Hootie-Hoo, I've been looking forward to this for a while. Love the idea of the one-page format too! Hopefully, we will see most (if not all) of the AP/module monsters in a "now" anticipated Pathfinder Bestiary II. As well as some psionic creatures and monsters from the aforementioned other planets/planes.....
As for another subscription. I think the option should be there to support those who like subscriptions. I have almost everything Paizo has produced (in regards to APs, Chronicles, Rulebooks, etc.), however, I do not have any subscriptions (not that I mind them). For me I have always received my "Paizo Fix" from my local drug-dealer, er.... Game Store. So I will continue to support Paizo through that store. As I have for almost 28 years. As usual, I hope Paizo will continue as they have allowing options for their customers. Thanks again, Paizo
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Nice to hear that there will be a Pf bestiary coming out. Hopefully I can rebound from this dismal month cash-wise to preorder it sometime soon.
I haven't pre-ordered anything other than hard-copy of the PFRPG Beta (think I pre-ordered that, anyhow, can't remember) but if it's like other Paizo stuff, it's not this month being dismal you want to recover from, it's ensuring that July (or whenever it ships) isn't dismal, because mostly they don't charge until it gets shipped (although they may do that trial charge to check that your card is genuine, etc).
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I dont know if you've given the thought to the layout of the book...but instead of the normal alphabetical layout...what do you think of a monster type layout...
Index
general information
Aberrations
-general info on abberations
entries
Animals
-repeat
entries
Constructs
-etc
Dragons
-etc
Fey
-etc
Giants
-etc
Humanoids
-etc
Magical Beasts
-etc
Monstrous Humanoids
-etc
Oozes
-etc
Outsiders
-etc
Plants
-etc
Undead
-etc
Vermin
-etc
Templates
Rules on monster improvement (feat's, advancement)
CR Index
something along those lines?
and maybe color code the page edge according to section, like a looseleaf dividers? one lower than the next? It woiuld make for finding certain monsters easier...
not that it matters a huge amount, just thinking to myself what id like. :D
Creative Director
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The layout will be alphabetical. That's the easiest way to find monsters in there. If we organize things by type or CR, then you have to remember TWO things about a monster to find it in the book. Better to just have to remember its name and then understand the order the letters go in.
We'll probably still have an index or chart in there somewhere that breaks out monsters by CR and by type, though.
We'll probably still have an index or chart in there somewhere that breaks out monsters by CR and by type, though.
Great! Thats gonna be fun to layout!
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Creative Director
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We'll probably still have an index or chart in there somewhere that breaks out monsters by CR and by type, though.Great! Thats gonna be fun to layout!
I'll make sure to include a few 500 word sidebars, some tables with nearly a dozen columns, 1/4 page illustrations, and creatures with long arms that stick out to the side to disrupt word flow. Just for you! :)
I can hear the cries from the Art Department already. :D
I'll make sure to include a few 500 word sidebars, some tables with nearly a dozen columns, 1/4 page illustrations, and creatures with long arms that stick out to the side to disrupt word flow. Just for you! :)
If you really care about her, you'll give her a Hecatoncheires who's brandishing all her weapons, and tell her to get the text around all the weapons.
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Hootie-Hoo, I've been looking forward to this for a while. Love the idea of the one-page format too! Hopefully, we will see most (if not all) of the AP/module monsters in a "now" anticipated Pathfinder Bestiary II. As well as some psionic creatures and monsters from the aforementioned other planets/planes.....
As for another subscription. I think the option should be there to support those who like subscriptions. I have almost everything Paizo has produced (in regards to APs, Chronicles, Rulebooks, etc.), however, I do not have any subscriptions (not that I mind them). For me I have always received my "Paizo Fix" from my local drug-dealer, er.... Game Store. So I will continue to support Paizo through that store. As I have for almost 28 years. As usual, I hope Paizo will continue as they have allowing options for their customers. Thanks again, Paizo
Hi,
first thanks to James for answering my questions above!
Regarding critters in a possible Bestiary #2:
Yes, I'd like to see some of the best OGL monsters (especially Tome of Horrors I!) see re-imagined by Paizo and included in the Bestiary.
But please don't include those monsters already included in other modules and APs!
What sense does a new bestiary make if most of its content is just a copy/ paste from other Paizo products?
Kr,
Günther
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Creative Director
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I'll make sure to include a few 500 word sidebars, some tables with nearly a dozen columns, 1/4 page illustrations, and creatures with long arms that stick out to the side to disrupt word flow. Just for you! :)If you really care about her, you'll give her a Hecatoncheires who's brandishing all her weapons, and tell her to get the text around all the weapons.
The hecatoncheires only punishes the artist, actually. With that many arms and heads, the final art is almost guaranteed to be circular or relatively oblong, which is pretty easy to wrap text around.
A better choice would be something like a sea urchin with about 5 spines.
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Creative Director
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Regarding critters in a possible Bestiary #2:
Yes, I'd like to see some of the best OGL monsters (especially Tome of Horrors I!) see re-imagined by Paizo and included in the Bestiary.But please don't include those monsters already included in other modules and APs!
What sense does a new bestiary make if most of its content is just a copy/ paste from other Paizo products?
Including monsters from adventures in monster books has been a part of the game from the start. I remember getting the Fiend Folio and I1: Dwellers of the Forbidden City on the same day, and it was kind of cool to me that some of the new monsters in the module were in Fiend Folio too. And then later, when the Monster Manual 2 came out, the rest of the new monsters got into there as well. And we're talking things like the aboleth and the yuan-ti. Had those two monsters NOT been picked up for inclusion in the 1st edition MM2, I really doubt those two critters would have gone on to become the big deals they are in the game today.
So yeah; including monsters from the modules and the PF APs in upcoming Bestiaries is going to happen. It puts the monsters in a context where they won't spoil adventures and where a LOT more GMs can get ahold of them.
And frankly, monster books are INCREDIBLY expensive. They have a lot of art, and art is MUCH more expensive than words, and if reprinting some monsters lets us save money by reprinting art, that's good too.
But there'll always be more than just reprinted monsters in a Pathfinder Bestiary. Even back in the 1st edition days, even though the MM2 reprinted creatures like the aboleth, the yuan-ti, Graz'zt, the froghemoth, the behir, and other monsters that have lived on to be classics, there were a LOT more brand new monsters that were just as fun in there too. That's the goal for the Pathfinder Bestiaries too!
The hecatoncheires only punishes the artist, actually. With that many arms and heads, the final art is almost guaranteed to be circular or relatively oblong, which is pretty easy to wrap text around.
That's not trying hard enough. I want text between all the arms ;-)
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Including monsters from adventures in monster books has been a part of the game from the start. I remember getting the Fiend Folio and I1: Dwellers of the Forbidden City on the same day, and it was kind of cool to me that some of the new monsters in the module were in Fiend Folio too. And then later, when the Monster Manual 2 came out, the rest of the new monsters got into there as well. And we're talking things like the aboleth and the yuan-ti. Had those two monsters NOT been picked up for inclusion in the 1st edition MM2, I really doubt those two critters would have gone on to become the big deals they are in the game today.So yeah; including monsters from the modules and the PF APs in upcoming Bestiaries is going to happen. It puts the monsters in a context where they won't spoil adventures and where a LOT more GMs can get ahold of them.
And frankly, monster books are INCREDIBLY expensive. They have a lot of art, and art is MUCH more expensive than words, and if reprinting some monsters lets us save money by reprinting art, that's good too.
But there'll always be more than just reprinted monsters in a Pathfinder Bestiary. Even back in the 1st edition days, even though the MM2 reprinted creatures like the aboleth, the yuan-ti, Graz'zt, the froghemoth, the behir, and other monsters that have lived on to be classics, there were a LOT more brand new monsters that were just as fun in there too. That's the goal for the Pathfinder Bestiaries too!
Thanks again for answering!
I am not in general against inclusion of iconic PF monsters. Oddly enough in my humble opinion the most iconic monsters in PF products so far were those which were re-envisioned classic monsters like e.g. goblins or the various giant offspring in the first AP.In short: If you just include the most iconic and useful monsters in each of your Bestiaries to come, I'll be happy.
I'd just not want to see Bestiaries grow as bloated as some of the worse 3.5e monster manuals. Each monster should have its own distinctive role and a unique background in D&D history or so far undiscovered future niches... (and if possible a distinctive look, too. ;-)).
Kr,
Günther
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The layout will be alphabetical. That's the easiest way to find monsters in there. If we organize things by type or CR, then you have to remember TWO things about a monster to find it in the book. Better to just have to remember its name and then understand the order the letters go in.
We'll probably still have an index or chart in there somewhere that breaks out monsters by CR and by type, though.
A good example of this is the Bestiary of Krynn published by Margaret Weis Productions (then Sovereign Press) for the Dragonlance setting. The book was divided into thematic sections. It did make it a bit harder to find the monsters. When Margaret Weis Productions later published Bestiary of Krynn Revised (with errata and a few new monsters), they ordered the monsters alphabetically and that worked much better.
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Including monsters from adventures in monster books has been a part of the game from the start. I remember getting the Fiend Folio and I1: Dwellers of the Forbidden City on the same day, and it was kind of cool to me that some of the new monsters in the module were in Fiend Folio too. And then later, when the Monster Manual 2 came out, the rest of the new monsters got into there as well. And we're talking things like the aboleth and the yuan-ti. Had those two monsters NOT been picked up for inclusion in the 1st edition MM2, I really doubt those two critters would have gone on to become the big deals they are in the game today.So yeah; including monsters from the modules and the PF APs in upcoming Bestiaries is going to happen. It puts the monsters in a context where they won't spoil adventures and where a LOT more GMs can get ahold of them.
And frankly, monster books are INCREDIBLY expensive. They have a lot of art, and art is MUCH more expensive than words, and if reprinting some monsters lets us save money by reprinting art, that's good too.
But there'll always be more than just reprinted monsters in a Pathfinder Bestiary. Even back in the 1st edition days, even though the MM2 reprinted creatures like the aboleth, the yuan-ti, Graz'zt, the froghemoth, the behir, and other monsters that have lived on to be classics, there were a LOT more brand new monsters that were just as fun in there too. That's the goal for the Pathfinder Bestiaries too!
Okay I just have to say this, Yes please, goblin dog, no please on the goblin snake.
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Chief Creative Officer, Publisher
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LOL. I don't think the goblin snake is making it in.
And after spending much of yesterday looking for a low-CR ooze, I can assure you that I will be pushing for a "by type" index listed in order of CR, as well as several other index ideas. The book needs to be as useful as humanly possible, in my view.
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LOL. I don't think the goblin snake is making it in.
And after spending much of yesterday looking for a low-CR ooze, I can assure you that I will be pushing for a "by type" index listed in order of CR, as well as several other index ideas. The book needs to be as useful as humanly possible, in my view.
I love oozes...and slimes...and fungus...and mold...
And after spending much of yesterday looking for a low-CR ooze, I can assure you that I will be pushing for a "by type" index listed in order of CR, as well as several other index ideas. The book needs to be as useful as humanly possible, in my view.
Indexes. Yes. Please. Many. Thank you.
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LOL. I don't think the goblin snake is making it in.
And after spending much of yesterday looking for a low-CR ooze, I can assure you that I will be pushing for a "by type" index listed in order of CR, as well as several other index ideas. The book needs to be as useful as humanly possible, in my view.
yea!!!!!
I cant tell you how many times Im building a set of encounters...mini adventures, and start thinking "I need a Construct or Plant type or shapechanger of CR XXXX....lets page through every book to find one". :I....far easier to have an index. :D
LOL. I don't think the goblin snake is making it in.
And after spending much of yesterday looking for a low-CR ooze, I can assure you that I will be pushing for a "by type" index listed in order of CR, as well as several other index ideas. The book needs to be as useful as humanly possible, in my view.
Stun Jelly..? Remember it being CR 3 or 4?
My 2 coppers worth
But please don't include those monsters already included in other modules and APs!What sense does a new bestiary make if most of its content is just a copy/ paste from other Paizo products?
Kr,
Günther
I, for one, would actually like to see this.
At some point, I'd like to pick up the adventure paths and modules, simply because I like reading the stuff, but they end up being a low priority over other source material, since we don't really run modules or APs.
At some point (Bestiary 2 or 3 or 32), I'd like to see all of the stuff collected into one tome...
I don't mind if a couple of good candidates make the Bestiary. The book shouldn't be PFB the compilation with some SRD critters added in as filler, of course, but a few things would make sense. For example, lamia matriarchs are great and should be in - especially since they're closer to the original Lamia.
I wouldn't want/need a PF Bestiary Compilation, but I can see how others would, so I won't complain if it happens.
...
I love oozes...and slimes...and fungus...and mold...
And we love you back!;)
So do we!
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Co-owner - Battlegrounds to Board Games
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I for one would like to see a good deal of the Psionic creatures and races from the SRD of course with the Patfinder spin on them. I would really like to see in the Ecology/Society section how the psionic creatures fit in and where they come from. Like Xeph's and Half-giants and of course Duergar for example. I doubt it will happen because we psion lovers seem to be quite the minority.
I wonder how much are the monsters likely to be changed mechanically? There's bound to be a lot of new fluff for many of them, but besides changes that come solely from the rule changes how likely are the monsters to be changed? Also will they're be racial traits for creatures like Goblins and Orcs that are balanced with other player races?
Wow. What a first post to come back to. Holy cow. This is like the best day ever. The book sounds awesome, guys--you've really outdone yourselves. I can't wait to see it. I've been eagerly awaiting something like this coming out pretty much from day one...it's not like you even had to sell me. Cannot wait to get my hands on it.
Heh. Awesome!
Again... the VAST majority of the monsters that have shown up in the Adventure Paths and Modules won't be in the Pathfinder Bestiary 1. The same cannot be said of the inevitable Pathfinder Bestiary 2, of course...
Completely understandable, but as the Denizens of Leng have been mentioned as a possible mind flayer replacement, are they likely to make it into the first book?
never been a big abberration fan myself. Beholder and mind Flayers are OK but thats about it. I like a little Lovecraftian in my campaign but I am more of an undead/giant/fey/dragon fan myself
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Creative Director
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I wonder how much are the monsters likely to be changed mechanically? There's bound to be a lot of new fluff for many of them, but besides changes that come solely from the rule changes how likely are the monsters to be changed? Also will they're be racial traits for creatures like Goblins and Orcs that are balanced with other player races?
We're going to try to keep CRs unchanged. By which I mean, a CR 2 monster will remain a good challenge for 2nd level, while CR 20 will be a good challenge for 20th level play. In some cases (rakshasa, for example, or ogre mage) this'll mean that we'll need to change some mechanics. In others, we'll be making some changes to correct what we think are errors in the current design (derro will become humanoids, and ropers will become aberrations, for example). And in other cases, we might adjust other powers; the aboleth's Enslave power, for example, could easily become a dominate monster Spell-like Ability.
But the goal is for the monsters themselves to be relatively unchanged. The mechanics might be different, but an aboleth will still do everything an aboleth normally does, and you won't be seeing goblins getting weird new abilities.
For the most part. We've only just now started work on the monster design, so who knows what might transpire in the weeks to come?
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you won't be seeing goblins getting weird new abilities.
You guys made goblins weird enough already... thank you very much.
I, personally, would like to see challenges be a little tougher.
Are you guys keeping to the philosophy that a CR equal to party ECL will expend only 25% of party resources? I just hate that concept.
I'd like to see better feat choices for monsters. Like Orcs should have Power Attack. I mean they're strong and usually wield two handed weapons. Goblins aught to have like Dodge or something. And so forth.
I really do think humanoid monsters should be balanced as playable races, or at least given some additional racial traits.
RPG Superstar 2011 Top 32
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Oy, the other related thread I posted in seems to have died.
So, with the most minimal amount of cross-posting possible, please save the Yrthak as described here.
I really like the fact that you guys aren't changing much about the monsters, except some sorely needed facelifts for the Rakshasa and Ogre Mage. Please do the same for the Yrthak.
Possibly, you could reduce the average Yrthak's size, HD and CR rating so that it's more likely that they will face PCs in packs, rather than as a single, fairly unused monster. I know it's a little more drastic than what you guys are doing with the other monsters, but with a little TLC the Yrthak could be really really cool.
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Creative Director
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It's unlikely that the yrthak will be in Pathfinder Bestiary 1. Unlike the rakshasa and the ogre mage, the yrthak has neither the 30 some years of history of being a part of the game, nor the hundreds of years as being a part of real-world mythology. It's a brand new creature that has only been around for a fraction of the time as most of the other monsters in the game, and those monsters that have been around for a long time basically have seniority; they're the ones we're trying to get into the game first, and that means yrthaks will probably not show up until the Pathfinder Bestiary 2. Or 3. Or something down the line.
When/if we DO get around to bringing the yrthak into the PF RPG, though, I doubt we'll be doing much to change it. It's actually a pretty well-done monster already (I actually think it's one of the better monsters that was introduced into the game with 3rd edition)—but the fact that it has no ties to anything but itself and isn't a monster that folk recognize from history or tradition is the reason you don't see them show up in adventures as often as dragons or medusas or bulettes or manticores or wyverns, I suspect.
Unlike the rakshasa and the ogre mage...
So...the Ogre Mage is in?
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RPG Superstar 2011 Top 32
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It's unlikely that the yrthak will be in Pathfinder Bestiary 1. Unlike the rakshasa and the ogre mage, the yrthak has neither the 30 some years of history of being a part of the game, nor the hundreds of years as being a part of real-world mythology. It's a brand new creature that has only been around for a fraction of the time as most of the other monsters in the game, and those monsters that have been around for a long time basically have seniority; they're the ones we're trying to get into the game first, and that means yrthaks will probably not show up until the Pathfinder Bestiary 2. Or 3. Or something down the line.
When/if we DO get around to bringing the yrthak into the PF RPG, though, I doubt we'll be doing much to change it. It's actually a pretty well-done monster already (I actually think it's one of the better monsters that was introduced into the game with 3rd edition)—but the fact that it has no ties to anything but itself and isn't a monster that folk recognize from history or tradition is the reason you don't see them show up in adventures as often as dragons or medusas or bulettes or manticores or wyverns, I suspect.
Fair enough.
It definitely doesn't have the history of the other monsters, that I agree, *must* be included.
I just didn't want to see it get tossed since I hear so many people talk about how much they hate it, think it's lame, etc.
Are you going to use pictures that show only one monster and/or pictures that show more than one monster?
I hope you will only use the first type of pictures as I sometimes print out the pictures and hand them around while playing.
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Are you going to use pictures that show only one monster and/or pictures that show more than one monster?
I hope you will only use the first type of pictures as I sometimes print out the pictures and hand them around while playing.
I would guess the pictures would be similar to the Bestiary in the back of pathfinders
I would guess the pictures would be similar to the Bestiary in the back of pathfinders
ooo... I hope so.
It's unlikely that the yrthak will be in Pathfinder Bestiary 1. Unlike the rakshasa and the ogre mage, the yrthak has neither the 30 some years of history of being a part of the game, nor the hundreds of years as being a part of real-world mythology. It's a brand new creature that has only been around for a fraction of the time as most of the other monsters in the game, and those monsters that have been around for a long time basically have seniority; they're the ones we're trying to get into the game first, and that means yrthaks will probably not show up until the Pathfinder Bestiary 2. Or 3. Or something down the line.
When/if we DO get around to bringing the yrthak into the PF RPG, though, I doubt we'll be doing much to change it. It's actually a pretty well-done monster already (I actually think it's one of the better monsters that was introduced into the game with 3rd edition)—but the fact that it has no ties to anything but itself and isn't a monster that folk recognize from history or tradition is the reason you don't see them show up in adventures as often as dragons or medusas or bulettes or manticores or wyverns, I suspect.
Ok. I still miss the battlecray of "No Monster Left Behind" but am slowly accepting things for what they are.
However...does anyone else feel the same way as I do about certain 3rd edition monsters who are not from mythology and were just made up..yet now feel as much a part of D&D as other made up monsters like the Bulette, Xorn, Mimic or Ankheg?
Im referring to the Choker, Chuul, Destrachan, Girallon, Grey Render, Grick, Howler, Krenshar, Magmin, Mohrg, Shocker Lizard, Tendriculos and the Thoqqua.