So I was thinking of running the next AP, I was thinking of having the PC's make characters minus the race. Direct them with a 15 point buy adjusting racial stats later at the first session.
During the first session surprise them having them play all Kobolds or all Goblins. Perhaps creating a list of races on paper and having them draw the races at random.
Now I thought having a hat rigged with all kobolds or all goblins. Or a combination of different non core races.
I am looking forward to the Advanced Race Guide, I also want a nice silly game where there is allot of laughter. With the sucess of we be goblins I would like to mirrior that hilarity.
So what are some pitfalls that I am not seeing?
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Players not liking the surprise, and since races affect stats it a surprise race could effect qualification for feats, especially if players like to plan ahead.
Kobolds are also a very weak race, and goblins are good enough to be a PC race.
I would talk to the group first. Random races would not be fun to be if done in that manner, even in a comical game. Telling them upfront also allows them to get into the proper mindset.
go for it
troglodytes, kobolds, goblins for all!!
Depends on how much roleplaying your party does. And whether they like In-character humor to invade the gaming table, but that's up to you to weigh out.
If it's just about the dungeoncrawling you can do this for a change of pace, I guess, especially if you go easy on the racial effects, rulewise.
If it's roleplaying they want, they'll probably not be as upset by the feat/class limitations as by the background limitations: "I see here that you are the youngest son of a powerful nobleman, who was given to a cloister at an early age and always resented your parents for deciding that for you (insert long tearful story), only you are not, sice you are a goblin."
Well I talked to a couple of them who think they would actually like to play as goblins. Pirate goblins, or goblin pirates... other than the implication of running an AP that I haven't read yet. How could playing these races conflict with a printed AP.
I think jointly I will be tring to play a goblin in a different AP home game Serpent Skull soon. To test a goblins worth in the mean time.
Most of the players are extremly experienced as well as GM's for PFS so I am thinking the goblin race and the point by may balance their builds versus 4 person published content.
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Out curent game has humans as the enemies.
Main races are more civilized goblins (Goblin Empire) (they claimed an uninhabited island and became more civilized).
The Goblin Empire includes:
Goblins
Kobolds
Hobgoblins
Bugbears
Grippli
Allied Nations include
Orcs & Duergar
We were all driven off the mainland to an island in the east by Chelaxians.
He tweaked them to have player stats. Orcs use the Halforc Stats, for example.
There are no horses. The goblins keep goblin dogs, and goblin dogs large enough to serve as horses for both goblins & hobgoblins;
The Orcs use Wolves, Dire Wolves, and Worgs.
A concession of the setting is that all of these races aren't "mostly evil" anymore, but have evolved into cultures with at least "neutral" morality, though they may have tendencies left over from when they were in human lands.
Common, isnt a thing. The common language of the region is goblin.
Its been working out well since september, nice different setting.
It's worth keeping in mind that deviating from human culture means the players will do things that are likely unacceptable in human culture.
When we capture prisoners, the protocol is that I yell "WHO DO YOU WORK FOR!" in as many languages as my orc speaks, and threaten them in all of those languages. I get information from them by asking, and am willing to do any manner of painful things to them. A wretched chelish hume prisoner spat in my face after we killed his invading platoon (who had been razing goblin settlements), and I bit off his finger and spit it back at him.
The party was shocked at my behavior. I in turn was shocked at their behavior, when the other party fighter went back on his word and killed the prisoner after he cooperated (which took some "interrogation"). He cooperated, and to me that meant he should be allowed to live, and be released when he's no longer a danger to us.
I decided to keep a female drow as a slave after we conquered their town (they were cooperating with the humans, to attack the duergar). I figured she would handle my finances. Cause drow are good with numbers. So I broke her in. I was nice to her when she behaved, and when she tried to stab me in my sleep (I figured she would) I waterboarded her, and had the worg/wolves make sure she was sleep deprived. Now she has nice clothes, and gives me advice on where to invest my treasure, and is treated very well, and is basically allowed to make her own decisions.
The same player tried to tell me what I was doing was wrong, but follows the law. So I agreed to go before a judge. The Judge said that while goblins can't hold slaves, I had two things in my favor: 1. Drow dont have rights because theyre evil and slaughtered and enslaved goblins for millenia; and 2. I'm in a grey area since the orcs are technically a separate culture and the Orc Tribes allow slavery. So I have to follow the laws relating to how you treat pets. lol.
And finally, "Cannibalism" (we havent killed any orcs yet, so technically it hasn't been cannibalism yet). The party is okay with it, but it took them a while to get used to it. Its been established that orcs dont see any problems with eating fallen foes. You dont need the whole body for a resurrection if you need to ask them something, for example, and an orc's gotta eat.
"We need to eat food. He's made of meat. He's not using it anymore. We're not killing smart things for their meat, but if we had to kill them anyways, what's the big deal if we use them to resupply instead of leaving them to the vultures?"
If you do random races, at least have the players build characters AFTER race is selected.
Creative Director
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One thing to keep in mind... an Adventure Path is a long commitment. And it really REALLY helps for the players to be proud of and attached to their characters for that time. Pulling a surprise like "Guess what? You're all orcs!" is a good way to make players hate their characters, and as such a good way to build in some early dissatisfaction to a game that may well take you years to play out.
I suggest NOT surprising the players with the fact that they can't play the races they want. Unless you're eager to get the current AP over with so you can start a new one, of course.
Spoke with a couple of the players, the two I talked with are actually happy with the idea of going goblin or kobold.
Since I plan on running the next AP I have around a month to create add a couple races to the list. I was thinking of giving them a free racial trait even if I have to create or approve some during the creation.
I like the element of randomness but I think I will not surprise them with it having them select a race from a list.
So at this point I am just looking over the races, for some reason I think a goblin crew will be fun.
I'd say pitch the idea of running non standard races, alot of people plan thier characters around certain preconceptions. I've done a similar thing in the past in 3.5, told the party they could run literally any race or template. What I got was 1 drow, a half dragon with some alterations(dropping the meh breath weapon in favor of wings) and a monk werecheetah along with basically 3 other normal human or elf type characters. Some people just like thier plain old regular pc's, sp forcing them outside thier comfort zone could complicate things and make them not enjoy the game.
Asta
PSY
Oh yeah Goblins of Golarion will be provided for player reference.
Kobolds though, I had to look up Classic Monsters Revisited, looking at the variant color's to add as a way for a racial trait or add to the the variant color text.
For the most part Goblins look fun, as well as decently balanced. I have always liked Kobolds but it seems from the Bestiary that they really have a huge penalty to stats.-4 str +2 dex -2 con, they do have a good amount of special abilities.
So I will have to find a medium race to add to a list for players who don't want the big penalty to strength.
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For PC Kobolds, I'd drop the Str penalty to -2 and give them +2 Chr. That balances them against the other PC races better and gives them a reason to be good Sorcerers (which are always a fun bit of Kobold fluff).
As for a Medium race, I'd go Hobgoblin, as others suggested, though Orc is potentially viable as well.
And you're doing this with Skull and Shackles, right? Because it'd actually work with that one, but wouldn't necessarily with all the others.
Yeah this will be for the skull an shackles AP. So far I am thinking 15 point stat buy. For races so far Goblins. Kobolds I exapanded one the color variant adding a +2 stat fixed stat bonus to each color as well as a feat and trait equivelenr power to compensate for the low startig stats. I also have been working on making a Charau Ka playable race. So far so good.
Spoke with a couple of the players, the two I talked with are actually happy with the idea of going goblin or kobold.
Since I plan on running the next AP I have around a month to create add a couple races to the list. I was thinking of giving them a free racial trait even if I have to create or approve some during the creation.
I like the element of randomness but I think I will not surprise them with it having them select a race from a list.
So at this point I am just looking over the races, for some reason I think a goblin crew will be fun.
Personally I dont like randomness, but if you are upfront about it thats not that big a deal. But you should really let them choose their race before creating the character. Particularly kobolds will have a big impact on what will work at all, let alone be good especially since you are going to do 15 point buy. Let them pick or randomize race first, THEN make characters.
Here is a suggestion. Let them make the characters they want race and all. Have the make characters that are 2 levels higher than the level you intend to run the campaign. Next make a list of about 20 races that would be fun, gobs, hobs, kobolds, mongrelmen, ect. Give them a really beefy 1st session let them be really heroic. . . . but kill them. Total Party Kill. This is now the start of your funny campaign. Some benefactor has scrounged together their corpses . . . part of them anyway. This witch or druid knows reincarnate. So now the PC's are back 2 levels lower which is the level you want them. They are stuck in different bodies. Here is where it gets fun. The PC's heroic death has earned them a place of honor and remembered notoriety. After a few adventures in their new skins. The witch that reincarnated them is not quite as much of a benefactor as first thought. The witch has the rest of the corpses stored elsewhere and has learned a ritual to animate them with demonic spirits. So the PC's learn through the grapevine that they have returned from the grave. So now they have to deal with their dopplegangers.