Alchemist Vs formulas

[MR CRITICAL]

If an alchemist learns haste from a spell book can he use it on his Allies or just himself ??? Or any spell that affects Allies ??

[Toshy]

Since an alchemist doesn't cast spells, but rather creates potion like extracts, all of his spells are single target - the imbiber.

It doesn't matter where he got the knowledge for haste from (a wizards spellbook, another alchemists formulae book, or by level-up).

Normally only the alchemist himself can use his extracts, unless he has the infusion discovery. If so he can hand the extract to an ally whi in turn can drink it to get the effect of haste.

Nonetheless it would only target one creature, namely the one which drinks the extract.

[Belafon]

As Toshy said: alchemist extracts are single-target and can only affect the creator unless the alchemist takes the Infusion discovery, but they are still single-target in that case.

There is the Spell Knowledge discovery: taking that discovery and choosing haste as the spell allows you to prepare the spell like a wizard would, in which case it can affect multiple targets. (But each preparation does eat up an extract slot, and a 4th-level slot at that.)

[Mysterious Stranger]

An alchemist can study a wizard's spellbook to learn any formula that is equivalent to a spell the spellbook contains. A wizard, however, cannot learn spells from a formula book. An alchemist does not need to decipher arcane writings before copying them.

When an alchemist learns from wizards spellbook he learns the formula not the spell.

[MR CRITICAL]

is there an alchemist archetype that lets u share formulas ?

[happykj]

Two ways I know that allow you to share extracts are prestige class Thuvian Alchemist and a level 10 discovery "aromatic extract"

Shared Infusion (Su):

When a Thuvian alchemist creates an infusion extract of a spell that normally affects multiple targets, the extract can affect a number of targets equal to her Intelligence bonus (up to the maximum normally allowed for the spell), though each creature must use a standard action to imbibe the extract. Only creatures that drink from the extract within 1 round of when the first imbiber starts drinking it are affected. A Thuvian alchemist must have the infusion discovery before selecting this discovery.

Aromatic Extract (Heroes of the High Court pg. 10):

The alchemist creates an inhaled version of an extract that is shared among multiple creatures. He must decide that an extract is an aromatic extract when he makes it. When used, the extract grants its benefit to all creatures within a 10-foot spread of the extract. The aromatic extract is treated as having the minimum caster level required for the original extract. An aromatic extract expends one of the alchemist’s daily extracts as if it were an extract 2 levels higher. This discovery can be applied only to extracts with a range of touch. An alchemist must be at least 10th level and must have the infusion discovery before selecting this discovery.

Both are not really useful, though, and can only be accessed at level 7 and level 10 respectively

[Belafon]

If you take the Infusion discovery, you can share your extracts with anyone. But only one user per extract. If you mean "target multiple creatures but only use up one extract" the answers are only what happykj said.

Neither of those options are useful for haste (the Thuvian's Shared Infusion requires every creature to spend a standard action, and the Aromatic Extract doesn't work because haste is not a touch range spell). There are situations and spells where either could be handy but they aren't usually common enough to be worth it.

Handy:

The Thuvian Alchemist can fill a niche (bomb throwing and light healing/condition removal) in some parties. Shared Infusion is a nice pick-up in that case for letting you actually use those long-duration communal buff spells that are on the alchemist's spell list but otherwise unusable.

Aromatic Extract is less useful because it takes effect at the lowest possible caster level. It might be worth having an Aromatic Extract of resist energy prepared in a 4th-level slot - if it wasn't limited to CL4.

[zza ni]

note that the aromatic extract doesn't normally work with haste as it only allow touch spells\extracts. and even if it did the extract slot used would be 2 higher and the caster level would be the minimum to cast the original extract (2 i think, for 2 rounds of haste only).

[Belafon]

zza ni wrote:

and even if it did the extract slot used would be 2 higher and the caster level would be the minimum to cast the original extract (2 i think, for 2 rounds of haste only).

7 rounds. Haste is a 3rd-level alchemist extract, which means the minimum caster level is 7.

But of course it doesn't matter since, as we both said, haste isn't a touch range spell.

I spent a lot of time trying to find a good use for that discovery, and I just couldn't come up with any. Too many limiters: it has to be touch range AND it uses up a slot two higher AND it takes effect at minimum CL. I get why they were all put there; take away any one limiter and there's at least one spell on the alchemist list that would be too awesome. But with all of them together it's hard to find ANY spells where it's not a downgrade from just preparing multiple lower-level extracts.

Awesome:

If it could be close range - 3rd level standard action mass enlarge person! Only for a minute, but how many combats last longer than that?

If it didn't take effect at minimum CL - lots of buff spells like resist/protection from energy, barskin, and tons of others might be worth a slot two higher, especially in large parties.

If it didn't take up a slot two higher - I might as well prepare this blur as an aromatic extract.