|
Hi there,
I read the short info for the new AP and I'm totally hyped for it. Unfortunately my group just started another AP and it will take some time until I can start this one. But I want to take the time and prepare for the AP and as I'm a 3D Artist and also have my own Resin 3D Printer I thought about creating a nice Miniature of the Oliphaunt for starship combat.
I don't have the books now, but wanted to start with modeling the ship. Is there any official free available picture of the Oliphaunt or can someone share a picture (only if it's ok for Paizo)?
| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
OK, first off, I can't wait to see your mini!
The Oliphaunt is on the cover of volume 2, Merchants of the Void, and has full exterior art there and also maps of all decks. But volume 2 is not out yet. Give us a few weeks, and you should get everything you need!
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Yeah, it will certainly not win any awards for coolest-looking spaceship of the Pact Worlds. But I guess that is by EJ's design.
Looks very cagey.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
The Oliphant. Boxy but good
|
| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
Honestly, now that I'm looking at it, it makes even MORE sense that the PC's would be hard to find with it after scarpering: it isn't very distinctive, so it blends in with other ships well.
Like the Millennium Falcon before her, "She may not look like much, but she's got it where it counts, kid."
| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
It’s a boxy looking ship. But personally, I love it. One person described it as a Volkswagen Bus in space, and they’re not wrong. It’s a ship for working people.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Also it's a super prototype cargo ship, not a super prototype one-fighter-fleet fighter.
| 4 people marked this as a favorite. |
Sure I understand that it's a cargo ship and no high-tech fighter/cruiser. But a boxy shape didn't communicate SOTA Prototype to me, more "old trusty friend" (like a Volkwagen Bus).
Let's see how the other pictures/maps show up. ;)
That is by (EJ Corp's) design. While the ship's class is relatively new, it is well-known and is seen as unattractive to interstellar merchant as a cargo ship. Nothing SOTA about that. It is the VW Bus.
The real prototype is wholly on the inside, and the unattractive and pedestrian nature of the ship's design plays well into EJ's secrecy about the project. They don't want a cool-looking ship that attracts attention.
| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
Sure I understand that it's a cargo ship and no high-tech fighter/cruiser. But a boxy shape didn't communicate SOTA Prototype to me, more "old trusty friend" (like a Volkwagen Bus).
Let's see how the other pictures/maps show up. ;)
That is by (EJ Corp's) design. While the ship's class is relatively new, it is well-known and is seen as unattractive to interstellar merchant as a cargo ship. Nothing SOTA about that. It is the VW Bus.
The real prototype is wholly on the inside, and the unattractive and pedestrian nature of the ship's design plays well into EJ's secrecy about the project. They don't want a cool-looking ship that attracts attention.
This pretty much captures the thought process Jake and I shared when designing it. In fact, the first paragraph of the ship’s description indicates as much. The Sledgehammer has an engine forward design that makes it fast, but less attractive to consumers. So Reisora set out to make tech that would not only change the hauling game, but turn the ship’s sales around.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Sure I understand that it's a cargo ship and no high-tech fighter/cruiser. But a boxy shape didn't communicate SOTA Prototype to me, more "old trusty friend" (like a Volkwagen Bus).
You have a prototype cargo thing that could warp the ship around itself like a bag of holding stuffed in a null space chamber stuffed in a ysoki's cheekpouch if your scientist forgot to carry a 2 somewhere.
This is probably the 4th or 5th ship they've TRIED to do this with.
Would you want to do that with a lamborgini or the old pickup you've got collecting dust out back?
Also once you have it, half its value isn't just that it holds more. It's that you can put things in it people have no way to suspect is there. You scan the ship, you have 2 20 by 20 compartments in a 40 foot wide ship, no one searches for a third 20 by 20 compartment. When smuggling you want the least conspicuous vehicle you can find.
There's also the possibility that some shape of the hull worked well with the bigger on the inside machine. Some Minivans have nitrous engines because 1) its a funny as hell way to goad someone into racing you and 2) the engine area is deliberately oversized to be easy to access and that happens to leave room for the nitro set up.
|
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
You know there is a difference between the real world and a game or?
The Millenium Falcon or the Serenity are also only a cargo ship, neitherless they look interessting/good, why? because they are a hero ships.
P.S.: What you linked is more a bulk freighter then a transporter/light freighter in SF terms. ;)
It's simple, the hero ship is more then a blib on the radar or numbers on a sheet, it's a character in a story. Sure some people don't care about their characters appearance, but that's what my group call "roll-player" ;)Then the world is full of real life roll players because cargo ships look like
this
or this"Sleek" and good looking is for private ships or cruise liner, not for cargo vessel.
... those aren't space ships.
You know there is a difference between the real world and a game or?
The Millenium Falcon or the Serenity are also only a cargo ship, neitherless they look interessting/good, why? because they are a hero ships.
P.S.: What you linked is more a bulk freighter then a transporter/light freighter in SF terms. ;)
Well, its not hero/not hero its a matter of WHICH flavor you're going with. An ace pilot with the latest cutting edge prototype would usually be sleek and futuristic (future futuristic?), Criminals would have something non descript, blue collar heroes have something ordinary , non descript and with more than a little Zee rust dirt and grime on it. The old man would dust off the "they don't build em like this anymore" tank that has some weird feature that plays a key part in victory (like ww I planes in ww 2 being made of wood, not showing up on radar, flying too slow to fight with and making NO noise before droppinig their bombs... there's a reason the russian pilots were called night witches)
|
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Thank you BigNorseWolf now I humming the song Nightwitches again... :D
I totally agree with you, the hero ship have to reflect the theme of the hero/story, but at the same time, it should be pleasing to the eye (e.g. the millenium falcon: a ordinary transporter, old(experienced) with some rough edges and possibilities to hide something. But at the same time good looking and charming. So basically Han Solo as a ship^^).
P.S.: The 588th didn't got these old aircrafts because of the "features" but because they were old and the russian army don't want to give modern aircrafts to a all female bomber wing. The women then used what they had and adapted their tactics accordingly (and became legends).
| 7 people marked this as a favorite. |
Thank you BigNorseWolf now I humming the song Nightwitches again... :D
I totally agree with you, the hero ship have to reflect the theme of the hero/story, but at the same time, it should be pleasing to the eye (e.g. the millenium falcon: a ordinary transporter, old(experienced) with some rough edges and possibilities to hide something. But at the same time good looking and charming. So basically Han Solo as a ship^^).
P.S.: The 588th didn't got these old aircrafts because of the "features" but because they were old and the russian army don't want to give modern aircrafts to a all female bomber wing. The women then used what they had and adapted their tactics accordingly (and became legends).
I've been a bit reticent to respond more here (as the ship's original designer before my work was handed off to development), at the risk of sounding defensive. But I love this conversation and want to engage with our fan base more, so go easy on me. I see your point and was aware of the risk when taking this approach to designing the ship. But if it helps, here's a couple thoughts I've had:
1. I really think the ship has the qualities of a hero ship. Perhaps it is less attractive than others (though beauty is in the eye of the beholder), but if you look closely at the design, you'll see a few rooms that might remind you of those in your own home. At the same, time, it has a ball turret up top that looks a little like those from WWII-era planes. I've also heard lots of players in my Starfinder games complain how far away some ship designs place the thrusters from the engine room. So you'll notice I placed em all right up front. I suspect engineers, science officers, and mechanics throughout the Pact Worlds actually love the EJ Sledgehammer. Everything they need to make the ship run is basically right behind the bridge! In my mind's eye, the Oliphaunt was always a bit like a B-52 bomber someone decided was obscure enough they could stick a cutting edge cargo hold in, just before someone else (the PCs) stole it and made a home out of it. But you know, with VTOL thrusters on the side that could rotate for vertical lift. (I sort of detest starships that I don't think can land and take off. So my original ideas for the thrusters being on the side came from a desire to explain how the ship transitioned from horizontal to vertical movement.)
I'll admit, even I didn't think the final product would have as many straight edges as it does. I envisioned a bit more hull space around the interior layout, similar to that shown by the Sunrise Maiden in my own notes and maps. But you have to remember that there's a lot of artistic interpretation that happen when writer, developer, and artist join forces. Overall, I love the way the Oliphaunt looks now, because it looks, to me, like the ship itself has character, and I always envisioned the ship as a member of the party. Sure, it probably has a lower charisma score than other members of the party. But it's dependable, faster than it looks, and resilient (you'll see how resilient in the volume I wrote). These were all characteristics of the old pickup I learned to drive in. To me, roaming around my farm as a teenager, it was a hero truck, despite the hundreds of scratches and dents all over the body. :) If the Oliphaunt doesn't look like a hero ship to you, I support you embellishing and modifying it to look like something you believe is heroic. That's the beauty of roleplaying games. The GM can always build or expand upon original ideas. We're on the same page there.
2. I once rode down the side of a Colorado mountain in a rusted-out van (I think it might have been a Volkswagen?) with no side door, no headlights, and no back seats. As the driver wove down a craggy path, dodging trees and rocks, he insisted that going more than 40 mph was necessary to avoid being stuck in the mud. My friends and I sat on toolboxes while bracing against anything we could find as we desperately tried to avoid falling out the open hatch. I thought for certain I was going to die that night. But hey, here I am.
That experience probably informed the Oliphaunt's design. If you step back and look at the ship from afar, it looks a bit like a warhammer. The bridge placement puts the crew members literally on the edge of the hammer. If the pilot makes a mistake that drives front of the ship into an asteroid, there's a possibility that choice could wipe out everyone. This "living on the edge" theme is something I wanted to capture, and I think Jason and the artist nailed it.
3. I hope my insights are helpful. I had a ton of fun designing this ship, and I hope you all enjoy exploring the galaxy in it! Cheers.
It really doesn't matter, how a "hero ship" looks. Just check out the Rocinante, Serenity or the Razor Crest (RIP!). All ugly as hell. Still cool.
|
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
@Zaister: Totally agree, a hero ship didn't had to look sleek or perfectly designed, but have some sort of character. And the more this threat goes on, the more the design of the Oliphaunt speaks to me.
@Leo Glass: I don't wanted to be offensive in any way. The design is/was just a little odd to me, based on the only information I had: "the players will steal a prototype (freighter) ship". ;)
And what you wrote makes totally sense. Having this insight (and the additional information about the ships origin) makes me understand the design more.
There is only one thing which bothers me and that are the "Box-Engines", not because they are boxes, but because they are big, plain boxes. :)
So I think I will modify them a little bit for my 3D model. :)
As I don't have the book myself, are there any other pictures of the ship in the second AP book or only the cover art?
As I don't have the book myself, are there any other pictures of the ship in the second AP book or only the cover art?
It's in the foreground of the table of contents illustration and shown, distantly, in space in the Alien Archives illustration.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
There's a significant "continuity error" in the Dead Loss side job that GMs should be alert to. Spoilers:
GMs will have to cook up their own solutions; one possible suggestion:
When the Final Encounter is located prior to the scenario, it's in real space. Between then and the PCs' arrival, it's jumped to the Drift and back again; allow the science officer a Computers check to notice that the drifting derelict is significantly "off course" based on the coordinates and telemetry provided by their client. Then, as the PCs approach, the Final Encounter unexpectedly (and coincidentally) powers up and jumps to the Drift right in front of them. If they immediately jump to the Drift as well, they find the ship still floating dead in the water and can proceed through the adventure as written.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Oh man. That looks like a space winnebago. But somehow boxier.
Spaceballs had to get its due at some point.
I mean, we're TOLD the millenium falcon is a cargo freighter. But we're never really shown it and its not implicit from the design. (the fact that it was a smugglers ship however was a lot more relevant...) Unless its SUPPOSED to push a cargo box with that gap in the front half?
Anyone looking at the oliphant would know what its for. I always like show don't tell.
| 5 people marked this as a favorite. |
Oh man. That looks like a space winnebago. But somehow boxier.
This made my partner and I laugh so hard.
|
|
Ok, it's easy to say that you don't like something, "but can you make it better?"
I don't know if I can but I will try.
I started some rough 3D blockouts for a "Oliphaunt MKII" and will refine it over the next weeks.
I will try to stay true to the original design and the basic idea of the ship. So I took the pictures I have, took some old VW Bus "Bully" pictures and mixed it together in my trusted 3D modelling program.
Please keep in mind that this is yet only a very rough blockout and that I'm not a concept artist, but a 3D modeler.
This project will probably take some time, but I wanted to share the progress with you guys and also if you like, gather your feedback.
Here is the link to the google album with the first picture:
Oliphaunt MKII
I will add aditional pictures of my progress over time.
|
|
Didn't had much time working on this over Xmas (PC died and Cyberpunk...), but came back to this.
I moved back to the square engines in the front and added some surface details.
Please keep in mind that this model is intended for being a 3D printed miniature, so it will be more stylized then realistic.
Added the latest render to the Google Album linked above.
I really like your latest render in the google file, but I still feel like every thruster on that ship should be able to rotate 360 degrees, rather than have a fixed position. Otherwise, I’ve never been able to conceptualize how this starship lands on planet or takes off.
|
|
I know what you mean and I really like VTOL concepts with rotating thrusters.
The problem I see at this ship is, that the front thrusters are so big, if they rotate (at their middle axis) you would need a lot of ground clearance (~ 6 meters), which would mean you would need a large (or steep) ramp to load cargo onto the rear ramp.
So I decided to not use rotating VTOL thrusters for landing but imagine some sort of anti-grav technology (or Levitation Mage-Tech) which allows for a vertical ascent/descent.
Edit: I played around with the dimension of the front thrusters and by reducing the size and putting the roation more in the back of them (so more like a hinge, then a rotor), it would be possible. I like the smaller front thrusters but it changes the feeling of the ship completely...
not sure which way I should go, maybe you guys have an idea (added the pictures)
I know what you mean and I really like VTOL concepts with rotating thrusters.
The problem I see at this ship is, that the front thrusters are so big, if they rotate (at their middle axis) you would need a lot of ground clearance (~ 6 meters), which would mean you would need a large (or steep) ramp to load cargo onto the rear ramp.So I decided to not use rotating VTOL thrusters for landing but imagine some sort of anti-grav technology (or Levitation Mage-Tech) which allows for a vertical ascent/descent.
Edit: I played around with the dimension of the front thrusters and by reducing the size and putting the roation more in the back of them (so more like a hinge, then a rotor), it would be possible. I like the smaller front thrusters but it changes the feeling of the ship completely...
not sure which way I should go, maybe you guys have an idea (added the pictures)
In my original sketch there was more hull space on the bottom of the ship that contained a bay-door compartment that opened and extended mech like legs as landing gear. When landed, this gives it plenty of clearance for thrusters to rotate and makes it look a little hunched over like the daishi mech from battletech.
I thought through all of this. The landing gear elevates the ship. The cargo ramp extends the same distance to allow entry. So while that can’t be shown in the concept art, believe me, it was already thought about. If you have questions about the ship, fee free to DM me. Happy to help.
I just looked at the last concept. My idea was it would rotate from the middle, so the legs extend downward enough to provide enough clearance for that the profile of the large thrusters is kept lower, making them look like shoulders and so they won’t snap off. Once in space, the oversized thrusters justify the higher speed value I gave the ship. The landing gear is only necessary in atmo.
Basically what I’m saying is the under part of the ship, it’s belly, needs more depth too, so it has space for extensive landing gear and looks like it can bear the weight of the oversized thrusters.
That is, if you want to keep this model true to the original design. If not, it’s your ship! Do what you feel is best!
|
|
Thanks a LOT Leo.
This kind of insight & description really helps me to get my creativity flowing.
I gave it another pass, I changed the size of the front thrusters a little bit and added a mechanic which pushes the thrusters a little bit up, when in landing configuration. This reduced the required ground clearance (so it's now ~ 2 meters at the front bulge). This also gives a little more room for the landing gear and a little bit greeble on the bottom.
Thanks a LOT Leo.
This kind of insight & description really helps me to get my creativity flowing.I gave it another pass, I changed the size of the front thrusters a little bit and added a mechanic which pushes the thrusters a little bit up, when in landing configuration. This reduced the required ground clearance (so it's now ~ 2 meters at the front bulge). This also gives a little more room for the landing gear and a little bit greeble on the bottom.
Looks better to me! My recommendation is to put in the three mechanized landing legs (in a tripod) on that version, as it should become clear that there’s a little more clearance for the thrusters to lower to a more squat position that way. Also, if you want, I’d recommend bulking up the T-frame of the ship to include more bulkhead and armor space between the interior and exterior walls. (If you need inspiration for what I’m talking about, look at the Sunrise Maiden map.) Anyway, it looks very cool. I hope your players like it! I may use it for mine, once you have the final version.
|
|
And another update.
Flashed out the rear part and added some greebles to the hull.
Have to flesh out the rear and bottom view and the turret needs to be replaced (so far it's a russian AA turret from one of my older models^^).
@Leo: The T-frame is indeed a little "thin", especially if considering that this would have been cargo bay too. Have to check if I can beef them up a little bit.
also please consider the main purpose of this model is to serve as a print-file for a Oliphaunt miniature for starship combat. So the level of detail can't be too small. (Maybe I have to do a test print soon^^).
And another update.
Flashed out the rear part and added some greebles to the hull.Have to flesh out the rear and bottom view and the turret needs to be replaced (so far it's a russian AA turret from one of my older models^^).
@Leo: The T-frame is indeed a little "thin", especially if considering that this would have been cargo bay too. Have to check if I can beef them up a little bit.
also please consider the main purpose of this model is to serve as a print-file for a Oliphaunt miniature for starship combat. So the level of detail can't be too small. (Maybe I have to do a test print soon^^).
No worries! It’s your model! I just figure if you wanted input, I’m happy to share my thought process.
Also, I checked out the latest version. Looks great to me! When you’re finished, could you please send me the file? I’d love to have it 3D-printed myself so I can keep the miniature in my office!