Smuggi |
Hey guys, I had this come up in a recent game I've been playing in and I'm not entirely sure on one aspect of Solarian's supernova revelation. In the description of supernova, it reads:
"When you’re fully photon-attuned, as a standard action, you can deal 1d6 fire damage plus 1d6 additional fire damage per Solarian level to all creatures within 10 feet of you."
Now, the issue comes up with the rules for Area effects. Within them it states:
"Sometimes an effects description indicates a specifically defined area..."
Which with supernova is all enemies within 10-20 feet around themselves depending on level. Is it considered an area effect, considering there's obviously a radius for it? There's also this bit for area effects.
"The point of origin of an effect is always a grid intersection, meaning the point where four squares touch..."
So does this mean that the Supernova and in turn Black Hole or other similar revelations aren't actually centered on the user, rather one of the four corners of the tile they're standing on?
"Regardless of the shape of the area, you select the point from which the effect originates."
Seems to imply that it is so, but it feels extremely awkward to not have the burst centered on my character rather than on a corner where they reside, making it so the AoE is not evenly spread around the character and would change how one would position for this ability entirely.
Castilliano |
The area is tied to the Solarian's shape & size.
If there were an odd-shaped Solarian(or say a swarm, since they can break into different shapes) then the area would extend 10' from all parts of them. Yes, a larger creature would also have a larger blast, covering more squares.
And if SF remains consistent with PF, the second diagonal of the blast does not get hit despite reach of 10' going out to there. 10' reach is an exception so people can't hook around AoOs. So for a medium creature, Supernova hits 21 squares.
Smuggi |
The area is tied to the Solarian's shape & size.
If there were an odd-shaped Solarian(or say a swarm, since they can break into different shapes) then the area would extend 10' from all parts of them. Yes, a larger creature would also have a larger blast, covering more squares.
The problem though, even if tied to the Solarian's shape and size could still mean the explosion radius would be just centered on one of the corners in any square in which your character resides, because of the basically uniform AoE rules.
I personally agree with both your takes as well, but I cannot find anything that seems to dissuade the basical AoE rulings. 10 feet being literal involvement of movement squares from your character seems to be the implied statement and I'll just have to try and sway the DM on it through what's been said.
Sebastian Hirsch |
Has this ever been clarified?
EDIT: I think this ability should follow the general AOE rules from the CRB.
Some effects cover a defined area. Sometimes an effect’s
description indicates a specially defined area, but usually an area
falls into one of the categories discussed below. Regardless of
the shape of the area, you select the point from which the effect
originates, but otherwise you don’t control which creatures or
objects are affected. The point of origin of an effect is always a
grid intersection, meaning the point where four squares touch
on a tactical battle map.
CptJames |
"When you’re fully photon-attuned, as a standard action, you can deal 1d6 fire damage plus 1d6 additional fire damage per Solarian level to all creatures within 10 feet of you."
Now, the issue comes up with the rules for Area effects. Within them it states:
"Sometimes an effects description indicates a specifically defined area..."
Which with supernova is all enemies within 10-20 feet around themselves depending on level. Is it considered an area effect, considering there's obviously a radius for it? There's also this bit for area effects.
"The point of origin of an effect is always a grid intersection, meaning the point where four squares touch..."
So does this mean that the Supernova and in turn Black Hole or other similar revelations aren't actually centered on the user, rather one of the four corners of the tile they're standing on?
"Regardless of the shape of the area, you select the point from which the effect originates."
Seems to imply that it is so, but it feels extremely awkward to not have the burst centered on my character rather than on a corner where they reside, making it so the AoE is not evenly spread around the character and would change how one would position for this ability entirely.
From what I can see there are 3 options:
1) Have the blast centred on your character, but there isn't a blast template and you'd essentially be creating a new rule for Solarians that deals with this.2) (and this seems stupid) that you pick a corner for your 10ft blast which means it's weighted to one side...say you pick front left, your front left blast is more powerful and far reaching then your back right...doesn't seem right at all.
3) (even worse) you apply the 10ft blast radius and apply it to all 4 intersections of your own square...but then the radius is going to be more than 10ft but it'll be 10ft from you...
These are only problems if you're Medium IMO. If you're Large, the middle intersection of your 4 squares is where it starts I think...otherwise your blast is just far too big...
Some clarification would be lovely!
Ascalaphus |
Actually, if the center of a 10ft blast is the center of a 4-square large creature, then it wouldn't even cover the diagonally adjacent squares of your space. It would only cover the two squares on your north/east/south/west. The NE/SE/SW/NW squares are 15ft away from the center of a large creature.
(Remember that 10ft distance from a creature is computed specially for creatures with exactly 10ft reach; that's not the general rule.
I think for solarians it makes sense to compute distance from the outside of the space you occupy. So a medium solarian would supernova in a zone 20 squares big (8 on the interior 5ft, and 4x3 on the exterior 10ft). A large solarian would burst on 20 squares as well (12 interior 5ft, and 4x2 on the exterior 10ft). So actually the blast of a large solarion isn't really that big. It seems to occupy more of the map but it's actually the same size; there's just a chunkier solarian in the middle.
For the 20ft burst, it's 60 squares affected for a medium solarian, and 76 squares for a large solarian. (Draw a map 45ft by 45ft and position a solarian in the middle. Count out 20ft from the edge of his space; you can't reach the 5 spaces on the edge in each corner. So that's 9x9 - 4x5 -1 = 60 squares affected. For the large creature, repeat the exercise on a 50ft by 50ft map. Notice that the unreached area stays 4x5 squares in the corners, and a bigger spot in the middle for the solarian, so 10x10 - 4x5 - 4 = 76.)