Winter Sleet and it's interactions

[siegfriedliner]

Claxon wrote:

Farien wrote:

I'm just surprised that people are still thinking that PF2 is intended to have no-check I-win buttons like this. Maybe we are getting an influx of powergamers now that Starfinder1e is deprecated.

That's why I suggested it should be run as Grease, with a reflex save or acrobatics check. Which I think upset people because they want their "I win" button.

Currently it's a flat DC 15 acrobatics so enemies proficient in acrobatics always make it and those not proficient have a 25% - 50% chance of making it.

Making it a reflex save would mean with a flat DC that part of the stance would be useless at later levels.

Making it a reflex save using class DC probably would make the ability stronger Vs those with acrobatics proficiency but make it slightly worse Vs everyone else.

[Claxon]

siegfriedliner wrote:

Claxon wrote:

Farien wrote:

I'm just surprised that people are still thinking that PF2 is intended to have no-check I-win buttons like this. Maybe we are getting an influx of powergamers now that Starfinder1e is deprecated.

That's why I suggested it should be run as Grease, with a reflex save or acrobatics check. Which I think upset people because they want their "I win" button.

Currently it's a flat DC 15 acrobatics so enemies proficient in acrobatics always make it and those not proficient have a 25% - 50% chance of making it.

Making it a reflex save would mean with a flat DC that part of the stance would be useless at later levels.

Making it a reflex save using class DC probably would make the ability stronger Vs those with acrobatics proficiency but make it slightly worse Vs everyone else.

Yeah, I guess it didn't state it outright but the intention was not to keep it a flat DC but to make it a reflex save or acrobatics check (choice of the receiving character) against class DC.

[YourBestFriendJ0]

Hey, I've got a question about Winter Sleet that I haven't seen answered elsewhere and this looks like the place to ask it.
I'm a bit confused by the part where it says:
"A creature is off-guard on the ice, as normal for uneven ground."

Whereas looking at Uneven Ground it says:
"You are flat-footed on uneven ground."

They do the exact same thing in the sense they apply a -2 Circumstance to AC, however Flat Footed is also key to several abilities such as Sneak Attack.

So my question is, does Winter Sleet inflict both Flat Footed and Off Guard? Does it only inflict Off Guard? Is it understood that this is a misprint or is Off Guard used synonymously with Flat Footed and capable of activating features such as Sneak Attack?

Any help understanding would be appreciated.

[Cordell Kintner]

At the beginning of Rage of Elements there is a sidebar that goes over the changes in the remaster. One of them is that Flat-Footed is being renamed to Off-Guard. They're the same thing, just with a new name. You can check out the preview document here.

[breithauptclan]

'Off Guard' is a replacement name for the term 'flat-footed'. That is in the Remaster. The Core rulebook for the Remaster hasn't been released, but there is a quick conversion chart document that has been. Also the most recent books are being published initially with the new terms rather than being out of date as soon as they are printed.

[YourBestFriendJ0]

Thank you for the clarification, that helps a lot!