I just bought the Oracle class deck and I was immediately excited to play Grazzle. In looking over his role cards I was trying to decide which of the two I liked better (his armor power on Bone Diviner was especially intriguing) so I looked ahead in the Core Set boons and came across Voidglass Armor.
Display. While displayed:
* [...]
* When you would discard cards from your deck or as mental damage, you may recharge to recharge them instead
* [...]
Hmmm, discard cards from my deck, where else have I see- AH!
At the start of your turn, you may discard any number of cards from the top of your deck. Each other character may shuffle random cards from his discard pile into his deck; the total number of cards shuffled must not exceed ([] 1 plus) twice the number of cards you discarded.
And that's without his role card. So I imagine the scenario going like this:
* Assume at some point Grazzle draws and displays his Voidglass armor.
* Grazzle starts his turn with Voidglass armor displayed. He has a hand size of 6, and let's assume AP3 so a deck size of 18 and no discarded cards. At this point: full hand of 6, 1 displayed armor, 11 cards in his deck.
* Grazzle discards all 11 cards from his deck to activate his healing power. This heals 22 cards collectively across the party, plus however many power feats he's invested into this power.
* Grazzle then activates his armor, which immediately is recharged (putting it on top of his deck) followed by recharging the 11 cards he just discarded from his deck.
* Grazzle then finishes his turn, doing whatever he wants, ideally recharging cards without shuffling his deck.
* Grazzle resets his hand, draws Voidglass armor, displays it, and waits patiently for his next turn when he can do it all over again.
This is extremely overpowered, and seems pretty cut and dry legal from a rules perspective. Not sure how to fix it, maybe change the Voidglass power to say "When you would be forced to discard cards from your deck..."? Or maybe add a limit to the number of recharged cards.
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Except that "INSTEAD" means "INSTEAD" (If I got right what Vic explained many times).
If you activate the armor, the cards you "picked" from the top of your deck are "recharged", they never were "discarded".
So "twice the number of cards you discarded" is 0.
You could maybe get Vic to admit that if you check the "[] 1 plus", then you get to heal 1 card altogether on another character. But even that could be debated.
Anyway certainly no more than 1+2*0=1.
IMHO.
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Frencois is correct. If the cards wind up anywhere that is not your discard pile, they were not discarded and therefore don’t count towards healing. You can search up existing threads on his Bog Medic role (which also allows recharging some of those cards) for a more thorough discussion. Perhaps someone who isn’t on mobile could find a link.
(Grazzle is still extremely powerful despite this limitation, so don’t worry that this nerfs him into the ground—it really doesn’t in practice)
So that would also apply to any other character powers that allow them to discard the top card of their deck to do a thing? For example:
You may discard the top card of your deck to add 1d6 (☐+1) to your check
If Seelah recharges Voidglass to recharge that top card instead, it wasn't discarded, therefore no 1d6.
You may discard the top card of your deck to add 1d6 (☐+1) to your checkIf Seelah recharges Voidglass to recharge that top card instead, it wasn't discarded, therefore no 1d6.
No, that is just one sentence. So when she discards the top card to power her ability the armor would allow a recharge.
Grazzle's power works in two steps. Discard X cards. (new sentence) For the number of cards discarded: Heal X+N Cards.
His bog medic role gets more into this. You can discard X cards. Any divine cards you choose can get recharge. Then, for the number of discarded cards: heal X+n cards. The recharged divine cards done count in.
This if the forum thread that has been referenced, discussing Grazzle's healing power (and the meaning of recharging a card instead of discarding a card in reference to his power) in depth.
And, as has been mentioned, if "recharging instead of discarding" cards from your deck meant you still got the heal, the Bog Medic role would be incredibly powerful even by default, since he'd be able to heal the party at next to no cost just by stacking his deck with Divine cards (which should be all of Grazzle's spells, blessings... plus potentially plenty of his Items and even some of his Armors, based on what's available in Class/Add-On decks). To say nothing of the added benefit of being able to order his deck as he chooses (which he can do with Bog Medic either way).
He's still the best healer in PACG, don't worry. The very act of having a Grazzle on a team can completely redefine how an entire team chooses to approach and play the game, as "discard" costs are rendered negligible, and even 'recharge' costs are adjusted greatly since shuffles can be handed out so often and easily.