Savage technologist musings


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion


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Hi there!

This is a bit of a mini guide to the Barbarian archetype called Savage technologist, as it is one of the few barbarian archetypes that is not completely overshadowed by primalist bloodragers!

This archetype essentially:

--Changes Rage to boost STR and Dex (the dex scales with further levels), instead of STR and Con. It also does not reduce AC. Not only does this mean you do not suffer from sudden barbarian death syndrome, it means that raging actually increases your AC.

--Trade out uncanny dodge and improved uncanny dodge for sword and gun:
At 2nd level, when a raging savage technologist wields a one-handed firearm in one hand and a light or one-handed melee weapon in the other, she can make ranged attacks with the firearm without provoking attacks of opportunity. She also gains the benefits of the Two-Weapon Fighting feat, but only if all attacks are made with those weapons.

This ability replaces uncanny dodge.

As well as improved uncanny dodge for

Crack Shot (Ex)

At 5th level, a savage technologist adds her Dexterity modifier to her damage rolls when making ranged attacks with a firearm while raging.

This ability replaces improved uncanny dodge.

And then you get:

Primal Magnetism (Ex)

At 3rd level, a savage technologist adds her Strength modifier on Diplomacy checks when interacting with tribal cultures. She can expend 2 rounds of rage (even if not raging) to add a bonus equal to 1/2 his barbarian level on a Diplomacy check.

This we basically gain for free, which can make you a not terrible face.

Now what is the conventional problem with this?
--Even with sword and gun, you still provoke AoOs when you reload
--Deft Shootist deed can help you, but it is expensive feat wise
--Relatively few rage powers help with ranged attacks
--Your off hand is limited to a cestus, or you pay another major feat tax/dip (for reloading via tails or tumors), or you get a specific dex belt that doesnt upgrade much for having a third "hand" 5 mins per day.

In my view, sword and gun is kind of a trap. It forces you into basically useing a pistol and a Cestus for much of the game, and you will provoke AoOs from reloading. Mind you, these provoked AoOs may well miss you because your AC is at least 4 higher then that of a normal barbarian, but unless you want to go for come and get me shenanigians, thats probably not the bestest idea ever.

What I would instead suggest is the following:

You dont bother with sword and gun. You are front liner with power attack, reach and combat reflexes at low levels, who gets a reasonably strong ranged option at level 3, and then transitions into a natural attacks who still has a pretty potent ranged option.

20 point buy human Barbarian Savage technologist:
STR 15
Dex 15+2 racial
Con 14
Int 8
Wis 14
Cha 8

Level 1: Savage technologist Feats: Power attack, Combat reflexes
Level 2: Savage technologist Rage power level 2: Fiend totem lesser
Level 3: Single dip into musket master gunslinger. Gaining Gunsmithing and rapid reload for free, picking extreme mood swings as a feat (this turns the rage into a +5/+5). Make use of your broken musket because you easily have the money available
Level 4: Savage technologist Increase Dex, rage power animal fury
Level 5: Savage technologist Deadly aim (deadly aim can also be picked at level 3 instead of extreme mood swings)
Level 6: Savage technologist, rage power Abyssal Blood lesser (2 claw attacks). You also gain dex to damage with firearms

What do you have other a "common Barbarian" of this level:
--You AC should be at least 4 higher, probably 6
--You do not suffer from sudden barbarian death syndrome
--You are a credible ranged threat, meaning you can force enemies to come to you
--You have 4 primary natural attacks for close and personal business, a business for whose purposes you still are a full Bab character with 20 STR before items
--Your reflex is about 4 better then a normal barbs
--You con is only midly worse (gunslinger dip has good fort saves)
--You essentially invested one dip (musket master, chosen because it comes with rapid reload attached to it), and one feat (deadly aim) into have a credibly ranged attack. Your musket comes from repairing your "starting musket" so its much cheaper
--You have pretty solid initiative

The more "important question" is what do you have over a bloodrager:
--Your AC is probably the same, because the bloodrager has a shield spell running (you could use a buckler with your musket, but its hit or miss).
--Your ref saves and init are probably a bit better
--the bloodrager pulls ahead surviability wise at level 7, when he gets mirror image, so he is overall more survivable, but cannot choose his engagement range, and you should have marginally higher will saves
--the barb is superior in a "you dont get to pre buff" scenario
--You have 1 more hp per level, but the rage hp of the primalist bloodrager are probably higher then yours.

Overall, this is closer in power then Barbs typically get to primalists.

Where do you go from there? There are plenty of options.
--Just keep investing in barb, pretty good rage powers are about to be unlocked
--Single level dip in spiritualist fixes any will save problems
--2 more levels in musket master let you full attack with the musket, as well as another +1 to ac
--Emyperal sorceror gets you shield as a spell and is wisdom based
--Inquisitor allows you to get a lot more face action while also increasing overall utility
--Feral champion warpriests allows you to use the animal blessing for getting natural attacks, so you can use the early rage power picks for different things (f.e. superstition line)


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Liliyashanina wrote:

Now what is the conventional problem with this?

--Even with sword and gun, you still provoke AoOs when you reload
--Deft Shootist deed can help you, but it is expensive feat wise
--Relatively few rage powers help with ranged attacks
--Your off hand is limited to a cestus, or you pay another major feat tax/dip (for reloading via tails or tumors), or you get a specific dex belt that doesnt upgrade much for having a third "hand" 5 mins per day.

Note that the savage technologist (emphasizing this because it's important) is designed to be used in a Numeria campaign with technological guns that use batteries and don't need to be reloaded after every shot. It is not designed for a "normal" campaign with early firearms (the rest of Golarion).

Liliyashanina wrote:
In my view, sword and gun is kind of a trap. It forces you into basically useing a pistol and a Cestus for much of the game, and you will provoke AoOs from reloading. Mind you, these provoked AoOs may well miss you because your AC is at least 4 higher then that of a normal barbarian, but unless you want to go for come and get me shenanigians, thats probably not the bestest idea ever.

Sword and gun can work even in campaigns with early firearms, but require specific strategies: a prehensile tail (tiefling alternate trait or vanara), a dip in alchemist for Vestigial Arm, etc.

Dark Archive

Dragonchess Player wrote:
Liliyashanina wrote:

Now what is the conventional problem with this?

--Even with sword and gun, you still provoke AoOs when you reload
--Deft Shootist deed can help you, but it is expensive feat wise
--Relatively few rage powers help with ranged attacks
--Your off hand is limited to a cestus, or you pay another major feat tax/dip (for reloading via tails or tumors), or you get a specific dex belt that doesnt upgrade much for having a third "hand" 5 mins per day.

Note that the savage technologist (emphasizing this because it's important) is designed to be used in a Numeria campaign with technological guns that use batteries and don't need to be reloaded after every shot. It is not designed for a "normal" campaign with early firearms (the rest of Golarion).

Liliyashanina wrote:
In my view, sword and gun is kind of a trap. It forces you into basically useing a pistol and a Cestus for much of the game, and you will provoke AoOs from reloading. Mind you, these provoked AoOs may well miss you because your AC is at least 4 higher then that of a normal barbarian, but unless you want to go for come and get me shenanigians, thats probably not the bestest idea ever.
Sword and gun can work even in campaigns with early firearms, but require specific strategies: a prehensile tail (tiefling alternate trait or vanara), a dip in alchemist for Vestigial Arm, etc.

Air Repeater is an early firearm, and doesnt even use black powder. Has 6 shots. You dont even need the musket master dip


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Name Violation wrote:
Air Repeater is an early firearm, and doesnt even use black powder. Has 6 shots. You dont even need the musket master dip

OK, you got me.

Make that "not designed for a 'normal' campaign with early firearms (the rest of Golarion outside of Arcadia)."

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