Elves / Half-elves and Elf Step

[Ataro]

I've been looking at possible taking this ancestral feat down the line (it will help with the protector build I'm going), but it seems very difficult to access.

From what I'm seeing, it's the only feat from the races, that actually requires you to use a general feat, along with another racial feat, just to have access to it, which seems odd to me.

Now with the change to half-elves with the recent update (as that was a race I was considered), it's impossible for them to get access to this feat at all.

I realize this is only a single feat, but it still feels as though it may have just been an oversight, since they were doing so much work on other racial aspects, which is completely understandable.

My personally suggestion, would be to reduce the requirement for the feat to 35 ft, that way an elf could get it through normal racial progression, while a half-elf may have to go out of their way a bit to get access to it (or perhaps increasing nimble for half elves to 10 ft, but that would probably hurt balancing).

I should say that, no, I haven't playtested this idea, but I feel as though I don't really need to, as this is just a number aspect, not just something I haven't tried enough. Also, as its been mentioned during conversation already, I don't feel as though the barbarian or monk increases to speed count toward this, with them being situational, but I could be wrong, that sounds like another Paizo question.

I'm interested in hearing other peoples thoughts, both on whether they feel the feat was made unusually, or if you agree with my suggestion, or have another suggestion on a potential fix, and I hope it does get fixed, as it will help me with an idea for my character for an upcoming game.

[Tangent101]

On a semi-related note, I think that Half-Elves should not be allowed to take certain Ancestry Feats - for instance when a player was creating a half-elf last night I stated outright "no taking Ancestral Longevity" (and for that matter probably not "Ageless Patience") seeing half-elves are often only 16-20 years old while elves can easily start at 100 years of age.

[David knott 242]

Tangent101 wrote:

On a semi-related note, I think that Half-Elves should not be allowed to take certain Ancestry Feats - for instance when a player was creating a half-elf last night I stated outright "no taking Ancestral Longevity" (and for that matter probably not "Ageless Patience") seeing half-elves are often only 16-20 years old while elves can easily start at 100 years of age.

One way to take care of that would be to give those Ancestry feats additional prerequisites that a half-elf is less likely to be able to meet. For example, Ancestral Longevity might reasonably require the character taking it to be at least 100 years old.

[nick1wasd]

David knott 242 wrote:

Tangent101 wrote:

On a semi-related note, I think that Half-Elves should not be allowed to take certain Ancestry Feats - for instance when a player was creating a half-elf last night I stated outright "no taking Ancestral Longevity" (and for that matter probably not "Ageless Patience") seeing half-elves are often only 16-20 years old while elves can easily start at 100 years of age.

One way to take care of that would be to give those Ancestry feats additional prerequisites that a half-elf is less likely to be able to meet. For example, Ancestral Longevity might reasonably require the character taking it to be at least 100 years old.

There way a PF1 feat that essentially did that, called "Breadth of Experience" that required you to live 100 years before you could take it, and it let you use a bunch of different skills as if you were trained in them, as well as give a +2 to all knowledge checks. I think adding the same minimum to Ageless Patience sounds very reasonable, as Half-Elves CAN life that long, they'd just be really old for that sub-race at that point (they age at ~2/3rds the rate of humans, their 100 is a normal human's 60-70), so the COULD take it, it'd just be hard.

[Ataro]

nick1wasd wrote:

David knott 242 wrote:

Tangent101 wrote:

On a semi-related note, I think that Half-Elves should not be allowed to take certain Ancestry Feats - for instance when a player was creating a half-elf last night I stated outright "no taking Ancestral Longevity" (and for that matter probably not "Ageless Patience") seeing half-elves are often only 16-20 years old while elves can easily start at 100 years of age.

One way to take care of that would be to give those Ancestry feats additional prerequisites that a half-elf is less likely to be able to meet. For example, Ancestral Longevity might reasonably require the character taking it to be at least 100 years old.

There way a PF1 feat that essentially did that, called "Breadth of Experience" that required you to live 100 years before you could take it, and it let you use a bunch of different skills as if you were trained in them, as well as give a +2 to all knowledge checks. I think adding the same minimum to Ageless Patience sounds very reasonable, as Half-Elves CAN life that long, they'd just be really old for that sub-race at that point (they age at ~2/3rds the rate of humans, their 100 is a normal human's 60-70), so the COULD take it, it'd just be hard.

The issue with that is, then you're taking away part of the appeal/point of being a half-elf. Especially considering the only other benefit the half-races get, is low-light vision. Also this would mean that you'd have to do the same thing with half-orc, as they got a large number of feats (since orc isn't a race that has listed feats), as it turn people off of the issue.

The other potential argument for 'longevity' if it was really needed, could be something along the lines of 'whispers of your past family members' as spiritual ideas, since I know elves not only are somewhat innately magical, but also like to have ancestral connection and lots of knowledge. So I think it would't be to farfetched to allow it in general.

The other thing is, nothing specifically states that half-elves start their adult careers at 16-20, it just states that they live to about 150. If their elven parent is with them, they could potentially take more time to teach them, perhaps not considering them 'adults' until they're at least around 40-50? It's just another idea on how that could potentially work.

I am happy to see good feedback though, it's always nice to see actual interaction on the forums that's productive.