Versatile Specialization

[Raisse]

Is there any purpose to choosing Weapon Specialization as a normal feat when Versatile Specialization exists?

I noticed that some of the example builds include Weapon Specialization, but I figured that was just left over and never got updated as changes were made to feats, like how one of the technomancers chooses Spell Focus, despite getting it for free at level 3.

[Klobbermeister]

Versatile seems a better choice by far. Is there a class that doesn't automatically get Weapon Specialization as progression? That'd be the only reason I can see...

[Invoker]

What does versatile specialization do? Is weapon specialization the same as it is in Pathfinder?

[Peat]

I wonder if the intent is that the Bonus Feat Weapon Specialization that all classes get doesn't qualify you for Versatile Specialization. Granted RAW I can't see any support for that (the Prereqs section of Feats doesn't say anything about using a Bonus Feat as a Prereq) but that would seem to make the most sense (otherwise you are Specialized in a weapon you aren't even Proficient in)

[rooneg]

I presume it's future proofing, someday there may be classes that don't give the Weapon Specialization feat, and thus you won't automatically be eligible for Versatile Specialization. It's the same reason there's a Small Arms Proficiency feat even though all the classes already have proficiency in Small Arms.

[citricking]

The annoying thing is if you have a multiclass character like soldier 1/mystic X, you can take specialization in something at level 3 but would have to wait for 5 for versatile specialization in all your weapon types.

[Gary Bush]

Klobbermeister wrote:

Versatile seems a better choice by far. Is there a class that doesn't automatically get Weapon Specialization as progression? That'd be the only reason I can see...

Starfinder CRB, page 59 wrote:

"...When you reach 3rd level in that class, you also gain Weapon Specialization (as per the feat) in those weapons, which allows you to add your class level to your damage rolls with those weapons..."

All classes receive Weapon Specialization at 3rd level.

The impact of Versatile Specialization appears to be same as Weapon Specialization.

The only benefit I can see for this is if a character took Proficiency in weapon that was not given as part of a class. Or for for weapons granted by multi-classing. Maybe?

[Gary Bush]

citricking wrote:

The annoying thing is if you have a multiclass character like soldier 1/mystic X, you can take specialization in something at level 3 but would have to wait for 5 for versatile specialization in all your weapon types.

I think you would get weapon specialization in all your weapon groups when you became soldier 1/Mystic 2 (character level 3)

[Imbicatus]

A one level dip in solder plus Versatile Specialization would be a great way to add a big chunk of firepower to an envoy without a major feat investment.

[Peat]

Gary Bush wrote:

citricking wrote:

The annoying thing is if you have a multiclass character like soldier 1/mystic X, you can take specialization in something at level 3 but would have to wait for 5 for versatile specialization in all your weapon types.

I think you would get weapon specialization in all your weapon groups when you became soldier 1/Mystic 2 (character level 3)

Class Level != Character Level. It says 'when you reach third level in that class', not third level overall.

Also, gaining Weapon Specialization "as per the feat" (pg 59) seems different than gaining it "as a bonus feat" (all of the individual class entries).

For the former, you gain the benefits but seemingly not the feat itself, which would mean you couldn't use that as a Prerequisite.

Definitely seems like something that could use clarification. EDIT: which Mark did just above :)

[Gary Bush]

Yep, there is the hook. I knew there had to be one.

Versatile weapon says "All Weapons with which you are proficient that can be selected with Weapon Specification.

So if a character was Soldier 1/Mystic 3, then they would get the benefit for all weapons, include those granted by Soldier.

[Varun Creed]

Gary Bush wrote:

Yep, there is the hook. I knew there had to be one.

Versatile weapon says "All Weapons with which you are proficient that can be selected with Weapon Specification.

So if a character was Soldier 1/Mystic 3, then they would get the benefit for all weapons, include those granted by Soldier.

Make sure you take the classlevels as Mystic 3>Soldier1>Mystic X. That way you can get Versatile Proviciency at level 3 instead of 5.

[The Penecontemporaneous One]

My impression is that the "Weapon Specialization" class feature only gives specialization with weapons that class grants the PC, so if you pick up weapon proficiency in something else, you'd need weapon spec. in it to benefit.

Which does, however, beg the question of whether or not the prerequisite for Versatile is the weapon spec. feat or the class feature.

(and a related musing/wondering is why there are even feats for light armor proficiency or basic melee weapon / small arms proficiency since every single class gets them and nothing in the core lets those be "traded out" for anything else)

[Voss]

The Penecontemporaneous One wrote:

(and a related musing/wondering is why there are even feats for light armor proficiency or basic melee weapon / small arms proficiency since every single class gets them and nothing in the core lets those be "traded out" for anything else)

That is definitely future proofing. Also explaining what those do, since you still need the rules even if everyone has them.

[The Penecontemporaneous One]

I forget, sometimes, to try and look at a new/core rulebook through the eyes of someone who is new to RPGs on the whole. My above-musing shows a distinct lack in that department.

Thanks for the reminder.

[Varun Creed]

The Penecontemporaneous One wrote:

My impression is that the "Weapon Specialization" class feature only gives specialization with weapons that class grants the PC, so if you pick up weapon proficiency in something else, you'd need weapon spec. in it to benefit.

Which does, however, beg the question of whether or not the prerequisite for Versatile is the weapon spec. feat or the class feature.

On 1 you're right.

On 2, the class feature gives you multiple feats. "You gain Weapon Specialization as a bonus feat for each weapon type this class grants you proficiency with."

So a Mystic at level 3, would get the following feats:

• Weapon Specialization (Basic melee weapons)
• Weapon Specialization (Small arms)
• Level 3 feat at own choice