This American Life recently did a podcast which touched on tribalism and some of its modernday well, silliness.
I am certain advertising plays a role. My generation grew up on those crazy competitive Coke vs. Pepsi and Burger King vs. McDonalds competitive ads, and I am absolutely certain it is why so many people my age feel that product loyalty means loving only one brand and hating another --- you MUST love Pathfinder and hate D&D or vice versa. The idea that you can enjoy both (or not care for either and go for a third option) doesn't occur half the time it should.
This concept extends to placing ourselves in an us vs. them mentality in broader ways as well. Advertising can't be entirely responsible, but it plays upon and enhances a certain kind of human tendency.
Part of why a lot of political and social dialogue gets impossible is because there is an assumption of "if you disagree with me on this one thing, you must disagree with all other things, and we must be enemies." Polarizing propaganda, which dominates the "news" world, enhances and spreads this attitude.
I also just realized that my complaints about binarism in advertising, etc. is kind of a parallel to monsexism/biphobia... "You can't POSSIBLY love both, you have to pick a SIDE!"
(I have actually heard someone say "pick a side" in terms of bisexuality. As if straights and LGT persons are rival baseball teams.)
I admit that I never understood that tribal attitude. But I am a loner and bit of outsider never exactly fitting in as far as I can remember. I never had a strong sense of identifying myself with groups. In addition that complaining about lack of identifying myself with identification with characters from books and movies always boggled me... In fact I remember a moment in elementary school, during Literature class when a teacher was asking question that was reliant on identifying oneself with main character of The Knights Of The Cross book. She has clear problem with understanding that I did not identified myself with book characters and instead I mentally added myself as either an extra character or just a watcher instead of putting myself in place of the main character.
I also just realized that my complaints about binarism in advertising, etc. is kind of a parallel to monsexism/biphobia... "You can't POSSIBLY love both, you have to pick a SIDE!"
(I have actually heard someone say "pick a side" in terms of bisexuality. As if straights and LGT persons are rival baseball teams.)
There are always those who step outside of it, to be sure. Tribalism evolved because it was rewarded--back when travel was more difficult, someone who was not familiar was likely there to steal, raid, or both. The upside of this is that there's a natural counter--increasing familiarity.
Interestingly, there was also a study that suggested groups of people had an inbuilt tendency towards a more conservative viewpoint, verses one that was less so. Potentially, these tendencies could be traced back to an evolutionary need for them. That is, a society benefits when there are those who preserve tradition and those who challenge it.
Well actually ...I also just realized that my complaints about binarism in advertising, etc. is kind of a parallel to monsexism/biphobia... "You can't POSSIBLY love both, you have to pick a SIDE!"
(I have actually heard someone say "pick a side" in terms of bisexuality. As if straights and LGT persons are rival baseball teams.)
I heard about something like this happening at a beloved local softball league. It got ugly.
I also just realized that my complaints about binarism in advertising, etc. is kind of a parallel to monsexism/biphobia... "You can't POSSIBLY love both, you have to pick a SIDE!"
(I have actually heard someone say "pick a side" in terms of bisexuality. As if straights and LGT persons are rival baseball teams.)
I hear that all the time. I also hear, so far only from women, that they are worried that I am going to try and sleep with everyone. I have never cheated on anyone. I've been dating for about 25 years. I think that's a decent enough track record. I try and tell them that I made my choice, that I'm with them. It never works. I haven't dated any men so I don't know if I'm going to have that same problem.
I enjoy hearing from folks that my wife is my "cover" :\
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I enjoy hearing from folks that my wife is my "cover" :\
Enjoy that +4 soft cover to AC while you can ;)
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I enjoy hearing from folks that my wife is my "cover" :\
Cripes, I wish we were long past the point of people thinking bisexuals were as common as unicorns. We have got to get past that binary outlook on sexuality.
Also, "douchecanoe" is going to be burned into my lexicon from this day forward.
Nintendo refuses to allow same-sex marriage in a relationship simulator game.
Which raises a much deeper question...
Does anyone actually use their Wii anymore?
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Nintendo refuses to allow same-sex marriage in a relationship simulator game.
Which raises a much deeper question...
Does anyone actually use their Wii anymore?
Not to defend it, but it sounds like the original game didn't include it and they're just not adding additional code. I think it's still stupid and bigoted, but it's not like they're designing a new game around that.
If you want to get past the LGBT censorship radar, play Harvest Moon: a New Beginning and Rune Factory 4 on the 3DS. The creator has no problems with LGBT issues and wants people to play what they want -- but he also knows that with a kid rated game, if they made ways to have same sex (or transgender) characters, people would try to shut it down (which is what happened years ago when they made Harvest Moon for Girl/Cute -- the Japanese version let the female heroine have a "friendship ceremony" with girls that was in all ways identical to the marriage with the male love interests, and it got bowlderized upon localization). So.... on the surface, you choose to play male or female, which in turn determine that you date either females or males. Very hetero- and cis-normative. But....
In Harvest Moon: ANB, the character model is fairly androgynous looking, and you ultimately can unlock ALL hair and clothing types for the main character, making your character look in whatever gendered appearance as you prefer. Some people will refer to you sometimes as a boy or girl but it's fairly infrequent in the dialogue. Ultimately therefore your gender choice does not affect your appearance or behavior, just whether you can date the bachelors or bachelorettes. There are some slight differences in dialogue on occasion but it's kind of random what you get as a guy or girl character.
In Rune Factory 4, you have a predetermined appearance, but once you get past the second act, you can unlock an ability to look like anyone else in the game, including your opposite-gendered counterpart. So I selected playing a "boy" in the game (because I wanted to date the females) but currently I look like the female main character. Interestingly, even though I can't date the guys, I get a lot of flirtation dialogue with them anyway (regardless of the character's appearance).
It's a shame you can't just decide to date everybody AND look/be whatever gender you like, but I think it's pretty cool they tried to get around anticipated censorship and succeeded very well. One day hopefully we can have that without sneaky ways to get past the radar in "kids' games."
Luckily there are older games that definitely do allow for same sex relationships. While I have issues with EA (currently) and the direction of the franchise, I always admired the Sims series (rated Teen) for allowing same sex relationships, even as far back as 2000 when the original game came out. Of course there are "mature" games that allow for same sex relationships as well... the Fallout series you can seduce whomever you like, for example, and you can marry either gender in Skyrim.
Does anyone actually use their Wii anymore?
We use our's in our bedroom for Netflix :P
Considering that Nintendo is reporting massive sales loss of the Wii-U, I'd be surprised if anyone is using that anymore. I wish they'd get with the times already.
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BTW, I just backed a kickstarter (the Queen's Cavaliers), which actually is awesome on a number of levels.
I'm really into swashbuckling games, and as it turns out, so is my 4-year old daughter, who has begun a sword collection, so I felt I had to go for it, for down the line when she can play, say, about 6, like when I started. But it's also queer friendly (in terms of world design), which is a bonus, so I thought I'd mention it here.
My Wii is still connected to my TV, but I'd really only been using it to stream Hulu+ and Netflix. Then I got a Roku. I don't think I've turned on the Wii in months.
I started posting stuff about Nintendo and game consoles, then remembered we were in the LGBT thread (not that we don't off topic all the time, but still, I probably shouldn't help derail).
Jeff, thanks for the heads up about the Queen's Cavaliers, that looks really cool. Glad they've already met their goal too. It looks like a lot of what I want to see in a new tabletop RPG system -- and it especially being queer friendly (and girl friendly) is a major bonus. That's what I like to see!
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I started posting stuff about Nintendo and game consoles, then remembered we were in the LGBT thread (not that we don't off topic all the time, but still, I probably shouldn't help derail).
Jeff, thanks for the heads up about the Queen's Cavaliers, that looks really cool. Glad they've already met their goal too. It looks like a lot of what I want to see in a new tabletop RPG system -- and it especially being queer friendly (and girl friendly) is a major bonus. That's what I like to see!
It seems like queer friendly and girl friendly are usually compatible.
Usually, but not always (and often transphobia remains even if homophobia does not).
In games, though it seems like people who set out to be inclusive usually managed to do so... well, inclusively.
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Right now there's about an hour left of the big Eurovision Song Contest finale. Don't know how much it's been talked about in the US, but I did see a small segment on it on CNN International.
I don't really watch it as it's usually not all that good and 99% of the songs are not of any kind of flavour I enjoy.
However, I would like to show you Austria's very James Bond'esque contribution to this years contest:
Conchita Wurst - Rise Like a Phoenix
I'm British and I haven't really watched Eurovision in years (or ever, for that matter). It's not really my thing.
The best part of the ESC is the countries that have automatic tickets for the final stage, France, the UK, and IIRC three more. Not having to qualify for anything makes their songs frequently sharply odd and often hilariously bad. That said, there is no shortage of bad songs from other countries, and some of the songs from Eastern Europe are magnificent in their tastelessness.
ESC can be fun. Rarely good.
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Well, Conchita Wurst and Austria just won the contest by a huge margin. It IS a quite good song and also a huge thumbs up to the LGBT community.
Very few things can beat Moldova from 2010
My British friend got us hooked on this way back when. I love watching it.
Very few things can beat Moldova from 2010
Moldova 2011 they had gnome hats and unicycles..
Eurovision is huge in Australia - we have parties and pick countries to support, cook food and buy the traditional alcohol from that country... Then have lots of fun getting drunk and watching the stuff like the above.
I went for Poland this year because I am shallow and often fall back into my unreconstructed Australian male yobbo mode at the slightest hint of boobies.
Very few things can beat Moldova from 2010Moldova 2011 they had gnome hats and unicycles..
Eurovision is huge in Australia - we have parties and pick countries to support, cook food and buy the traditional alcohol from that country... Then have lots of fun getting drunk and watching the stuff like the above.
I went for Poland this year because I am shallow and often fall back into my unreconstructed Australian male yobbo mode at the slightest hint of boobies.
Huh? Another person going for Poland this year? Should I actually bother myself and check what we sent for Eurovision?
Meh. That. Not impressed.
But I haven't any recent created Polish music that would be to my liking.
Self deprecating humour doesn't translate well on the internet.. :-) I am glad Austria won, her speech was wonderful. But there was nothing truly insane like Moldova from previous years, roller skates, trampolines songs about cake, and the crowd booing Russia did make it interesting.
Wow I am surprised we are seeing the first openly gay player in the NFL in 2014, Ian Roberts was the trail blazer in 1995 for the Australian Rugby League. Both the Rugby League and Rugby Union run anti homophobia campaigns with the Australian Rugby Union supporting the Bingham Cup.
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Wow I am surprised we are seeing the first openly gay player in the NFL in 2014, Ian Roberts was the trail blazer in 1995 for the Australian Rugby League. Both the Rugby League and Rugby Union run anti homophobia campaigns with the Australian Rugby Union supporting the Bingham Cup.
Yeah, I'm really surprised it took this long.
When I learned my dad was gay, 2 months ago (I'm 32), he was disapointed that I stopped making gay jokes about him. Awkward.
(And yeah, I'm thinking about trading my French nationality for a Polish one, since yesterday.)
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Wish I caught Eurovision this time. I usually watch it, but today I missed it.
So this week, I'll be visiting Ft. Lauderdale with the lady. Looking at jobs and we are thinking about moving together. My biggest goal is to get into Le Cordon Bleu in Miami. While I could go to Le Cordon Bleu in Orlando, I think that it would be best to be closer to her and move to a bigger city. Bigger city = more jobs and more of a chance for me to get into the hospitality and culinary businesses. Hell, it's Florida, the king of tourism :)
What does everyone think about tonight's episode of Bones? I don't want to give anything away. It is LGBT related.
I am massively behind on my Bones watching. I'm tempted to check it out, but I'm afraid I wouldn't know half of what's going on.
The show has dealt with some interesting gender and sexuality issues before though. Angela is one of very few bi characters on TV.
When I learned my dad was gay, 2 months ago (I'm 32), he was disapointed that I stopped making gay jokes about him. Awkward.
(And yeah, I'm thinking about trading my French nationality for a Polish one, since yesterday.)
Not really worth the trouble unless you really-really want it... Why would you want it in the first place anyway?
If the answer is Polish women, I can assure you that there are plenty of Polish women in UK, France and Netherlands :P
