Son of the Veterinarian wrote:
That seems more like an excuse for lack of creativity than a valid reason to set up a series of novels...
Just to touch upon several points, while a large part of the way our culture interprets sexuality and related social mores is, in fact cultural, underlying that is biology. If our ancestors were hermaphroditic, changed sex with age, or had fixed portions of the year where we were fertile, I don't think you would get the same human societies. If our ancestors lived in giant colonies, or dwelled alone in the wilderness, it would probably also result in major differences.
The funnest part of world building is trying to factor those differences into the setting. If Dwarves were truly disinterested in sex (say they feel no pleasure in it because they are not wired that way), how does that factor into their development? Why did they end up that way? Did their creator god just not think of that when putting them together? Were they cursed by another god? How are children raised in such a society? Does the concept of marriage even exist? Are there tensions between sexes? Those are questions I like to think about
Just some quick corrections...hope you don't mind Sincubus:
Xtabay: Central American folklore (although heavily retooled)
Shining Child: Could be novel, but thought it was actually an adaptation of Radiant Boys from paranormal folklore
Maftet: Egyptian mythology
Apocalypse Locust: Biblical
Elohim: Also Biblical
I think I am finally caught up on this thread, and just need to fix some formatting/edit, then I will unleash it.
Although I feel it might be less useful than I wish it was, because for space reasons the myth creatures are not really described, other than possible creature types and origin.
Who's to say Nocticula wants to be good. She might just be sick of the senseless violence associated with being a demon lord, and striving for a more neutral alignment. I don't see Nocticula, even is she does "rise", becoming the patron saint of puppies and rainbows.
I didn't mind the orcs when they were hunting the dwarves in the first move, as long as they were led by Azog. I actually like that compared to LOTR, the main bad guy was motivated by something simple as revenge, not just marching to the orders of an evil darklord.
Of course...this movie got rid of that element, and most of the hunting was done by a Azog flunky. Which was disappointing.
Karl Shuker's blog is always worth following if you have an interest in cryptozoology, weird zoology, and monsters
His newest blog exercepts a section of his new book on dragon folklore, and discusses dragon-like creatures from Oceania
Vod Canockers wrote:
There are only like 20 at most regular commentors on the bestiary threads. I don't think that sort of sample size can be used to infer all that much about product directions.
Mirage Wolf wrote:
Xenopterids are definetly from the movie Mimic.
Beheaded I think owe more inspiration from Castlevania than myth. Yaoguai is a creature in Chinese folklore, but at least in appearance they seem to be inspired from the bear in Prophecy and from the ?Fallout? games.
I personally really liked the movie, and thought it moved much faster than the first movie. Granted, this is because I treat the Movies as their own entity, and actually think straight up 100% faithful adaptations of books usually are worst than if the director took liberties with the source material. Film vs book and all that.
Only issues I had was the barrel scene...which was way to drawn out and a bit video-gamey (Same as the the mine scene in the first movie), and the forced love triangle, which felt random and unnecessary.
Jessica Price wrote:
I kind of agree here. You can say that he was trying to throw in cliches, but I don't think I have ever seen more stereotyped ethnicities in fantasy.
Granted I think the bigger problem with Eddings is that he basically went ahead and told the same story through 4 total different series. And he has a lot of trouble actually writing realistic female characters.
Well I have stated already that I would like a mythic bestiary that would flesh out the other outsider lord categories.
How would you factor in reprints though? As in from APs? Would they count towards the folklore/mythology (for some of them?)
I definitely do not want more than 4-5 existing fiends. 10 demons or devils is just too much. I would also want creatures inspired by movie monsters/literature to fall under the folklore section. Fiction is after all the mythology of today, and some of my favorite monsters from the last bestiary were inspired from those sources (Xenopterid, Immortal Ichor, etc).
That's a pretty exaggerated view. I don't think I have seen too many people complain about mythological or cryptozoological critters and their presence in bestiaries. Just because people want more angels doesn't mean they don't want mythological creatures.
FYI, most of those monsters I produced in my last big list were taken by going through a online plain text conversion of a 100 year old massive tome. No way in hell would I bother doing that for a wishlist...it's just that my own writing side projects dovetail this thread, so I took my notes from that and copied them over here for you guys. I suspect maybe Wannabe Demon Lord has done similar?
Incidentally I have wondered if Mummy's Mask might give us new Proteans. Todd said Proteans get their inspiration from the Ogdoad
Go to Ogdoad.
Yeah I misspoke as Gancanagh already pointed out. They don't have fans among the Paizo devs. We should give them over to Todd Stewart...I am sure he could work his magic on them.
I think in some of the product threads it's been mentioned that Aeons don't really have any fans currently, which is why they are focusing more on Psychopomps for true neutral outsiders. I am not sure that actually means we won't ever get ANY new Aeons at any point, but does make it unlikely until they get a Paizo champion.
People ask for some of this stuff because it's perceived to be a hole in the current bestiaries. Whereas most mythological creatures generally fall into the magical beast/undead/fey category, which there already is a lot of. There is something also to say that quite a bit of the low hanging fruit has either already been statted or already listed by someone.
The current "low-hanging fruit" are the various demigods, since we have had lots of details of them, but very few have been statted since Mythic just came out. Personally I am hoping we might get a mythic bestiary to help out with that, but I could see concerns that people might not pick up a CS book that was mostly demigod stats.
I don't really see to much an issue with knowing a lot about a campaign setting. I am usually able to separate character I play versus metaknowledge of the universe.
For a homebrew, I don't think I would want a setting bible, but I would certainly want enough information to be able to decide what character I might want to play.
Incorporating what little information is cannon (based on Bestiary 4), I would put the remaining races in these places:
Gathlain: Arcadia? For some reason they feel like they could fit well there
Trox: They escaped from Duergar control to the surface, where they are still in danger of enslavement. I would have most of the population still be down in the Darklands, but maybe have a few isolated tribes in the Hold of Belkzen or Five King Mountain regions, and perhaps other regions with a strong Darklands immigrant population
Wyrwood: Castrovel. Someone in the James Jacob thread wonder if there was an elvish connection, since elves use that type of wood in construction.
At any rate, Castrovel needs more races, and I could see a cabal of Wyrwood actively fighting against the elves
Wyvaran: Triaxus. I see them as serving as troops amongst the Drakelands Dragons. Given that a major theme of Triaxus is "Dragons", it seems like their should be a medium draconic race there
I am not so sure James Jacob meant to say "These don't exist on Golarion" as in "We do not yet have a place for them or have figured out there role"
We do know about 1 of the 5 races though: Kasatha are found in Numeria and apparently originated outside the solar system.
Except most players (customers) probably don't care enough about optimization to think the rogue is the worst thing ever. I doubt revamping the rogue and monk would be nearly as profitable from a time and cost perspective as doing new hardcovers with new class options/game mechanics.
Nakki are similar to Fossegrim, however whereas Fossegrim seem to be attractive, Nakki are more often depicted as ugly old men or given more monstrous appearances. I tend to treat them more as shapeshifting predators than Fossegrim
FYI, Karl Shuker had a blog about those stamps which is where I got some of those icelandic creatures. Obviously skimmed past a few while compiling the recent list.
My contribution: A few new Critters from various northern European countries: Most of these were new to me, although I have included a few slightly more well known critters:
Baiste-na-scoghaigh = Shape-shifting lumbering monoceros like beast from the Isle of Skye; propagates race by taking the form of a man and mating with female humans; may kill and mimic different men
Brunmigi = Norwegian; Noxious troll that inhabits springs; smells horrible and pollutes water
Disir = Norse; female warrior ghost-like spirits that symbolized fertility, fate, and death, and protected individual clans
Finngalkn = Norse; dragonic humanoid with human like head with large teeth, large heavy tail, and clawed limbs. Often associated with water
Fjorulalli = Icelandic "beach walker"; seal like monster who would interbreed with sheep and create offspring with deformed back legs.
Florutroll = Faeros islands Beach Troll; inhabited coastlines and abducted children; lanky, noisy creature covered in sea weed and pebbles
Gloson = Danish; spectral pig with red-glowing eyes, breathing flames; Large razor-like back, sharp enough to cut a person in half if it runs between a person's legs
Grave-sow = Danish; Undead hog who is a warning of calamity
Gryla = Faeros Islands Troll woman associated with christmas; resembles an old hag with 15 tails and a large unruly band of children; comes down from the mountains to steal unruly children and eat them
Haltija = Finnish; guardian spirits of various phenomena; different tribes of haltija guarded forests, water, women, death, fire, mountains, wood, and iron
Hrosshvalur/Raudkembingur = Icelandic; red-maned whale horse; causes huge waves by slapping tail
Kielkropf = Germanic/Northern European changeling, left in place for an infant. Couldn’t speak or properly walk, and noted to have a large head and wisened appearance. Left by dwarfs, devils, and other creatures in place of human children
Lior-trold =Norwegian; lake troll; inhabits alpine lakes; can appear as a horse, load of hay, or immense serpent. Also can take the form of different people. Most active in winter when breaks through the ice to prey on nearby people
Lundfolk = Grove-folk; Swedish; invisible spirits that guard groves sacred to the old gods; punish those who damage the groves; Inhabit trees like dryads; inhabited trees more lush than surrounding trees.
Mylingar = Swedish; ghosts of lost, murdered children; if seen, cause sickness; constantly cry for parents; can shapeshift into the resemblance of other people.
Nakki/Neck/Nok = Finnish/Northern European; monstrous water spirit; shapeshift, natural form that of a ugly fishman, but can shapeshift into a beautiful women, silvery fish, horse or hound to attract prey; can enchant and mesmerize prey with voice; eats human flesh. Can cause disease
Ofuguggi = Icelandic; venomous trout with backward pointing fins
Qvsernknurre = Finnish, Giant Brownie- like creature which inhabits mills; can extend it’s jaws to swallow anything; if paid in beer will increase the amount of flour produced; can be mischevious; weakness to fire and boiling water.
Raginal = Danish; farmyard spirit/troll that dwelt beneath the earth. Was polite, but disliked people/animals living above him, which he killed. Enormous strength; would be helpful if not bothered.
Saeneyti = icelandic sea cattle, which would breed with and steal away cattle
Selamodir = Icelandic; "Seal Mother"; giant seal that protects smaller seals from harm
Skeljaskaimsli = Icelandic shell monster; rusty brown, multi-limbed creature with a tapir like trunk and pangolin scales
Skoffin = Icelandic; a white cat-like creature with a death gaze that inhabits graveyards
Skovtroll = Swedish Wood-troll
Spokvatten = Swedish; mermaid like being composed of snow-white mist; bad luck to see
Strand-Varsel = Danish; ghosts of the unconsecrated dead who wash ashore and seek proper burial. Will possess people and make them head inland, to release them from their curse; great strength, and will kill those who defy them
Thorbagge = Norse name for scarab beetle, sacred to Thor; if found upside and righted, it expediated 7 sins from the helper
Thursir/Thusser/Thurser = Norway; man-like trolls with civilization; inhabit mountains and hills; pale blue in color; nocturnal; keep slaves.
Tomtar/Nisse = Scandinavian household/stable spirits; bearded dwarf; sometimes described as cyclopean or a shapeshifter; can cast illusions/become invisible; short temper; poisonous bite; would do farmwork for porridge
Uellerken = Germanic; Dwarf-like creatures, take the form of toads and reptiles by day, but humanoids by moonlight. Attracted to human women and converted to Christianity
Urdarkottur = Icelandic ghoul cat
Vittra = Swedish nature spirits; dwell underground and are usually invisible, but easily offended; raise cattle; will viciously drive off any intruders; open area beings but may be found in woods; field elves; sometimes steal cattle
Suggestion / Request: Would Paizo be willing to Design a new Class as something akin to the 3.5 Warlock?
Another angle would be for the GM to have it play out that the pit fiends name falling into the parties hands was intentional, and might be part of some bigger strategy on the part of Hell. Archdevils are sneaky like that, and that would be the angle I would go with.
Well for Nascent dieties, those would have stats equivalent to Infernal Dukes, Daemon harbringers, Nascent Demon Lords etc. Inner Sea Gods has examples of those you could use to model (They will generally be CR 20-25)
Demigods will be CR-26-30. There are some example Empyreal Lords, Demon Lords, and Great Old Ones in Bestiary 4, plus Wrath of the Righteous and the Mythic campaign setting book.
Anything greater than that is outside the rulebook however, so you will either have to adapt 3.5 rules or otherwise houserule. Unless you want to play with the Epic level rules, probably not worth it (Mythic tiers only gets you to CR 25 assuming PC level wealth and stats)
So not going to cast aspersions on people, but for those who run quasi-realistic campaigns, how can you accomodate human racism if you have creatures like Otyughs, goblins, or elves running around? It seems that when you have creatures which obviously are not human, and may have drastic differences in ecology, intelligence, and psychology, it's really hard to argue for discrimination based on skin tone or slight facial characteristics. The only way I could imagine intrahuman racism would be if there are no-nonhuman races, the nonhuman races are not sapient, or if they were extraordinarly rare as to be though of as mythological.
I can apply a similar argument toward sexism/homophobia. If alignment exists in your setting, and Gods are real entities with alignment, how can people justify mistreating others, as the worst offenders are going to ping evil and Gods actually can tell people to cut it out.
I like world building, moreso than writing. So I am always researching stuff, playing around with maps and cosmology, etc.
Unfortunately my big problem is that I get neurotic about attention to detail, and go way way overboard on background material which isn't going to be relevant for about 90% of the stories I want to write. At various points for instance, I have had 100 page documents listing cultural details of every possible fantasy race. All that detail inevitably leads to grid lock. And because of my science background I have trouble just saying "Magic!", I instead need to think of the evolutionary relationships between races, or figure out why culture x resembles some real world culture, or why if a certain technology or magic exists, why don't we get this problem/cultural influence developing.
It doesn't help that my views on world building tend to evolve with my reading interests, which means I am having to constantly re-invent stuff, either to avoid things which I find cliche now, or because some idea is too good to pass up.
Because as has been stated numerous times, anything that isn't minor errata leads to changes in word count, which leads to changes in spacing, which leads to Paizo redoing the layout. That's actually a decent amount of work for the editorial team, besides needing to playtest the new version. All for something you want them to give away for free.
Any rogue fix not involving new options will have to wait for a new edition.