Enchantment and willing target

[Adamarh]

Hi,

So this is the situation, i have a mesmerist and in the trick ability it said "To implant a trick, the mesmerist must take a standard action and either touch a willing creature or implant the trick in himself."
What i want to do is :
- Cast charm person so he is friendly
- Use the Chain of eyes trick on him
- Then i use False Belief or Lemory lapse to make him forgot about the trick

So if i cast charm person does he count as willing?

[Valandil Ancalime]

Why do you think the target of charm person would be willing to have the spell cast on them?

[Pizza Lord]

Adamarh wrote:

So if i cast charm person does he count as willing?

If you successfully charm the target, it will regard you as a trusted friend or ally. In most cases, people are willing to accept spells or effects from trusted allies. Even if you lie and say it's something else (they'd get a check, but they'd still probably figure you have a good reason for lying it they do suspect). Even so, Chain of Eyes isn't really bad or harmful, so even if you told them exactly what it does, you'd likely be fine (though whether you want them to know that when their memory returns is a different story).

If they are willing (and they should be in all but the most suspicious or untrusting characters, ie. superstitious barbarians), you can implant the trick.

Using false belief can then make them forget about you putting the trick on them (assuming they know that's what you did), but when the duration ends they'll remember what you did (which might just be that you said you were going to do something helpful and closed your eyes for a moment).

Memory lapse would be more permanent, but since it only goes back to their last turn when you cast it, you probably won't get the implant memory unless you can do both in a round.

[Mysterious Stranger]

The spell does not enable you to control the charmed person as if it were an automaton, but it perceives your words and actions in the most favorable way. You can try to give the subject orders, but you must win an opposed Charisma check to convince it to do anything it wouldn't ordinarily do. (Retries are not allowed.) An affected creature never obeys suicidal or obviously harmful orders, but it might be convinced that something very dangerous is worth doing. Any act by you or your apparent allies that threatens the charmed person breaks the spell. You must speak the person's language to communicate your commands, or else be good at pantomiming.

The description of Charm Person states you need to make an opposed CHA check to convince it to do anything it wouldn’t ordinarily do. If the target of Charm Person was already willing to allow you to cast spells on it, why do you need to cast it? That means you need to make the opposed CHA check to cast a spell on the target

So, if you cast Charm Person and the target fails its save you can make an opposed CHA check to have it allow you to use Chain of Eyes. Memory Lapse does not require a willing target but does allow a save to negate. False Belief does require a willing target so would require another opposed CHA check. What you are looking to do can work but is not guaranteed.

[Valandil Ancalime]

Adamarh wrote:

So if i cast charm person does he count as willing?

I read that as, is the target of the charm person a willing target. But you probably meant, if the target of the Chain of eyes trick is charmed, would they be a willing target? The 2nd one makes more sense.

[Azothath]

Adamarh wrote:

...

- Cast charm person {on target} so he is friendly
- Use the Chain of eyes trick on him{target}
- Then i use False Belief or Lemory{memory?} lapse to make him forgot about the trick
So if i cast charm person does he count as willing?

I didn't copy the opening as you left a whole lot out, see Mesmerist Tricks. There are a lot of conditions and the range isn't great.

Casting a spell on a sentient creature is generally considered an attack (charm person). A willing target converts that to non-attack but you need some talking and a diplomacy check even if they are charmed.
IF{if and only if} the target agrees twice as you have the Chain of Eyes trick then a memory altering spell, thus not automatic.

Advice
It is just way too convoluted and the charmed target could just tell you about the event you want to know about, so you risk breaking the charm for spying by proxy. What if the target is blindfolded? You could just reduce person then go invisible and spy with a high bonus stealth check.
Chain of Eyes trick works on a creature... why not use your pet with superior senses?
There are items like [nonPFS]Nesa's Coin [none] $450 provides spell targeting info at a minimum.
Most players just dress up and pretend to be cultists or whatever group they are trying to infiltrate.