So I'm trying to see if there is a relatively simple way to get Weapon Specialization on a weapon I would only be 'proficient' with because it has the professional property. Its a long arm and I'm already multiclassed in 2 classes that do not grant longarm proficiency. So I thought about Versatile Specialization, but the problem in looking through the wording is that it ultimately depends lists proficiency as a pre-req which is explicitly ruled out by the 'professional" weapon property. I don't mind spending some credits, skills, or even a single feat, but as it stands right now I'd need to take both Longarm proficiency and then Versatile Specialization which is a pretty big investment for flavor (it is very fun flavor but still).
yeah, this is what prevented me from using professional weapons on the characters I made.
I don't see why versatile weapon specialization wouldn't work. When it mentions only applying to weapons that are selectable by weapon specialization it is making an exception for weapons like grenades which are not valid for the weapon specialization feat.
I would say that should you pick up the versatile weapon specialization then your professional weapon would qualify to benefit from the feat as you are considered proficient. Prerequisites means you wouldn't be able to use it to qualify for feats, not that you wouldn't benefit from them.
Versatile Specialization text.
Prerequisites: Weapon Specialization, character level 3rd.
Benefit: You gain specialization (see page 243) in all weapons with which you are proficient that can be selected with Weapon Specialization.
The issue is that last part since it directly references Weapon Specialization itself.
Prerequisites: Character level 3rd, proficiency with selected weapon type.
Benefit: Choose one weapon type (small arms, longarms, heavy weapons, etc.). You gain specialization in that weapon type, which means you add your character level to damage with the selected weapon type, or half your character level for small arms or operative melee weapons. You can never have specialization in grenades.
I kind of see where you are going, but that is very specific parsing out of the clauses in the text.
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Davor Firetusk wrote: So I'm trying to see if there is a relatively simple way to get Weapon Specialization on a weapon I would only be 'proficient' with because it has the professional property. Its a long arm and I'm already multiclassed in 2 classes that do not grant longarm proficiency. So I thought about Versatile Specialization, but the problem in looking through the wording is that it ultimately depends lists proficiency as a pre-req which is explicitly ruled out by the 'professional" weapon property. I don't mind spending some credits, skills, or even a single feat, but as it stands right now I'd need to take both Longarm proficiency and then Versatile Specialization which is a pretty big investment for flavor (it is very fun flavor but still). Nope. You'd need to gain proficiency through a normal means in order to qualify for taking Weapon Versatility in this case, sadly. Unless you are a primary caster, and thus already hurting a bit for spell slots after dipping out of your class, I'd suggest taking a level of soldier instead of burning a feat, and picking a fighting style that gets you something useful for your role and play style.
Davor Firetusk wrote: Versatile Specialization text.
Prerequisites: Weapon Specialization, character level 3rd.
Benefit: You gain specialization (see page 243) in all weapons with which you are proficient that can be selected with Weapon Specialization.
The issue is that last part since it directly references Weapon Specialization itself.
Prerequisites: Character level 3rd, proficiency with selected weapon type.
Benefit: Choose one weapon type (small arms, longarms, heavy weapons, etc.). You gain specialization in that weapon type, which means you add your character level to damage with the selected weapon type, or half your character level for small arms or operative melee weapons. You can never have specialization in grenades.
I kind of see where you are going, but that is very specific parsing out of the clauses in the text.
Versatile Weapon Specialization only requires that you have Weapon Specialization. It says nothing about requiring weapon specialization in the weapon you want versatile weapon specialization to apply to (the whole point of the feat in the first place). The professional quality only says that it doesn't apply toward prerequisites, not that you wouldn't benefit from affects that apply to all weapons you are proficient in. As the weapon quality does not state that you aren't actually proficient, you are actually proficient with the weapon.
Quote: If you have a number of ranks in the listed Profession skill equal to the item level, you are considered proficient with that weapon, even if you would not normally be. This proficiency never counts toward prerequisites of any kind. You are considered proficient in the professional weapon. Your proficiency in the weapon type of the weapon is not part of the prerequisite line of Versatile Weapon Specialization. It doesn't qualify for weapon specialization, but it should benefit from versatile weapon specialization as you are considered proficient in the weapon.
It can be read differently, but I find it more stretching not to take the weapon quality at face value. Just take specialization in a weapon you are normally proficient in which then qualifies you for versatile weapon specialization. Of course, you could just wait until 5th level so you reach at least 3rd in one class giving you weapon specialization as a class feature which also qualifies for versatile weapon specialization which would apply to your professional weapon.
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I do not see the argument against this.
Benefit: You gain specialization (see page 243) in all weapons with which you are proficient that can be selected with Weapon Specialization.
If you have a mining laser and you are a miner you are proficient with the weapon.
The weapon is a catagory you can gain proficiency in (heavy weapoons)
The line only means you can't get proficiency in grenades or something that can't give you specialization
BigNorseWolf wrote: I do not see the argument against this.
Benefit: You gain specialization (see page 243) in all weapons with which you are proficient that can be selected with Weapon Specialization.
If you have a mining laser and you are a miner you are proficient with the weapon.
The weapon is a catagory you can gain proficiency in (heavy weapoons)
The line only means you can't get proficiency in grenades or something that can't give you specialization
Professional Weapon Property wrote: If you have a number of ranks in the listed Profession skill equal to the item level, you are considered proficient with that weapon, even if you would not normally be. This proficiency never counts toward prerequisites of any kind. That's the argument. You are proficient with the weapon but that proficiency doesn't count when considering whether you can be Specialized with that weapon. So the question is: is having the appropriate weapon proficiency feat a prerequisite for the benefits of Versatile Specialization or just to take the feat in the first place? What, exactly, is the usage of "prerequisite?"
Personally: I read it as you don't count as having proficiency when looking at Versatile Specialization, and therefore can't get the benefits of Versatile Specialization. Other readings are possible, but seem like linguistic gymnastics to me.
Hmmmmmmmmmmm
I don't think its linguistic gymnastics as prerequisite is pretty clearly spelled out with it's own line. Yes, it's a prerequisite in the sense that without proficiency nothing would happen, but in xfinder prerequisite is a very clearly spelled out game term of stuff that goes on that line after the word prerequisite. It wouldn't count towards weapon focus, or towards adaptive fighting.
Proficiency without specialization is just not viable in starfinder, especially on ranged weapons. Keeping you from taking weapon focus (which definitely seems verbotten) seems like a good trade off. You're using a skill point per level to very little other benefit, that seems roughly worth the feat it might be saving you if you can't take weapon focus otherwise.
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