Thre "may" be a real issue with the wording used in the new Core Set cards


Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion


OK I'm sure it's me missing something obvious because my English is weak but, if I compare...

Enhance , Elixir of Energy Resistance and Ruin, I see a problem.

Under "While displayed"

Enhance wrote:
At the end of the turn, banish.

and

Elixir of Energy Resistance wrote:


When you suffer..., reduce it by 1.
When you suffer..., banish to reduce it to 0.

My problem is... aren't we missing a "you may" in the last line of the Elixir ?

Or if the "you may" is always implied by the new wording, does it mean I can keep Enhance displayed forever ?
Or does it mean that a "When" always implies a hidden "may" (hope they checked that for all cards) ?

But then I think I have an issue with

Ruin wrote:
When a monster is undefeated, shuffle a new monster...

where I'm pretty sure there is no hidden "may".

And if there is no hidden "may", what's the point of the first power in the Elixir since the second will always trigger ?

Tell me where I'm wrong please...


"Powers on cards in your hand are active only when you choose
to play them."

"Powers on cards on the table—including story cards, character cards,
and displayed cards—are active whenever they are appropriate.
Playing cards from your hand is always optional. Active powers on
all other cards are only optional if they say “you may” do something.


I look at it this way with the Elixir:
While it is in your hand, it is essentially in your pack/satchel/belt ready to be drank at any moment. Once it is displayed (drank) the power is in effect. It will have a finite duration, but you move down the card applying powers in order. Example, over the course of the turn from separate sources, you take 1 acid, 1 fire, and then 2 cold. The acid and the fire damage are each reduced with the card remaining in play. When the cold damage is taken, the elixir is banished.

For Enhance, all spells are now banish at the end of turn they are used I do believe, with the options to recharge if you are proficient. This again stems from spells duration. Items/elixirs often have a longer duration than corresponding spells.


OK. Interestning...


However if it was the intend, I would have rather write it in one "bullet" since it was one action :

When you suffer..., reduce it by 1, if it isn't reduced to 0, banish to reduce it to 0.


Frencois wrote:

However if it was the intend, I would have rather write it in one "bullet" since it was one action :

When you suffer..., reduce it by 1, if it isn't reduced to 0, banish to reduce it to 0.

Agreed, if that is the intent, though I have a different interpretation than what was listed above in this thread.

I believe that playing a card - that is, using a power on a card in your hand or a displayed card - is always optional, and always has been.

Relevant Note: "At the end of your turn, banish this" is not playing a card because it's not requiring the player to do an action to resolve an effect (just like spell recharge checks isn't "playing" a spell, and recharging an armor during hand reset isn't "playing" an armor).

I am of the interpretation that the second bullet point of the displayed Elixir of Energy Resistance is actually optional, because it is a power. It is explicitly "[...] banish to reduce it to 0". It fits the "X cost to do Y action" template, and it's already qualified in the rulebook that you can indeed 'play' displayed cards.


It is to me (obvious) that this is the way it is supposed to work.
I was merely stating that removing the "may" "may" (pun intended) create a bit of difficulty for understanding a card like the elixir where the two bullets really look like they are working the same way (i. e; automatic effect) when they aren't.

Was just a little warning on the look of it, not saying anything is broken.

Anyway, I always follow Mike into the "never discuss if it works before having actually played a few games" mojo.


I'm guessing "may" is one of the words that has become a global rule such that they don't have to waste space on almost every card.


Malk_Content wrote:
I'm guessing "may" is one of the words that has become a global rule such that they don't have to waste space on almost every card.

As quoted by Longshot above, the rule is actually the opposite - if it doesn't explictly say 'may', then it is really 'must'. The exception is playing cards from your hand. I think this thread has identified that that exception needs an amendment to include playing cards you have already displayed.

MM rulebook p.16, amendment mine wrote:
Active and Optional Powers...Playing cards from your hand [or your displayed cards] is always optional. Active powers on all other cards are only optional if they say “you may” do something.


Maybe we should all wait to see what the [new] rules say before we start identifying alleged problems and suggesting amendments.


Brother Tyler wrote:
Maybe we should all wait to see what the [new] rules say before we start identifying alleged problems and suggesting amendments.

Point taken.

In my haste this morning, I overlooked that this thread discusses Core Set cards, as opposed to previously-released cards. I acknowledge we can't know how the new cards interact with the new rulebook until we actually see the new rulebook. :)

Paizo Employee Chief Technical Officer

The following cards should have had "you may" in there, and have been added to the FAQ. Any other card mentioned in this thread is correct as printed.

Core:
Elixir of Energy Resistance
Banner of the Ancient Kings

Curse:
False Life
Full Pouch

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder Adventure Card Game / Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion / Thre "may" be a real issue with the wording used in the new Core Set cards All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.
Recent threads in Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion