So I've started reading Order of the Stick and am currently on comic 52 in the arc about the weird doppelganger party
And I'm like, to myself, "Durkon there is no need to be concerned because someone is a servant of Loki. You as a worshipper of Thor should know this, the fact that the two were blood brothers and helped each other out is in the damn edda."
Alas this comment would make more sense on my blog, but I'm avoiding that for the time being so I guess I'm fulfilling my ingrained habit to journalize my thoughts in a public space here. Sorry about that.
These things happen.
But yes, people don't realize that in a good chunk of tales, Loki and Thor were nearly inseparable traveling companions, often because either Thor was stubborn and got something done to/assigned to/etc or Loki pulled some shenanigans and needed his brother to bail him out.
Loki's a pretty impressive deity from mythology.
The two bailed each other out! Þrymskvíða has Loki helping Thor get mjǫlnir back and iirc Loki even comes up with excuses as to why, in the guise of Freyja, he has the charisma of a used tissue and eats everything in sight.
Slight hyperbole but you get what I mean.
he fact that the two were blood brothers and helped each other out is in the damn edda."Loki and Odin, not Loki and Thor. Not to mention meeting someone from your own culture while stuck abroad, even if you have some indication they aren't trustworthy, will trigger all sorts of warm feelings because of familiarity and common background.
Yea it's really a shame that the dwarves are too ideologically different to get along. I like them both and I hope Hilgya comes back.
And yes, Loki and Odin too.
Self Observation:
Mockery is how I express love, respect and admiration.
Mockery is also how I express mild but ultimately neutral annoyance.
And mockery is also how I express my rage, hatred and fury.
This must be confusing for others.
EDIT: now the real question is, when I mock myself as I do frequently, is it because I love myself, am annoyed with myself, or hate myself? Is it all three at once?
And now I am mocking myself about mocking myself. This has become meta.
It's three in the morning and sleep is for lowly mortals.
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Much of Loki's bad rap comes from the Christianisation of the old Norse sagas, which were still mostly stored in oral form I believe. By the time they were written down, they'd mutated to have a much more clear enemy, with Loki as the revealed Satanic figure.
After all, after Ragnarok, Baldr is released from Niflheim (the god of light comes from the dead?) and the last two humans alive are named Ask and Embla.
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Odin: "I'm not sure how i feel about Loki turning into a gir.. HOLY ME! Check out this sweet six legged horse! Whens your next date, I'll let you borrow the chariot.
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Much of Loki's bad rap comes from the Christianisation of the old Norse sagas, which were still mostly stored in oral form I believe. By the time they were written down, they'd mutated to have a much more clear enemy, with Loki as the revealed Satanic figure.
After all, after Ragnarok, Baldr is released from Niflheim (the god of light comes from the dead?) and the last two humans alive are named Ask and Embla.
I wonder how much Christianity had altered the character of Hel. She's always been an intriguing one due to that dual depiction thing she had going on.
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I'm not well read on Norse mythology, but to my knowledge, loki was black ops for the pantheon. He had a bad reputation, but was one of them despite his strange parentage.
Hela, I don't know much about beyond that she ruled the underworld. She seemed to be fair, impartial, a bit heartless, but also lonely, possibly due to her job sucking (much like hades).
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Sleipnir had eight legs, but it was up to Loki to salvage the situation as it was essentially his fault in the first place.
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Hel and her realm get a seriously bad rep because of christianity twisting it about.
Helheim was in fact a neutral place. If you weren't chosen by Oðinn for Valhǫllr or by Freyja for Folkvangr (based on heroic service in battle), then you just went to Hel. I don't know the source for this, but some heathens (including myself) believe that you can be chosen by other gods, such as Þórr as well.
I believe that Hel herself was a very stoic, cold character, and a firm judge, indeed very fair. Náströnd existed, and she threw out the cruel and wicked unworthy of her hospitality to there to be chewed on by Níðhöggr. It's where Varg Vikernes will go when he dies. And the good dead, she gave hospitality in her home.
EDIT: Also Odin is in fact super ok with Loki turning into a girl because he is not a christianized stooge. As a matter of fact, Odin practiced effeminate magic he studied from Freyja and he wears a dress (customary) when doing so. All gods are ergi, it's just Loki who is most obviously so.
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I don't think it's Christian-bashing to talk about the fact that many mythological characters that were seen as positive, neutral, or ambiguous were portrayed negatively under Christian influence. That's just fact.
(Unless I'm missing something, you're the only one using weighted terms like "ruined" -- everyone else has just been saying that Loki was portrayed more negatively after Christianity gained influence in Nordic areas.)
That said, this is moving a bit far afield from LGBT issues.
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Sorry, I'm bitter and salty barbarian.
Also this is a subject given deep mental contemplation by me for quite some time as it is extremely important to me both as a heathen and a trans person who identifies by Old English and Old Norse words bæddel and argr.
I'm not claiming that the norse before christian influence were perfect and bias-free. What I am claiming is whatever biases they had weren't the same as christian biases, and they changed over time.
In fact roman influence was happening as early as the 5th 6th century, as evidenced by swedish burials switching from an emphasis on association farming with women to lavish warrior burials and farming being a dude thing. This is also associated with increased social strafification, also associated with influence from southern europe. So yes, the macho problem existed as early as the time of Bēowulf and it just got worse later on. But it's not native, and it always existed in tandem with odin wearing a dress.
Old English had the word wæpenwyf, literally weaponed-woman, for a woman with a penis.
Why were the words with gender variance connotation of entirely different extraction for both Old English and Old Norse, with 'earg' only having connotation of 'cowardly' in Old English? It might be because these words were adopted seperately to describe gender variance at a later time. In other words, these are young words.
EDIT: Also, the pre-christian Norse were an oral society, they did not keep records, and only very rarely (only case I can think of is the Rök stone) did they actually write down their lore. It was christanity which brought the idea of recordkeeping, so anything that actually made it to parchement passed through a christian(ized) mind.
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Next year y'all just need to look me up on day one. I had 100 of each as early as Wed evening, and still have a few if somebody missed out, but it's hard to pass them out when you're tied to the GM table. I passed about half of them off to the Paizo booth Thursday Afternoon as they hadn't been able to get any yet. They managed to get a bundle on Friday though and had them at the counter the rest of the con I believe.
And I spent most of the Con by the Paizo booth running Card Game demos. The only time I really got away was for the specials, which was a particularly bad time to be looking for anyone.
So this time it just wasn't meant to be...
Next year any of us that will be there Wednesday evening need to plan on meeting for diner.
Next year any of us that will be there Wednesday evening need to plan on meeting for diner.
Provided things work out, I hope to be there *TUESDAY*. The extra day for travel was huge this year, and why I only passed out at one table despite only having about three hours of sleep a night on average (Totally played through too much of my sleep time!)
*coughs*
I did that one year. After GM'ing for 10 hours on Saturday, I happened across a game of Werewolf about 11:30PM (the mafia game, not the RPG). Luckily I had no events scheduled for Sunday, because I didn't get done playing until about 5:30 PM the next day.
I got really good at Werewolf that day.
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I did that one year. After GM'ing for 10 hours on Saturday, I happened across a game of Werewolf about 11:30PM (the mafia game, not the RPG). Luckily I had no events scheduled for Sunday, because I didn't get done playing until about 5:30 PM the next day.
I got really good at Werewolf that day.
What year was that? I helped run Werewolf last year and the year before; working the midnight to 4 AM shift (which never ended before 5 or 5:30).
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Since we're talking about Werewolf, I am contractually obligated to come in here and state that I Am Not The Werewolf.
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Rule #1, Liz is always the werewolf.
LIES AND SLANDER.
>.><.<
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Well, you may rest assured I'm not.
I don't play that (burnt out on too much LARP back in the old WtA days plus usually stupid-tired or needing a drink when I pass by the groups playing it at night).
Besides, who ever heard of a tengu werewolf. That just sounds painfully awkward...
I'm a little too feline-affiliated to be a werewolf. It would be thematically inconsistent.
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Did someone talk about a Werewolf?
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Well, you may rest assured I'm not.
I don't play that (burnt out on too much LARP back in the old WtA days plus usually stupid-tired or needing a drink when I pass by the groups playing it at night).
Besides, who ever heard of a tengu werewolf. That just sounds painfully awkward...
a corax used to hang with our pack a while back....
Rule #1, Liz is always the werewolf.LIES AND SLANDER.
>.>
<.<
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a corax used to hang with our pack a while back....
Well, you may rest assured I'm not.
I don't play that (burnt out on too much LARP back in the old WtA days plus usually stupid-tired or needing a drink when I pass by the groups playing it at night).
Besides, who ever heard of a tengu werewolf. That just sounds painfully awkward...
Really, some ravens have absolutely no taste or dignity... They really should know better.
What year was that? I helped run Werewolf last year and the year before; working the midnight to 4 AM shift (which never ended before 5 or 5:30).I did that one year. After GM'ing for 10 hours on Saturday, I happened across a game of Werewolf about 11:30PM (the mafia game, not the RPG). Luckily I had no events scheduled for Sunday, because I didn't get done playing until about 5:30 PM the next day.
I got really good at Werewolf that day.
2012. Note, I said 5:30 pm. I played werewolf games for about 18 hours (I took a break to go take a shower and eat some food)... after GM'ing games all day Saturday.
Rule #1, Liz is always the werewolf.LIES AND SLANDER.
>.>
<.<
If I come to PaizoCon, can we play Werewolf?
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Did someone talk about a Werewolf?
There!
What?
There, wolf!
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Are we talking about a werewolf, a wearwolf, a warewolf or Aware Wolf?
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What year was that? I helped run Werewolf last year and the year before; working the midnight to 4 AM shift (which never ended before 5 or 5:30).I did that one year. After GM'ing for 10 hours on Saturday, I happened across a game of Werewolf about 11:30PM (the mafia game, not the RPG). Luckily I had no events scheduled for Sunday, because I didn't get done playing until about 5:30 PM the next day.
I got really good at Werewolf that day.
2012. Note, I said 5:30 pm. I played werewolf games for about 18 hours (I took a break to go take a shower and eat some food)... after GM'ing games all day Saturday.
If I come to PaizoCon, can we play Werewolf?Rule #1, Liz is always the werewolf.LIES AND SLANDER.
>.>
<.<
Okay, I wasn't there in 2012. My wife was thought, and running Are you a Werewolf all night.
And I am not the werewolf either, though I'm still not sure about Liz.
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Are we talking about a werewolf, a wearwolf, a warewolf or Aware Wolf?
Heh. :)
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So I've started reading Order of the Stick and am currently on comic 52 in the arc about the weird doppelganger party
And I'm like, to myself, "Durkon there is no need to be concerned because someone is a servant of Loki. You as a worshipper of Thor should know this, the fact that the two were blood brothers and helped each other out is in the damn edda."
Alas this comment would make more sense on my blog, but I'm avoiding that for the time being so I guess I'm fulfilling my ingrained habit to journalize my thoughts in a public space here. Sorry about that.
You do realize that OotS is a lighthearted serial comic that isn't all that serious and takes an awful lot of liberty with the few realworld mythological characters it decides to incorporate. I mean, come on... Thor is a total buffoon in those strips. To my recollection he's not been seen doing anything effectively in his capacity as deity.
The Northern pantheon also coexists with other pantheons based on realworld myth, acknowledging their existence, where it never does in the real world.Really, I'm just always surprised when people experience these fictionalized versions, knowing they're fictionalized, still wanting to see them as realistically as possible. Thats not what the fiction is for. We have other books for that.
I mean it is pretty commonly known that deities of death or the underworld in several mythologies aren't evil, but fictional depictions make them so anyway (Hades being the prime example here). I don't bat an eye when that happens and I don't really see why anyone should. Doesn't it just put a stranglehold on creative license if we were to adhere to realworld knowledge all the time?!
That said... If christianity can change how we collectively perceive these deities as something other than their originals, why couldn't the media? Finally, does it really matter if the original doesn't cease to exist (and if it does, well, it becomes extremely difficult to tell ;))?
Yeah I realize all of that, I just happen to be a world-class complainer. ;Þ
although fun fact! Thor has a rather, specific kind of wisdom. What I mean is that he isn't exactly the brightest coal in the fire and he is kind of gullible and easily outwitted by Loki and Odin in the edda.
So this last panel may be accidentally a little more accurate than indented and that makes it even funnier to me for that reason. I love it.
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So like he is In the "Day at the Beach" OotS wallpaper that I have as my desktop, where Thor is up on a cloud in one corner, grilling meat on a barbecue, and drinking a beer? Such a stolid god, then.
(My favorite part of that picture, though, is the flumphs playing frisbee.)
So like he is In the "Day at the Beach" OotS wallpaper that I have as my desktop, where Thor is up on a cloud in one corner, grilling meat on a barbecue, and drinking a beer? Such a stolid god, then.
(My favorite part of that picture, though, is the flumphs playing frisbee.)
it's fun to imagine him with the personality of a burly 6 foot tall overgrown child with a beard.
Which is of course hyperbole, but with his triggerhappy nature and his prone to tantrums he encroaches on that territory sometimes.
Still, he's a great god. I love him.
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As a sidenote, you should avoid the almighty johnsons. You would not like thor there.
noted.
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So like he is In the "Day at the Beach" OotS wallpaper that I have as my desktop, where Thor is up on a cloud in one corner, grilling meat on a barbecue, and drinking a beer? Such a stolid god, then.
(My favorite part of that picture, though, is the flumphs playing frisbee.)
it's fun to imagine him with the personality of a burly 6 foot tall overgrown child with a beard.
Which is of course hyperbole, but with his triggerhappy nature and his prone to tantrums he encroaches on that territory sometimes.
Still, he's a great god. I love him.
That description is less than endearing. :/
Nothing against Thor. I always enjoyed reading about all the Norse gods. But having grown up with a parent who was prone to epic, terrifying tantrums....it's not charming up close. Especially from someone in a position of authority. Even just reading about that kind of behavior in stories can be really hard sometimes.
So like he is In the "Day at the Beach" OotS wallpaper that I have as my desktop, where Thor is up on a cloud in one corner, grilling meat on a barbecue, and drinking a beer? Such a stolid god, then.
(My favorite part of that picture, though, is the flumphs playing frisbee.)
it's fun to imagine him with the personality of a burly 6 foot tall overgrown child with a beard.
Which is of course hyperbole, but with his triggerhappy nature and his prone to tantrums he encroaches on that territory sometimes.
Still, he's a great god. I love him.
That description is less than endearing. :/
Nothing against Thor. I always enjoyed reading about all the Norse gods. But having grown up with a parent who was prone to epic, terrifying tantrums....it's not charming up close. Especially from someone in a position of authority. Even just reading about that kind of behavior in stories can be really hard sometimes.
That's fair. I don't mean to imply Thor is one of those people. His protective nature wins out and he's not likely to take his anger out on people less powerful than himself.
People who take their anger out on those less powerful than themselves are among my least favorite kind of people.
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I'm moving to a new city, and I am all excited to get to present as a woman. Issue is, I don't have my own bedroom in my new apartment, and my roommate is a man. I've never met him and know nothing about him, he's just who the university assigned to me. Gonna make my intention to start presenting as female really interesting. I do hope he isn't bigoted or uncomfortable.
Oh, and our shared bedroom costs $2,400 a month, which we each pay half of.
The university doesn't know. They think I'm male. The last thing I want to do is get administration all up in my business.
Oh, and our shared bedroom costs $2,400 a month, which we each pay half of.* Spit take.
My whole apartment (with three bedrooms, two bathrooms, kitchen, balcony, small storage room/large closet, and living/dining room) costs less than a third of that.
University housing in and of itself is overpriced, and I live in one of the top five most expensive cities in the nation, so that's not surprising.
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Here is where your concern should sit, I *think*?
If you are presenting as a woman, there will be questions as to why you're in a male dorm (if they aren't co-ed).
If (gods forbid) you get attacked or assaulted while presenting, what protections will you have on-campus?
Please be careful with this?
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Whatever happened to starving grad students living in fifth floor walkup shoebox studios?
those studio apartments cost just under 2k a month.
Here is where your concern should sit, I *think*?If you are presenting as a woman, there will be questions as to why you're in a male dorm (if they aren't co-ed).
I'm in a townhouse, not a dorm, though the townhouses are segregated. The issue is that I have to have either a male or female roommate, and I've never presented as a woman before (family issues), so if I get a female roommate nobody is going to feel comfortable with the situation.
If (gods forbid) you get attacked or assaulted while presenting, what protections will you have on-campus?
The same as any other woman.
Please be careful with this?
So far as I can be.
Whatever happened to starving grad students living in fifth floor walkup shoebox studios?those studio apartments cost just under 2k a month.
Yea, that. Plus, I have two years until I start grad school. I'm going into my Junior year right now.