Do I understand this correctly that both of these spells basically give people an incredible speed whether it's overland movement or in combat movement?
Shadow walk is 50 miles/hour is 440 feet/6 seconds.
Wind walk is 60 miles/hour is 528 feet/6 seconds.
I have a group that is arguing that you have increased speeds even in combat.
If that's the case this spell is ridiculously overpowered.
Second, for Shadow Walk, are you essentially invisible to those on the Material plane when you're traveling on the shadow plane?
Does the shadow walk spell go from Point A to Point B and then end shunting them in a random direction or can you go back and forth between the material and the shadow plane without the spell ending?
Shadow walk only increases your movement when in the plane of shadow. Since you cannot make out details of the terrain or areas you pass over during transit how are you engaging in combat? You move normally on the borders of the plane of shadow so any combat there would not see an increase in movement.
Wind Walk acts as gaseous form so you have the same restrictions as gaseous form. While combat is not impossible while under gaseous form it is incredibly difficult. You cannot attack, and lose supernatural abilities. You cannot cast spells that have verbal, somatic, material, or focus components unless you have the feats that allow you to ignore those components.
the shadow plane overlap the material plane and if you read it's info it has very similar things in it which are somewhat distorted.
the spell say:
"Thus, you can use this spell to travel rapidly by stepping onto the Plane of Shadow, moving the desired distance, and then stepping back onto the Material Plane."
since the planes are roughly similar by going in the desired direction for the desired distance even if 'you can’t make out details of the terrain or areas you pass over during transit' you can have a rough estimation to where in general you are on both planes. but since it's blurry you can't be 100% sure until you get out of the 'quasi-real' 'coiling path of shadowstuff'
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Okay then if my players are going to a location they think is 400 miles south east, how exactly do i determine where they end up if they’ve never been there before?
They determine where they try to go the same way people did before the development of modern navigational tools.
"Our destination is 400 miles to the SE. That is approximately an 8 hours walk while Shadow walking. The maps says that halfway there we will reach Mount Fang, its shadow will be visible, so we can check if we are en route. Then there is the Dark Woods, they should be even darker in the Shadow planes. When we leave them when we will be in our destination area."
Not precise, but when your destination is "about 400 miles SE" that is what you get.
Then you decide or roll some dice to see how much "off-target" they are.
You can have them make some skill checks (something like the lowest value between Knowledge Planes and Knowledge Geography) to see if they can narrow the area or if they end off course by a wide margin.
In some of the latter books, there are rules for exploring an unknown area, those can help you decide what they meet.
Okay then if my players are going to a location they think is 400 miles south east, how exactly do i determine where they end up if they’ve never been there before?They determine where they try to go the same way people did before the development of modern navigational tools.
"Our destination is 400 miles to the SE. That is approximately an 8 hours walk while Shadow walking. The maps says that halfway there we will reach Mount Fang, its shadow will be visible, so we can check if we are en route. Then there is the Dark Woods, they should be even darker in the Shadow planes. When we leave them when we will be in our destination area."
Not precise, but when your destination is "about 400 miles SE" that is what you get.Then you decide or roll some dice to see how much "off-target" they are.
You can have them make some skill checks (something like the lowest value between Knowledge Planes and Knowledge Geography) to see if they can narrow the area or if they end off course by a wide margin.
In some of the latter books, there are rules for exploring an unknown area, those can help you decide what they meet.
Okay so let's assume the said destination is somewhere 400 miles south east. They have no map, no landmarks. How would you determine how off course they are to the destination. I was thinking of using Survival and the "Getting Lost" rules, but there isn't any random distance/direction rules for where they end up if they are lost.
I think this is where the rolls for planes\geography Diego mentioned come into. unless you speak about a truly featureless plane there will always be markings. and unless this is a place NO1 ever been through a successful knowledge rolls would indicate that they know enough about the area from others who have been there and spread the knowledge about (bards\cartographers\navigators etc). there should be some major land marks along the way (lakes\ rivers\ hills\ mountains \cliffs etc.) that they can align themselves to.
I would also add the getting roll vs lost rule anyway. since they are traveling and it should be in effect. getting lost would indicate that they might have mistaken the pound they just vaguely see to the lake they thought they would reach into etc.
the rules are very detailed on how to solve what happen if they do get lost
Because of the blurring of reality between the Plane of Shadow and the Material Plane, you can’t make out details of the terrain or areas you pass over during transit, nor can you predict perfectly where your travel will end. It’s impossible to judge distances accurately, making the spell virtually useless for scouting or spying.
The above section is copied directly from the description of the spell. It specifically states you cannot make out details of the terrain or area. Using shadow walk does not allow for precise movement. You can probably recognize so basic information to give you some clues. You would be able to tell you are traveling through hills, or forest. When you reach a community, you can figure out that there are building here but will not be able to distinguish any details of what they are. If there are multiple small communities in the area, you might end up at the wrong one.
The way I would handle it is that to use a map with a scale of miles. You can (with a successful navigation roll) choose the mile you end up in.