Fuse stance combos and how it works?


Advice

Grand Lodge

The monk feat “fuse stance” is now with remaster a level 16 feat and therefore more accessible.
I would like to hear your thoughts on good combos with this feat.
And exactly how does it work?
If you fuse a stance like Dragon stance. Do you fuse the difficult terrain movement feature or the dragon tail unarmed strike or both?

If you fuse dragon stance with fx. Clinging Shadows Stance, how does your “Clinging dragon shadow” stance look like in mechanic therms? Is it a d4 attack or a d10 attack? Does it get all the traits for both or can you just choose for each unarmed strike you make if it is the dragon tail attack og the clinging shadows attack?


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Its rather neatly written into the feat

Fuse Stance wrote:

Prereq: at least two stances.

You have combined two stances into a single stance all your own. When you take this feat, choose two stances you know and combine them into a single fused stance. Give your new fused stance a unique name. When you enter your fused stance, you gain all the effects of both stances, including the requirements and restrictions.

If the stances both grant special attacks, you gain all those attacks. If a stance restricts you to one particular attack (such as Crane Stance), you must abide by that restriction. If the fused stances have incompatible restrictions, the GM determines which apply, or determines you can't fuse those stances at all.

So just to summarise;

-Upon picking the feat you create a new combined stance.
-You gain all special attacks, effects, requirements and restrictions.
-If the two stances have incompatible restrictions (such as crane and mountain restricting you to their own respective strikes), Then the GM decides if you can fuse them at all, or what restriction applies essentially overruling one restriction.

The latter is the change in the Remaster so with Clinging Shadows + Dragon Stance not restricting you to their specific strikes I would guess it looks like.

A. It costs a focus point (from Clinging Shadows)
B. You gain both Shadow Grasp and Dragon Tail, With all of their traits and behaviors. These are separate attacks.
C. You also gain the effects, Circumstance bonus to athletics and DC to escape your effects, And ignoring the first square of difficult terrain.
D. The stance ends if you were to gain any form of armor


NorrKnekten has it right.

You are in both stances simultaneously, meaning you get all the requirements, benefits and drawbacks of both stances. If the two stance conflict, talk to your GM to see if they can be combined and how.

As an example of Stances that can't be fused: you probably can't combine Monastic Archer Stance (req: wielding a bow) and Peafowl Stance (req: wielding a sword).

Another example: Crane Stance and Mountain Stance do not have conflicting requirements (unarmord and unarmored and touching the ground), but if you use the leap or jump options from Crane Stance, you lose the stance because you are no longer touching the ground.


I agree with what others have said, and will say I generally don't find Fuse Stance to be very valuable because the stances that I would want to fuse likely have conflicting requirements, even if they're not directly in conflict but like the example of Crane Stance and Mountain Stance.

Mountain Stance would cause you to only be able to use it's strikes, and a lot of other stances have benefits you might lose out on by needing to stay in contact with the ground.


Kelseus wrote:

As an example of Stances that can't be fused: you probably can't combine Monastic Archer Stance (req: wielding a bow) and Peafowl Stance (req: wielding a sword).

Another example: Crane Stance and Mountain Stance do not have conflicting requirements (unarmord and unarmored and touching the ground), but if you use the leap or jump options from Crane Stance, you lose the stance because you are no longer touching the ground.

Mhm, though....RAW Monastic Archer and Peafowl stance actually does work together.. but only if you are a tengu in a wheelchair.

Wheel blades are one-handed Agile,Free-hand Swords meaning Tengus can gain familiarity with them which gives them the monk trait with monastic weaponry. Which also counts as having a free hand in order to wield the bow.


Claxon wrote:

I agree with what others have said, and will say I generally don't find Fuse Stance to be very valuable because the stances that I would want to fuse likely have conflicting requirements, even if they're not directly in conflict but like the example of Crane Stance and Mountain Stance.

Mountain Stance would cause you to only be able to use it's strikes, and a lot of other stances have benefits you might lose out on by needing to stay in contact with the ground.

Agreed, Though I have seen discussions on Monastic Archer and Stoked Flames. Specifically for movement speed + Blazing streak... Im really unsure if it works but from what I can tell it really does just say, Stride twice.. Strike up to 4 different creatures within reach. The attack from Stoked Flames deals fire instead of Slash.

Stoked flames doesn't limit you to its strike either.


That is an interesting idea.

As a GM, I would allow the combination of those two. Monastic Archer restricts the kind of attacks you can make, but Stoked Flame doesn't. The way Blazing Streak reads....as a GM I'm only going to let you make attacks against creatures that are within your reach (which is probably going to be within 5ft of your movement path) but like...maybe that's worth it to occasionally be able to make 4 attacks.

If any of your enemies have reactive strikes it could be dangerous though.

And in case it's unclear, I definitely wouldn't allow for attacks beyond your physical reach with the bow while using Blazing Streak. But still...under the right conditions it's 4 attacks.

Edit: Wait...does MAP apply normally on the blazing streak attacks? It doesn't say it doesn't....so that would be bad.


Claxon wrote:
Edit: Wait...does MAP apply normally on the blazing streak attacks? It doesn't say it doesn't....so that would be bad.

MAP is a general rule that applies to all strikes after the first. Blazing Streak doesn't say you ignore MAP, so there is no reason to say it doesn't apply.


Yeah.....never mind then.

Getting fuse stance, to fuse something like Monastic Archer Stance with Stoked Flame (and Blazing Streak) is probably not worth it unless your GM is permissive in allowing you to make your bow attacks at a range beyond your reach....which I don't think is really supported at all.

Especially since after your first two attacks MAP will likely stop your attacks from hitting.

It's arguably worse than just using Flurry of Blows + Movement...Well maybe not worse. But it costs 3 actions and is therefore less flexible. But if you were going to Move and Flurry I guess it gives you a very small chance to make more successful attacks, and gives you more movement.

But I wouldn't go down that path unless I was interested in just making punching fire attacks in the first place as my main schtick.

Grand Lodge

Thank you all for the clarifications.
Perhaps is better to fuse with stances from multi classing or an archtype like marshal?


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Fuse Stance can be a decent pickup to combine the passive or non-strike benefits of two stances: Crane Stance and Tiger Stance for the extra jump distance and 10 ft Step, Mountain Stance/Mountain Stronghold and Ironblood Stance/Ironblood Surge for AC and damage resistance (plus the choice of using an action to either block for +2 AC or "parry" for +1 AC and a bonus to damage resistance), Kaiju Stance and Tangled Forest Stance to become Large (with the increased reach) and every enemy in reach has to save or make a check to move (immobilized on a failure), etc.


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
*Khan* wrote:

Thank you all for the clarifications.

Perhaps is better to fuse with stances from multi classing or an archtype like marshal?

The description of Fuse Stance does not specify which stances ("When you take this feat, choose two stances you know and combine them into a single fused stance. Give your new fused stance a unique name. When you enter your fused stance, you gain all the effects of both stances, including the requirements and restrictions."), so if you gain stances from an archetype/multiclass archetype that should be allowable by RAW.

Hmmmm... Monk with the duelist archetype might be interesting, now that I think about it... You'd have to pick up proficiency in light armor first, however (even if you don't wear any normally).


While I've never played a monk to that level but I'd love to have a multiclassed monk who picked up some Kineticist stance feats to merge them together with a monk feat. There are fun possibilities in that set.

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