Does anyone know how the Spellcasting Feats from Eldritch Archer interact if you already have spellcasting from our base class (or another archetype)?
The Dedication specifically says you get a Cha-Based cantrip if you don't cast spells, OR an additional cantrip added to your existing ones if you already cast spells. The Basic/Expert/Master Spellcasting feats make no such distinction, however.
So let's say I'm a Ranger with Wizard Dedication and later go Eldritch Archer and take Basic Elritch Archer Spellcasting. Do I get additional Int-Based prepared spell slots or do I get separate Cha-based spontaneous spell slots?
This combination also causes some RAW weirdness as the EA Dedication wouldn't give me a repertoire, but the EA-Spellcasting feat would then add spells to that non-existing repertoire.
If you already have spellcasting from another source, you continue that. If not, you gain Cha based spellcasting.
Quote: a:If you don't already cast spells from spell slots, you learn to cast spontaneous spells and gain the Cast a Spell activity. You gain a spell repertoire with one cantrip of your choice, from a spell list of your choice. You choose this cantrip from the common spells on your chosen spell list or from other spells to which you have access on that list. This cantrip must require a spell attack roll. You're trained in spell attack rolls and spell DCs for that tradition. Your key spellcasting ability for these spells is Charisma.
b:If you already cast spells from spell slots, you learn one additional cantrip from that tradition. If you're a prepared caster, you can prepare this spell in addition to your usual cantrips per day; if you're a spontaneous caster, you add this cantrip to your spell repertoire.
The two entries (if you have spellcasting already, or if you dont have spellcasting) are seperate things, an either/or scenario.
Basic/Expert/Master Spellcasting is for Archetypes that grant you Spellcasting.
So, if you already had spellcasting (so on case b, then I dont think you qualify for those.
Quote: Some archetypes grant you a substantial degree of spellcasting, albeit delayed compared to a character from a spellcasting class.
Spellcasting archetypes always grant the ability to cast cantrips in their dedication, and then they have a basic spellcasting feat, an expert spellcasting feat, and a master spellcasting feat.
In short, i believe that Eldritch Archer is a spellcasting archetype and isn't a spellcasting archetype depending on if you didn't or did have spellcasting already.
So if I already have spellcasting, I simply can't take the EA-spellcasting feats?
But nothing keeps me from getting EA spellcasting first, THEN adding another Spellcasting Dedication?
That doesn't make any sense...?
Blave wrote: So if I already have spellcasting, I simply can't take the EA-spellcasting feats?
But nothing keeps me from getting EA spellcasting first, THEN adding another Spellcasting Dedication?
That doesn't make any sense...?
If you already have spellcasting from an archetype and picked EA, you already went with option "b" which locks you in the tradition from what i can tell.
So, even if you pick another spellcasting archetype, EA is linked to your first one.
That said, if you pick a second spellcasting archetype, you already have access to the basic/expert/master spellcasting of said archetype from it's dedication, so there wouldn't be any benefit to have access to it from EA (they would be the same thing afterall)
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If you didn't have spellccasting and you picked EA then EA grants you Cha-based spellcasting of a tradition of your choice. If you pick a second spellcasting archetype after that, then you simply have 2 seperate spellcasting archetypes, no different than if you were a fighter that had picked both wizard multiclass and sorcerer multiclass (as an exmaple)
shroudb wrote: Blave wrote: So if I already have spellcasting, I simply can't take the EA-spellcasting feats?
But nothing keeps me from getting EA spellcasting first, THEN adding another Spellcasting Dedication?
That doesn't make any sense...?
If you already have spellcasting and picked EA, you already went with option "b" which locks you in the tradition from what i can tell.
So, even if you pick another spellcasting archetype, EA is linked to your first one.
That said, if you pick a second spellcasting archetype, you already have access to the basic/expert/master spellcasting of said archetype from it's dedication, so there wouldn't be any benefit to have access to it from EA (they would be the same thing afterall) No, I meant if I wasn't a spellcaster already. Say I'm a figher and pick up EA as my first dedication. I have no spellcasting, so I get dedication option "a", including the ability to take the EA spellcasting feats. I could then take another caster archetype and have it completely seperate from the EA spellcasting.
If I take cleric and wizard dedication in any order I can also freely pick the spellcasting feats for both. I don't see why EA would be any different. The feats simply don't cover this very well and don't say what exactly happens if you get EA Dedication while already having another source of spellcasting.
EDIT: Saw your Edit too late. It's certainly a way to look at it. It's still weird - to put it mildly - that the oder of dedications would limit my ability to expand upon them with additional feats.
Blave wrote: shroudb wrote: Blave wrote: So if I already have spellcasting, I simply can't take the EA-spellcasting feats?
But nothing keeps me from getting EA spellcasting first, THEN adding another Spellcasting Dedication?
That doesn't make any sense...?
If you already have spellcasting and picked EA, you already went with option "b" which locks you in the tradition from what i can tell.
So, even if you pick another spellcasting archetype, EA is linked to your first one.
That said, if you pick a second spellcasting archetype, you already have access to the basic/expert/master spellcasting of said archetype from it's dedication, so there wouldn't be any benefit to have access to it from EA (they would be the same thing afterall) No, I meant if I wasn't a spellcaster already. Say I'm a figher and pick up EA as my first dedication. I have no spellcasting, so I get dedication option "a", including the ability to take the EA spellcasting feats. I could then take another caster archetype and have it completely seperate from the EA spellcasting.
If I take cleric and wizard dedication in any order I can also freely pick the spellcasting feats for both. I don't see why EA would be any different. The feats simply don't cover this very well and don't say what exactly happens if you get EA Dedication while already having another source of spellcasting.
EDIT: Saw your Edit too late. It's certainly a way to look at it. It's still weird - to put it mildly - that the oder of dedications would limit my ability to expand upon them with additional feats. it doesnt really limit your ability to expand though.
In case you end up with seperate "spellcasting" abilities, then you can expand both (one from EA and the other from it's own archetype)
If you end up with 1 spellcasting ability, basic/expert/master spellcasting wouldn't "stack" either way since it would be the same feat but from different source
shroudb wrote: it doesnt really limit your ability to expand though.
In case you end up with seperate "spellcasting" abilities, then you can expand both (one from EA and the other from it's own archetype)
If you end up with 1 spellcasting ability, basic/expert/master spellcasting wouldn't "stack" either way since it would be the same feat but from different source
The latter means I can only get one Basic/Expert/Master spellcasting feat instead of 2. How is that not limiting my ability to expand my spell slots?
I get how you look at the feats and it might be RAW, but I fail to see how this would ever make sense or be good design. That's as if I couldn't take Opportunist if I take Fighter Dedication after Rogue Dedication.
Blave wrote: shroudb wrote: it doesnt really limit your ability to expand though.
In case you end up with seperate "spellcasting" abilities, then you can expand both (one from EA and the other from it's own archetype)
If you end up with 1 spellcasting ability, basic/expert/master spellcasting wouldn't "stack" either way since it would be the same feat but from different source
The latter means I can only get one Basic/Expert/Master spellcasting feat instead of 2. How is that not limiting my ability to expand my spell slots?
I get how you look at the feats and it might be RAW, but I fail to see how this would ever make sense or be good design. That's as if I couldn't take Opportunist if I take Fighter Dedication after Rogue Dedication. Well, i should have said "doesn't limit the amount you gain per feat" to be more precise. Because yes, the 1st option allows you to pay double the feats to gain 2 different spellcasting abilities.
But as i said before, that's no different than picking 2 different spellcasting archetypes and progressing both.
I agree that it is weirder than a straightforward spellcasting archetype because they have to make it work if your Primary is a spellcaster.
So it needs the option to either stick to a preexisting spellcasting or grant a new spellcasting option, and that is unique compared to every other spellcasting archetype.
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