| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
RAW I think you can rage, stab yourself, harvest your own blood, and reduce your drained value.
Yes, it's quite ridiculous
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
You know that meme about plugging a powerstrip into itself?
| 4 people marked this as a favorite. |
I'm not familiar with the whole ruleset around bloodragers...but I don't like this whole concept around Harvesting Blood.
That was not at all a thing that PF1 Bloodragers needed. To me it's not even thematically on point, unless they completely changed the theme of bloodragers.
Bloodragers were/are sorcerer barbarians. Neither Barbarians or Sorcerers have a built in a mechanic like this.
I guess they're adding something like this to differentiate it from the "parent" classes in the same way that Magus does things a little different from Wizard/Fighter.
But I'm not a fan of this theme.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I'm not familiar with the whole ruleset around bloodragers...but I don't like this whole concept around Harvesting Blood.
That was not at all a thing that PF1 Bloodragers needed. To me it's not even thematically on point, unless they completely changed the theme of bloodragers.
Bloodragers were/are sorcerer barbarians. Neither Barbarians or Sorcerers have a built in a mechanic like this.
I guess they're adding something like this to differentiate it from the "parent" classes in the same way that Magus does things a little different from Wizard/Fighter.
But I'm not a fan of this theme.
They absolutely ran in a completely different direction from the PF1 Bloodrager. This one is entirely about gaining power from drinking the blood of your enemies. It has nothing to do with your own personal bloodline.
It very much *feels* like someone built it after having never seen the original bloodrager.
What I suspect happened is they tried out the Drained condition after casting spells as a means to draw down some of the barbarian's hardiness (PF1 bloodrager was a d10 class) to get some room for spell juice. Then they thought "hey, thematically the Drained condition implies things like blood loss, hey what if we lean into that" and by the end they came out with something with *extremely* specific blood-drinker/vampire flavor. I started a homebrew conversion to try to Sorcerer-ify it.
I do think the Drained mechanic is a pretty decent idea, and even if it is hard to get rid of as the OP mentioned it might still be intended.
| 4 people marked this as a favorite. |
That was not at all a thing that PF1 Bloodragers needed. To me it's not even thematically on point, unless they completely changed the theme of bloodragers.
Bloodragers were/are sorcerer barbarians. Neither Barbarians or Sorcerers have a built in a mechanic like this.
This isn't the PF1 Bloodrager.
Other than the name and that they both let you cast spells while raging they have essentially nothing in common. The PF2 bloodrager archetype has nothing to do with sorcerers.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
RAW I think you can rage, stab yourself, harvest your own blood, and reduce your drained value.I kind of suspect that many GMs won't allow that even if it is RAW. I know I wouldn't.
Any reason they couldn't just use it on an ally instead? It would be awkward to set up initially, but technically there's no penalty to the blood source beyond a bit of damage you can Treat.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
That was not at all a thing that PF1 Bloodragers needed. To me it's not even thematically on point, unless they completely changed the theme of bloodragers.
Bloodragers were/are sorcerer barbarians. Neither Barbarians or Sorcerers have a built in a mechanic like this.
This isn't the PF1 Bloodrager.
Other than the name and that they both let you cast spells while raging they have essentially nothing in common. The PF2 bloodrager archetype has nothing to do with sorcerers.
Yeah I gathered that, but this is kind of a "Thanks, I hate moment".
Don't get me wrong, this could be an interesting concept. But I don't like it being called bloodrager.
And I want a class that is analogous to the Magus but feels closer to the original Bloodrager of PF1.
Like a class that had wave spell casting like Magus, got a reduced form of rage, and some kind of additional thing (based on Bloodline) is what I was expecting/hoping for. Not this barbarian vampire theme.
Hell, I'd even settle for a barbarian class feat that would allow for spell casting while raging (that isn't Moment of Clarity) so you could pick up sorcerer dedication and do that without spending an extra action on turns you want to cast. Hell, even if it was like once per rage you can use Moment of Clarity without spending the action (which would let you cast a spell).
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I think if any errata is applied, it will be nerfs. With Harvest Blood working out of combat and no immunity per target creature, allies are valid targets and there are weird interactions.
-- It doesn't just work on bloodrager generated drained. If enervation or a monster drains you, you can cure it.
-- You can regain unlimited spell slots (of a lower rank than your max) via Siphon Magic.
Additional stuff that needs a look:
-- They can't decide whether bloodragers can be occult or arcane. I hope the latter because you'd get more spell attack options.
-- The last sentence of Surging Might doesn't make sense.
-- Nothing limits the rage trait to slots from the blood rager archetype, and nothing limits the drained from being applied when you cast outside of rage.
-- I don't think Sustain works, which might be unintentional.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I don't have the book, but if the Rage is similar to Barbarian rage, and you need to be raging to do those stuff, isn't the fact that Rage ends when the encounter ends enough to stop said shenanigans.
I understand that the Remaster removed the enemy conditions and such to start raging, but it still is something that's Encounter Based and not Exploration based.
Encounters CAN be a lot of things (not just combat), but sitting around in a campfire treating wounds is Exploration as far as I am concerned.
Harvest Blood does not have the Rage trait, and neither does Siphon Magic.
As written, you can just take a Dart Umbrella to deal very little damage to any ally to Harvest Blood (and it's nonlethal to boot), then Siphon Magic to regain spell slots, then Harvest Blood, etc. It's not a self sustaining loop because the Bloodrager doesn't heal the HP taken away by Drained, but Bloodragers don't have that many spell slots anyway.
The Archetype is still weird as all hell though, but there are easy (and just as silly) ways of getting around Drained, so it's not really a problem as written.
EDIT: Forgot to add, even if you don't want to hurt allies, this is the very definition of a Bag of Rats ability, but there are no easy fixes to it that I can see.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
The standard solution to Bag of Rats tactics is for the GM to just put the kibosh on stuff that goes against the "intended way to play the rule". Like PF2 is a "strong GM" system, so whether or not you can stab your friends with tiny needles or not is going to come down to whether your GM likes that idea.
Although it can get master proficiency it’s slots max at 6th rank and there’s no breadth feat, so with a lot of shenanigans you can at best fill up your rank 1 through 5 slots between every combat empty if you have that many. At higher levels where you have these slots you’re paying a lot of HP and taking real risk to cast them in combat, so probably you won’t blow through one Haste and four Sure Strikes in every combat. .
The standard solution to Bag of Rats tactics is for the GM to just put the kibosh on stuff that goes against the "intended way to play the rule". Like PF2 is a "strong GM" system, so whether or not you can stab your friends with tiny needles or not is going to come down to whether your GM likes that idea.
"You can drink your friend's blood, sure. But you have to be weird about it."
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Although it can get master proficiency it’s slots max at 6th rank and there’s no breadth feat,
This is all wrong. The errata gives full master benefits including slots, and breadth+ (it goes up to top slots!) is built into another feat.
Although it can get master proficiency it’s slots max at 6th rank and there’s no breadth feat,This is all wrong. The errata gives full master benefits including slots, and breadth+ (it goes up to top slots!) is built into another feat.
I missed that! I gotta go edit my homebrew
edit: Man 18th level for Breadth is brutal. Fixing that.