Point Buy


Rules Questions


I'll be reworking an existing PF campaign to include some of SF's stuff, including its point buy system, eventually. Just to make sure, would bringing a dwarf's charisma back to 10 cost 2 points? I believe so because the game would be broken if it wasn't like that.

Scarab Sages

Yes. You have a base 10 in everything, apply racial modifiers, apply theme, and then have 10 points to spend on a one for one basis.

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Imbicatus wrote:
Yes. You have a base 10 in everything, apply racial modifiers, apply theme, and then have 10 points to spend on a one for one basis.

I take it that there are no options for an "epic" or "gritty" campaign?


Lord Fyre wrote:
Imbicatus wrote:
Yes. You have a base 10 in everything, apply racial modifiers, apply theme, and then have 10 points to spend on a one for one basis.
I take it that there are no options for an "epic" or "gritty" campaign?

Not at this point in time. Obviously, you can add or subtract to the 10-point budget as you see fit, but we don't really have a guideline on how much is enough to change the tone of a campaign, so your mileage may vary.


The 10-point buy here seems like the 15 point buy from Pathfinder to me. It looks like an 11-13 point buy will roughly equate to a 20 point buy, but it's hard to say. The system seems to value building MAD characters


Jimbles the Mediocre wrote:
Lord Fyre wrote:
Imbicatus wrote:
Yes. You have a base 10 in everything, apply racial modifiers, apply theme, and then have 10 points to spend on a one for one basis.
I take it that there are no options for an "epic" or "gritty" campaign?
Not at this point in time. Obviously, you can add or subtract to the 10-point budget as you see fit, but we don't really have a guideline on how much is enough to change the tone of a campaign, so your mileage may vary.

Well, starting values are pretty gritty imo, so for gritty games I'd reduce the ASIs from +2 to +1, maybe change the starting max in a stat from 18 to 16.

For epic games I'd change starting points to 15 instead of 10, and leave the ASIs at +2.


On the other hand, characters get mad increases in ability points on the levels. Minimum increase of 3 points. Likely an increase of about 5 (maybe 6) points at 4th level. (2 point boosts for your non-main stat, 1 point boos on your main stat, or 2 points if your main stat was 16 or less.)


Imbicatus wrote:
Yes. You have a base 10 in everything, apply racial modifiers, apply theme, and then have 10 points to spend on a one for one basis.

Or you can ignore all of the bonuses and penalties, and just do a 13 point buy, which is what you get basically with the 'array' selection.


Shain Edge wrote:
Likely an increase of about 5 (maybe 6) points at 4th level.

I think you mean 5th level.


kadance wrote:
Shain Edge wrote:
Likely an increase of about 5 (maybe 6) points at 4th level.
I think you mean 5th level.

Yep.. I actually caught that.. But it was after the edit turned off on the message. SO I decided to see who was paying attention. :)


Shain Edge wrote:
Imbicatus wrote:
Yes. You have a base 10 in everything, apply racial modifiers, apply theme, and then have 10 points to spend on a one for one basis.
Or you can ignore all of the bonuses and penalties, and just do a 13 point buy, which is what you get basically with the 'array' selection.

Which is the same. Base 10s, plus 10, +2 for race (or +2+2-2, which is 2), 1 for theme.

The big advantage of the quick pick method (aside from being easier for new players, or ones that don't want to bother) is it doesn't have the race/class conflicts, where vesk and kasatha are just inherently bad mechanics or technomancers, androids and shirren can actually make solarions and envoys with a single resolve point until level 3, lashunta are terrible mystics and so on.


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Voss wrote:
The big advantage of the quick pick method (aside from being easier for new players, or ones that don't want to bother) is it doesn't have the race/class conflicts, where vesk and kasatha are just inherently bad mechanics or technomancers, androids and shirren can actually make solarions and envoys with a single resolve point until level 3, lashunta are terrible mystics and so on.

I actually like that as a game mechanic. The racial attribute modifiers have been pushed into the back as flavor. Your average such and such race isn't all that great as a technomancer, but the player characters are not average, and may ignore that aspect of their chosen race.


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Shain Edge wrote:
Voss wrote:
The big advantage of the quick pick method (aside from being easier for new players, or ones that don't want to bother) is it doesn't have the race/class conflicts, where vesk and kasatha are just inherently bad mechanics or technomancers, androids and shirren can actually make solarions and envoys with a single resolve point until level 3, lashunta are terrible mystics and so on.
I actually like that as a game mechanic. The racial attribute modifiers have been pushed into the back as flavor. Your average such and such race isn't all that great as a technomancer, but the player characters are not average, and may ignore that aspect of their chosen race.

Yeah, I think it's a shame that SFS immediately rejected it, as it will probably cause a carry-on effect into general games. It's one of the best chargen methods I've seen in a long time.

And neatly avoids some of the traps and social issues raised by the genre's incessant push for stereotypes over fleshed out characters.

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