Does a Strangler Brawler get to add the +2 bonus for flanking to his CMB roll, which is per definition also an attack roll?
No, the ability is referring to the brawler's ability to apply sneak attack damage in a grapple. He is treated as flanking so that he can apply sneak attack damage. If it meant you to get a +2, it would have used different language or specifically called it out.
Does the character get to add other abilities that rely on flanking to the attack? This includes, but is of course not limited to sneak attack from other sources, such as the snakebite brawler archetype.
Yes, if it specifically requires the target to be flanked and is part of a 'sneak attack' ability (like some rogue talents have an add-on to sneak attack damage).
Strangle is not sneak attack, though.
Yes, it is. "strangler deals +1d6 sneak attack damage". Sneak attack is an ability available to a number of classes and it works the same way in each. It may have been used as short hand in the Strangler's ability description, but there it is none-the-less.
That's interesting. So what about this ability, which relies on flanking?
That seems to contradict your assessment.
Except it doesn't contradict anything. You aren't reading the feat properly and applying it step by step in how it would actually function in combat.
You don't provoke an attack of opportunity for trying to maintain a grapple, to damage an opponent in a grapple, or pin an opponent in a grapple. When you attempt to grapple someone, you may use this feat if you are ACTUALLY flanking with someone and get the described bonuses (either not provoking like you should, or get the +4 if you have the feats required).
The Strangle ability lets you count as flanking in very specific circumstances, even if you all by yourself, because normally you don't threaten an area when grappled and can't 'flank' with anyone.
So your contention is that it is considered flanking only for the limited purpose of dealing strangle damage, and since strangle damage is sneak attack damage, all sneak attack specifically (but nothing else that works on a flanking attack generally) would also apply.
Yes?
Yes, because the Strangler is considered flanking only for the purposes of the Strangle (Ex) ability (which is dealing sneak attack damage), and only when damaging or pinning an opponent in a grapple. Other sources of sneak attack apply because the Strangler is getting sneak attack during a 'flank' at that instance.
Thank you.
You are very welcome.
So what about Hidden Strike from Vigilante?
Yes, but it is reduced to d4s.
"against foes who are unaware of his presence, who consider him an ally, or who are made flat-footed by startling appearance... A stalker vigilante can also deal hidden strike damage to a target that he is flanking or that is denied its Dexterity bonus to AC, but in these cases, the damage dice are reduced to d4s"
Strangle lets you deal damage. You are flanking for this damage. Hidden strike should trigger because you are both dealing damage and are flanking while you do it.
You were just saying that sneak attack would only apply because it is specifically mentioned. Now you're saying that all abilities that rely on flanking apply to the damage roll? But somehow not to the attack?
You're not flanking "for this damage" - there's no rules text that says that. You're only flanking "for the purpose of using Strangle."
You are generalizing what I said in such a way as to cause confusion. Look at what Hidden Strike does. It adds more damage whenever you damage someone when meeting a certain criteria.
Is Strangle dealing damage? Yes.
Is that damage being done while the creature is treated as flanked? Yes. Strangle treats the opponent as flanked.
For the purpose of using Stangle? What does Strangle do? It delivers sneak attack damage when you normally would not be able to. Anything that can ride over on that effect, whether additional sneak attack damage or status inflictions from rogue talents, can carry over during a Strangle.
You are likely to find several abilities and feats that will carry over on the Strangle ability. Dirty Fighting is just not one of them.
