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Hmm. I actually do give players the opportunity to change a pregen's name and/or pronouns at the table without requiring both be changed. There's the iconic character who appears in stories and comics, and then there's the specific character being played by the person at the table right then, and I don't see them as needing to be identical. I guess I just think of it as a slightly different parallel universe where Iseph uses he/him pronouns instead of they/them.
The one thing I am is intentional about it. When a player picks Iseph, I'll usually say something along the lines of "All right, Iseph the iconic is agender and uses they/them pronouns, but you can change their name, pronouns, appearance, or other details about them for today."
I would however, probably insist on they/them if Iseph were the NPC to round out a three-player group.
Venture-Captain, Minnesota
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I'm actually really glad we're having this conversation, because it shows how we're all in different places here.
If you are used to working that request into the introductions in San Fransisco, great. But the entirety of organized play is not San Fransisco. This is not a conversation people are used to having everywhere.
I actually think this conversation is even more necessary in rural areas than in San Francisco. I cannot tell you how many times my 'She, her' button has caused a complete stranger in a rural area to share their own pronouns to me in a whispered moment of pride. In rural areas, many people who appear gender conforming on the outside are looking for safe spaces and validation.
I have become a sort of adopted mom for a number of kids who've temporarily lost their parents approval over their gender identities. When I showed one of them Shardra's backstory, they cried. It was a moment of validation that a kid who loved to game sorely needed.
I'm not asking you to become an advocate, a therapist, or an expert. But I know you, Wolf. You are the most welcoming person I know. You create guides to help people transition to Organized Play. You would in an instant stop a player at your table who was bullying someone else over their weight, skin tone, or lack of game knowledge. You care about your players and your community.
This small thing -- asking pronouns -- can set the tone for acceptance for a trans or non-binary character (not to mention their player.) GMs set the tone and initial culture of a table. Don't worry that you will make mistakes. You will. But just by trying, you can make a world of difference to someone out there.
Hmm
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I see. So you refuse to say a dozen words or provide simple tools because it makes you slightly uncomfortable and
No. Because I don't think it would more good than harm when I do it . I'm not comfortable with the topic and thats going to be readily apparent when I make the statement. Rather than inviting someone to open up, I think someone would misread ambivalence and hostility and clam up.
I don't think I'm unique in that regard, and much like ancestry I'd imagine you'd get some people pushing back with snide comments or worse.The option is great for the people it works for. I don't think i'm one of those people.
because you think tabletop gamers will magically self-correct. (Guess what: they don't.)You're the one running on the idea that a basic level of respect will be achieved and then everything else will automatically follow. It doesn't.
I think gamers given an occasional poke will slowly correct somewhat. I think gamers given too hard of a poke will poke back.
The above example from Captain Fuzzifuzz — that you favorited —For making a good point. Even people not in total agreement can recognize when when someone has a point. (and I don't think I've disagreed with anything Fuzzi has said though I don't know if the converse is true)
is all too real and demonstrates how the issue becomes endemic if left alone. It also demonstrates how it places the burden on the PC/person being misgendered, which isn't right.No it isn't fair. But being unfair doesn't automatically mean a fair solution exists. Running a table in those circumstances I'm pretty confident in saying I wouldn't notice the pronoun usage if it bit me on the rear end. If people don't notice it they can't react to it. People don't just immediately turn on a dime and start noticing details like that because they've been told its an issue.
I'm genuinely interested in what you would do in a situation where one player is consistently misgendering another player/PC, and that player is clearly upset and constantly having to correct the other person.
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If you are used to working that request into the introductions in San Fransisco, great. But the entirety of organized play is not San Fransisco. This is not a conversation people are used to having everywhere. Coming from people that don't do this regularly and don't have as much invested in the topic it's going to sound artificial, stilted, and forced. Yes. Even just a "couple of words". Even if they're the right words. You're asking for a bluff check from people that don't feel as strongly about the issue as you do and even some people that are against the issue.And this is where I think a lot of the resistance comes for me. I don't like being prodded or poked into overtly spreading a social message that isn't an issue for me, I 'm not qualified to talk about, don't really have any feelings for, and don't feel comfortable discussing.
I really respect that asking for gender pronouns can be awkward and seem stilted. I'm 40something gay cisgender guy who learned about the importance of gender pronouns in my 30s. I still find it awkward.
Here's the thing, though: This is not a "social message". Some folks in PFS might think of it as a political issue that only social justice warriors care about. But it's not. It is simply about caring about other people.
There might be a person at my table who's transgender or genderqueer and I don't know it. If someone continuously uses the wrong pronoun for them or their character, I understand that it's hurtful and literally sets off signals that they are *threatened* at that table. THREATENED.
Imagine how you'd feel if I sat down at the table and continuously used "She" to refer to you (assuming you're a cisgender guy). You might either think it's funny, or be irritated.
But you generally don't have to worry about someone at the table literally threatening your physical safety.
We do think about this a lot in San Francisco and Oakland. That's because there is a higher concentration of transgender/genderqueer folks here who have fled here from other parts of the country that are not safe for them.
With that in mind, I don't want to dismiss your discomfort doing this at your table in a more conservative part of the country. But sometimes we have to be a little uncomfortable to make sure others are safe and feel welcome.
And if, by doing this, you made your corner of the country a little more safe and welcoming for all kinds of people, you'll be making yourself a hero to those of us who've been forced to flee from there.
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Your thoughts and feelings are totally valid!
I do appreciate the apology. It does make me feel better.
I agree that there is a more significant conversation to be had about making our gaming venues safe and inclusive places. To that end, I am addressing the point that follows before I later and separately post my thoughts in response to Kate's comment.
I empathize with BNW over his concern for feeling awkward introducing the concept of declaring pronouns for the characters (let alone the complexity of creating a safe place for someone to declare their own pronouns without appearing to try to out an individual). And I don't think pressing him (or anyone reading in his boat) on one's perceive ease of implementing a solution is going to be effective. It was effective for me. I read, "create a space for pronouns on your character tracker," and done, all my future online game sign-ins will have a space for the character's pronouns. Can I create a sign-in sheet for in person that includes a space for pronouns? Yes. If we ever get to play in meat space again. It may not be that easy for someone else, and I understand.
You can start slow. Effectively, on PbP, I am starting slow. My sign-in forms are passive. The space exists. I do not need to say anything or have a conversation with anyone. I technically don't need to mention it in VTT games other than to say, "Please fill in the sign-in form."
That may be where some people are able to start: including the space on their sign-in sheets for pronouns.
Some people may be able to hand out table tents and request that the characters' pronouns be placed on them or ask in a VTT that they sign in with their pronouns listed in brackets on their handle or ask them to note them in their forum headers.
Some people may be able to speak up and say:
Time for character intros! Along with a description, please note your character's pronoun so we're sure how to refer to them.
And some people may be able to say to a table full of people, "Hello, everyone. I'm Blake and I use he/him/his. I'll be the GM. Who are you playing and what pronouns does the character use?"
To indicate that one falls X location on the spectrum of comfort does not make them better or worse than someone who indicates that they fall Y on the spectrum. To clarify, I have not perceived anyone making this value assertion in this discussion, this is in reference to the larger population. It is OK to say, "I think that I'm only capable of doing X right now."
It is OK to admit that one may not notice misgendering of a character. Characters are invisible to a degree. The player sits at the table and speaks. The character, at best, is a 30 mm painted plastic or lead representation in the middle of a table or next to the player's pile of dice or picture of indeterminate accuracy ranging from 5 mm to 15 mm in size somewhere on a digital screen and potentially in a different window. The individual player is focused on the GM, their own character sheet, their own combat decisions. GMs are focused on rules, the scenario instructions, the NPCs' tactics, and 3-6 other people simultaneously.
There has to be room to asses a given situation, which is why I think the current policy in the handbook is adequate. There is no one-size-fits-all policy for when misgendering has risen to the level of harassment.
One might reconsider their assessment of:
Continued misgendering, whether intentional or not, falls under the "verbal aggression" clause from my perspective.
Emphasis mine
...when it is a 10-year-old boy repeatedly calling the male PC played by a female presenting player "her" or the autistic 20-year-old who calls every PC "him" no matter what or is an adult from Finland or Hungary.
There needs to be some understanding and graciousness in the response to unintentional misgendering, even if you've taken them aside and given them what you think is the most moving speech about gender and misgendering and the other player's feelings there ever was.
I am not advocating ignoring the episode of misgendering. I am advocating being judicious in our response to a given episode. As well as some understanding that we'll get our response wrong (too lax or too severe) sometimes.
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The nice thing about what Doug is suggesting is that it's simple and structured — not something that relies on us being super empaths.
1. Ask folks to identify the pronoun of their characters.
2. Create space at your table to gently correct people if they get someone's gender wrong (and to do the pull-aside that you mention if they're being insistent)
This. Very, very much this.
If someone is GMing a game, and a player asks that you identify them or their character by their given pronoun, you should make a point to use it. If you're a player at a table and another player asks you to identify them or their character by their given pronoun, you should use it. If you ask someone at the table to identify either you or your character by your preferred pronoun, you should have the safe expectation that the people at the table will make an effort to do so.
Most trans people like myself know, from experience, that not all gender identities are immediately evident from a first glance. Generally we won't mind if you slip up now and then, so it's really only an issue of annoyance if it's done really, really excessively. And even then, we generally know that it's not malicious and typically just someone not paying attention :)
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Blake — No one here is saying to be ungracious or mean to anyone making an honest mistake (especially children, etc).
I understand many people who misgender someone on accident may feel judged or embarrassed. It's understandable; (the person probably should especially if it's repeated). Empathy is important: how do you think a transgender/genderqueer person would feel in this situation? How do you think they feel dealing with this burden all the time?
Also, I kinda think if you want to be a good GM and build a good community you sometimes HAVE to do things outside your comfort zone. (As an aside I find it interesting these conversations typically evolve in such a way that we're focusing on protecting the people misgendering others rather than protecting the one being misgendered. Myself included; I am continuing this conversation and possibly drowning out other voices. Please note that I am not targeting this statement at anyone on this thread in particular, it's just a general trend I see rather often and not only on forums).
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I can confirm this personally. Sit down for story time with Isabelle.
I used to love running games at conventions here in Michigan. I'd sign up to GM literally every slot of cons. But...
After a while, the misgendering (both willful and unintentional-but-recurring) got to be too much. The last straw came at TavernCon 2018, when a player (who had misgendered me at every opportunity the previous day) went on a loud rant about his opinions on same-sex relationships; a rant loud enough that I could hear it all two tables away. When I approached the convention organizer, his response was "He has a right to his opinion. If you don't like it, feel free to debate him."
I don't know you personally Isabelle, but I can tell 100% that this community is a better place with you in it.
Venture-Captain, Nebraska—Bellevue
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Count me among the clueless geeks. I read the first 30 or so posts last night before running a quest. I'm continuing to follow because I'm not afraid to learn or evolve, and the topic is interesting.
I will admit to being clueless and not understanding the full meaning of some of the terminology involved I find myself guessing at context sometimes.
I guess I was a bit more self aware of that in the game last night. I GM'd Quest 8. I find as a GM I don't usually use many personal pronouns for my players. I have developed a style where I want to personally interact and remember people who play at my table. So I am much more likely to use your personal name or your character name. If I use your name 20 times in a session, I'm more likely to remember your name weeks or months later.
"Bob, what would Knuckles like to do?"
"Bob, you took a crit for 36 damage."
Etc.
But I stumbled a moment with box text and an NPC of all things. There is an NPC in the quest - a non-binary human. The box text was clear "they" was the appropriate pronoun. But I found myself stumbling particularly particularly outside of box text. I caught myself trying to insert he or she. Prior adventures, I'd likely have done a quick "rewrite". But it was an interesting self observation to try to go with it as written.
Where and when I grew up, there were certain topics you didn't bring up in "polite company" - politics, religion, and sex. I'm typically not going to ask those personal questions of you. If you want me to know you are welcome to tell me. But otherwise, it's none of my business.
I want everyone to enjoy the game and feel comfortable at my tables. But I might have to ask for some patience here. My personal evolution may take some time.
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Blake — No one here is saying to be ungracious or mean to anyone making an honest mistake
I perceive earlier posts by other people--neither you nor I--addressing yet other people in this discussion--neither you nor I--as contrary to that assessment.
I may have incorrectly perceived their intended meaning, but it would take clarification by the authors of those statements to change my perception of those statements.
However, this is one of the points that I'm getting at:
But I might have to ask for some patience here. My personal evolution may take some time.
Moving on to another direction, since they are here and self-identified:
Isabelle Lee, CaptainFuzzifuzz, how would each of you prefer to have a GM handle a player who has unintentionally but repeatedly (more than once) misgendered your character? How would you have preferred a GM handle a player who has unintentionally but repeatedly misgendered your character during the period before coming out to your gaming community, if there was such a period?
And I do ask for patience and forgiveness if I have phrased my question awkwardly or inadvertently offensively.
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Where and when I grew up, there were certain topics you didn't bring up in "polite company" - politics, religion, and sex.
This topic isn't really about any of that, either.
I'm imagining that where and when you grew up, it was easy to tell who presented as male and who presented as female, so nobody asked.
Now imagine instead a gala where everyone is wearing a costume and a voice synthesizer, and you can't easily tell.
How would you go about asking?
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Venture-Captain, Nebraska—Bellevue
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Where and when I grew up, there were certain topics you didn't bring up in "polite company" - politics, religion, and sex.This topic isn't really about any of that, either.
I'm imagining that where and when you grew up, it was easy to tell who presented as male and who presented as female, so nobody asked.
Now imagine instead a gala where everyone is wearing a costume and a voice synthesizer, and you can't easily tell.
How would you go about asking?
Fair assessment.
Honestly, I'd probably start with "Hi my name is John, what's yours?"
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I actually think this conversation is even more necessary in rural areas than in San Francisco.
That might be true, but it doesn't mean that game night is the best venue for it, or that a DM is automatically person who should be kicking it off.
The comment about location was more about how unusual the method of introducing yourself is. If it really isn't anyone's sop, then what you're asking for is that everyone have an awkward conversation every time they introduce themselves so that less than one percent of the population has a slightly less awkward conversation when it comes up. I can't really see how the insistence that everyone change how they do things all the time works out under those circumstances.
But I know you, Wolf.
I am great when I have an engineering problem in front of me. Social justice issues are more like literary interpretation. This is connected to that which is connected to that and the only thing I get about it is that I don't get it.
Don't worry that you will make mistakes.
People take it very seriously and seem to assume that everyone should know THE rules for behavior, and that their rules are the rules.
I don't think a lot of the folks in the social justice circles realize how big the gulf in familiarity is between the people involved in it and those not. (I had at least three people ask me what source-book a non binary gnome was out of) It sets up expectations for rules of society that are assumed to to be universal and gets disappointment when those rules aren't.
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@BNW:
When a player sits down with a Shirren or Android or Maraquoi, how do you go about asking what the character's preferred gender pronouns are?
Now do that with everyone's character.
I don't. There's usually some point in the scenario (either waiting in the office, during the long elevator ride down the spire of absolom station, or the 5d6 days in the drift) where I'll ask the character who are they, what do they look like, what do they do, and ___some other random personality building question here. (Whats the best/worse part about being stuck on a starship with you, how do you pass the time, who did you tick off to get this assignemnt etc). During that time someone can directly say or show what pronouns they use
Klaighthwax is a host shirren. They stand around 6 feet tall with a broad build with an entire collection of their eggs in transparent aluminum spheres tied together in a net...
Klaighthwax is a host shirren. They use they/their pronouns. They stand around 6 feet tall with a broad build with an entire collection of their eggs in transparent aluminum spheres tied together in a net...
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I don't think a lot of the folks in the social justice circles realize how big the gulf in familiarity is between the people involved in it and those not. (I had at least three people ask me what source-book a non binary gnome was out of) It sets up expectations for rules of society that are assumed to to be universal and gets disappointment when those rules aren't.
I mean, ever heard of this character named Loki, Big Norse Wolf? You don't need to be from a "social justice city" to have come across genderqueer characters in storytelling or culture or literature.
Those characters are in stories everywhere. They're important. You do not need to be from a specific "social justice" place to understand that or give them space and respect in your own stories.
----
Also, 006400, not sure that that's about.
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My name is 006400! But friends call me "Sixty-Four". Pleased to meet you!
"And you may call me Teearseeaich... or 'TRCH'. It is always good to see <Error: term not found> who are fighting the good fight and sticking it to the <Syntax Error: 'Ten' not identified in context>. How can the Grandmaster help you today?" <evilchuckle.exe NOT FOUND>
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I mean, ever heard of this character named Loki, Big Norse Wolf?
Eyup. I argue with Big Bro all the time whether they get a card on mothers day or fathers day.
But being familiar with the concept doesn't automatically grant familiarity with the term.
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I mean, ever heard of this character named Loki, Big Norse Wolf?
Eyup. I argue with Big Bro all the time whether they get a card on mothers day or fathers day.
But being familiar with the concept doesn't automatically grant familiarity with the term.
Wouldn't it better to just send two cards? Just sayin'... :>
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I don't think a lot of the folks in the social justice circles realize how big the gulf in familiarity is between the people involved in it and those not. (I had at least three people ask me what source-book a non binary gnome was out of) It sets up expectations for rules of society that are assumed to to be universal and gets disappointment when those rules aren't.
I grew up in a small, very conservative town. My family covers a range from deeply conservative to, well, me.
Point is, I understand the gulf you're talking about. We aren't asking this of you frivolously. We're asking because it is actually important for transgender and genderqueer players. Not because of political ideology. Because we care about these members of our community.
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Venture-Captain, Nebraska—Bellevue
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Also, 006400, not sure what that's about.In the context of our exchange, I was pointing out an example where giving your name isn't always enough to determine one's gender pronouns.
Thanks Nefreet, that's a good summary or your and 64's point.
I still think I'd be more comfortable and less awkward in this with a reply like
Nice to meet you, how'd you hear about our PFS group?
Or
Welcome to PFS. This is Bob, Dave and Sara. Why don't you introduce yourself to the group. (Or some variation of tell us a little bit about yourself or your character.)
Continuing the premise that we just met, 64's in costume and I have no idea how 64 self-identifies. I wouldn't expect you to tell me more about yourself than you feel comfortable saying. I wouldn't want to ask questions that seem to pry for more information than you want to share.
Suggestions?
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I wouldn't want to ask questions that seem to pry for more information than you want to share.
Suggestions?
I think that's a fair question. Anytime we encounter a situation with which we haven't had experience, it can be awkward knowing how to start. Like a first date.
But Starfinder provides us with a nice segue into this particular discussion: multiple genders are a part of the setting. It's even highlighted in the intro of the book.
So you could go around the table and phrase your query as easily as:
"Hey, everyone. Welcome to Starfinder. Let's go around the table and do introductions. Please include your character's name, race, class, and preferred gender pronouns."
If someone does that eyebrow arch thing, you could elaborate further by simply adding:
"Starfinder has multiple races that possess more than one gender, and I want to make sure we're addressing everyone correctly."
And if someone tries to joke about you saying "more than one gender", you could even highlight that there are races with only one.
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"Hey, everyone. Welcome to Starfinder. Let's go around the table and do introductions. Please include your character's name, race, class, and preferred gender pronouns."
Just say "pronoun" not "preferred gender pronoun."
Using "preferred" puts a qualifier on it which implies you do not think the person's gender is real. (to be fair "preferred" was popular for a while but it isn't anymore. Err on the side of simplicity.)
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Must be regional (although we're not that far away from each other).
The acronym "PGP" is still what I hear during LGBTQ+ introductions.
Even if you cut the word "preferred" out, "gender" needs to still be present, because the average person will just ask you "What do you mean by 'pronoun'?" anyways.
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I grew up in a small, very conservative town. My family covers a range from deeply conservative to, well, me.
The tree hugging druid isn't exactly standing on the right wing of the plane, but even here the focus is more on the bottom levels of maslow's heirarchy. Get people food shelter medicine. For the self actualization part of the pyramid the emphasis is on the self part.
You don't need to go that far over before you're asking for things outside of someones comfort zone and the language of social justice becomes a foreign language. You're not hitting that point at the fringe. There's still a LOT of plane left.
Point is, I understand the gulf you're talking about.
But you later wound up in an associated community and probably get a lot more exposure that way. (technically I'm in the alphabet soup a few letters out but there's no reason to form a community around that)
We aren't asking this of you frivolously. We're asking because it is actually important for transgender and genderqueer players. Not because of political ideology. Because we care about these members of our community.
Lets say dancing is very important to someone and its a big part of their character.
My character needs to be able to dance:
Sure. No problem
My character needs space/time to dance and to point out that they're dancing:
Sure. I toss the spotlight around a bit, you do you.
you need to not make fun of my or my character for that:
Makes sense. Add that to the verboten pile.
These are kind of normal for the social dynamic.
___
I want everyone to dance with me so I don't feel singled out. Even if they don't like dancing.
Even if no one says they want to dance, everyone should dance anyway in case there's someone that wants to dance. They shouldn't have to ask to begin with they should have an example of dancing already there if they want to start.
You have to bring up dancing because its important, even though this isn't a dance studio. If people want to play baskeball they'll have to have a brief discussion about dancing first.
_
That isn't the way a group dynamic usually works. I'm trying to think of another situation where you can expect that level of active participation from people, much less everyone altering their normal behavior just because someone else exists.
Then it goes even further
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You need to think of dancing as important. Not just important to me but important. You need to change the way you think about it
--
This is definitely not in the social contract. You don't get to decide that someone else is just wrong so they have to change they way they think, and probably their entire decision making process that they used to make that conclusion.
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Because dancing is important, you will be good at dancing. If you don't hate me you will become good at dancing. Your like of me will enable you to overcome a lifetime of being a maladroit.
Just not being a )(#$#)($ is enough to know how the dances work, even if the choreography is really involved or we change the choreography
There really isn't an objective definition of what good dancing is, but you'll be a good dancer for me anyway.
___
This just doesn't follow at all.
Just caring about another person isn't going to carry an idea through all of those levels. You are definitely asking for a lot more there.
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You don't need to go that far over before you're asking for things outside of someones comfort zone and the language of social justice becomes a foreign language.
Where is this idea that asking for someone's gender pronoun a matter of "social justice"?
It's as basic a question as "what class is your character?"
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I want everyone to dance with me so I don't feel singled out. Even if they don't like dancing.
Everybody has a gender pronoun, though. Even you. If someone honestly thought you, with your wolf paws and bushy beard, were female, you would correct them. Right?
Not everyone has the privilege to assume that their gender is obvious. Doubly so for fantasy characters. So, the most basic level of understanding you can offer is to ask.
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Must be regional (although we're not that far away from each other).
The acronym "PGP" is still what I hear during LGBTQ+ introductions.
Even if you cut the word "preferred" out, "gender" needs to still be present, because the average person will just ask you "What do you mean by 'pronoun'?" anyways.
It's not regional; I'm trying to help you craft a better statement. You can read more on it all over the internet; "preferred pronoun" is now viewed as transphobic. It's pretty mainstream and even sites like Forbes and Mashable have published articles about why the term should now be avoided.
- Forbes: Why You Should Not Say ‘Preferred Gender Pronouns
- Mashable: 5 accidentally transphobic phrases allies use — and what to say instead (suggests you simply use "pronoun")
Really, just think about the meaning of "preferred."
I'm not going to get too much in the weeds here because I think overall your intentions and statement is great. However if you're not going to listen to other VOs who worked on crafting statements in tandem with members of their communities, then at least please be prepared listen to individuals in your community if/when they ask you to change your phrasing or have feedback on a statement you crafted, and be willing to learn and accommodate.
--
"Preferred pronoun" isn't the end of the world either and people will get what you mean (and it's hard to keep up).
I only said somethign because you specifically asked for suggestions.
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Where is this idea that asking for someone's gender pronoun a matter of "social justice"?
The concern is over language and the meanings and implications thereof to society. You're looking at the implications of misgendering a fictional android (that wasn't even someone's character at the time) and representation. Thats pretty much social justices wheelhouse. If i had any doubt....
Doug Hahn "Just say "pronoun" not "preferred gender pronoun."
Using "preferred" puts a qualifier on it which implies you do not think the person's gender is real
Nefreet The acronym "PGP" is still what I hear during LGBTQ+ introductions.-
When I hear social justice this is pretty much the Ur example of what I'm thinking.
Everybody has a gender pronoun, though. Even you.
Which I don't think I've ever had to spell separately as a character or as a player.
If someone honestly thought you, with your wolf paws and bushy beard, were female, you would correct them. Right?
Unless something was really wrong with them I'm pretty sure I'd conclude they didn't honestly think I was female and were messing with me. My reaction to that is highly variable. (and often pizza based)
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BigNorseWolf — I'm a dude from the midwest in his 40s who's usually at baseball games drinking beer when not at PFS. Learning this stuff wasn't easy for me either but as a VO I try to make everyone in my community to feel welcome and comfortable at games. I made mistakes along the way and still do. If saying 10 words at the start of a session gets that done even though I'm not always comfortable doing it, I will do it. If I can learn about what to say and what not to say by having a discussion with my players, I will do it.
It's not a political social justice thing; it's something we should be doing as GMs in Org play because ostensibly this whole exercise is about sharing stories with people from all playstyles and walks of life. It's about having fun, too — and being misgendered (or watching someone suffer or constantly have to correct others from being misgendered) isn't fun. It wrecks tables and removes voices and diversity from PFS.
Being a good GM or leader means you have to sometimes step outside your comfort zone and do or learn things you aren't 100% comfortable with.
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/me stops talking to person who thinks evolving but reasonable standards of courtesy are leftist politics and therefore not worth adopting. I am going to go *dance* with partners who want to learn how to step together.
I really love how many of us agree here that it’s worth adapting our behavior to be more inclusive. You’re why I’ve been proud to be a part of Pathfinder Society these last 11 years.
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I only said something because you specifically asked for suggestions.
And I thank you!
I'm an active Alumni for Delta Lambda Phi, and having these sorts of conversations are exactly what we're about ^_^
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Everybody has a gender pronoun, though. Even you.Which I don't think I've ever had to spell separately as a character or as a player.
If someone honestly thought you, with your wolf paws and bushy beard, were female, you would correct them. Right?Unless something was really wrong with them I'm pretty sure I'd conclude they didn't honestly think I was female and were messing with me. My reaction to that is highly variable. (and often pizza based)
That would be what we call "privileged", then.
Not everybody has that privilege.
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As someone who constantly, constantly misgenders and mispronounces names in role-playing games even when trying my hardest, I tend to apply Hanlon's razor quite liberally.
Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.
Gender pronouns can be quite tricky, especially for those of us on the older side with ingrained habits. In school we were given very specific rules about language and would lose points on papers for not using them as we were taught. The AP Stylebook didn't allow "they" as a singular pronoun until 2017 (and I believe it still discourages it in favor of rewording the sentence). I was taught to always use a masculine plural unless the group was explicitly all female.
One thing that would be helpful is if Paizo makes it easier on us. I recently GMed a scenario (3 times) with three NPCs. Two used the they pronoun, but one of them constantly spoke in "surfer-speak" and referred to everyone as "dude" regardless of gender. If anyone asks them to stop, they use "buddy" instead. If GMs and players are expected to be fluent in gender identities, scenarios shouldn't include NPCs who ignore them.
Side note: The one explicitly gendered NPC was named Iziphis, which made it even harder since Izeph is the one non-gendered iconic. I guarantee you I only got the pronouns right about half the time for each NPC.
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Two used the they pronoun, but one of them constantly spoke in "surfer-speak" and referred to everyone as "dude" regardless of gender.
Heh, as a 5th generation Californian, with a father who literally surfed with the Beach Boys, I can tell you that "Dude" is non-binary ^_^
I have a surfer-vesk who uses "Dude" for everyone as well. I wish I had brought him to that scenario, but I signed up with another character.