Figment and peripheral effects


Rules Discussion

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I suppose it doesn't especially matter either way, because perceiving something in your mind and seeing something visually that is not really there are both false stimuli.


Finoan wrote:
Player Core rules that I am seeing:

Yes it has changed to this as I stated.


I think part of what makes this confusing is that its kind of highlighting the difference between the brain and nervous system vs what Pathfinder calls the mind. My current read is that illusions (without the mental trait) are tricking the former without interacting with the latter. We tend to talk about the brain and mind interchangeably in everyday conversation, but Pathfinder barely ever mentions brains. A zombie or an ooze doesn't have a mind capable of deciding things or thinking past what its senses tell it, but those senses can still be fooled. How the illusion does this precisely is the crux of the thread. At the end of the day, most of us are landing on the illusion not being able to illuminate anything other than itself, so how that works doesn't entirely matter.

Except Ravingdork, who really wants to squeeze every possible drop of juice from this cantrip. I will note there's a very easy way for a GM to shut this down: figment creates a "simple illusory sound or vision." A GM could very easily argue illuminating anything else is simply too complex for the cantrip. Doubly so if you're trying to animate fire to emulate its flickering. That sounds much more akin to what the 1st level spell illusory object could do with its stated waterfall example. (I don't think illusory object can generate light either, but you'd certainly have a better case for it.)


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I rule that it seems to shed light, but it really doesn't illuminate anything except for itself. It's an illusion, its light is illusory too.


Gortle wrote:
Finoan wrote:
Player Core rules that I am seeing:
Yes it has changed to this as I stated.

Yeah. That post wasn't trying to give opinion on anything one way or the other. Just posting the relevant rules text since AoN hasn't updated yet.


Megistone wrote:
I rule that it seems to shed light, but it really doesn't illuminate anything except for itself. It's an illusion, its light is illusory too.

I'm quite OK with illusions shedding light. I consider that the visual trait requires it. I merely rule it's not enough light for any other useful purpose. I'm not going to illuminate any squares because of it.

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