Polymorph Any Object and Type / Subtype

[The Imperator]

Does Polymorph any Object alter type/subtypes? Like, the example of turning a rock into human, would the rock gain the Humanoid type?

And if that is the case, does that happen when you turn say a human into a giant, do they get a different subtype as a result of the change?

[dragonhunterq]

Polymorph spells do not change either types or subtypes (barring an obscure spell or feat changing that). Nowhere in the polymorph rules is there any indication that they are affected in any way.

[The Imperator]

So then a rock wouldn't have any creature types?

It just seemed odd to me that new things wouldn't have any types.

[Kileanna]

It has been talked before and there is some controversy about that.
The only official thing is that Polymorph spells don't change a creature's type. But then... can an untyped creature exist? Rules wise, a polymorphed rock should be an untyped creature.

[Calth]

They would probably fall under the animated object rules at that point and be considered constructs. Basically, PAO is a way to animate an object. And all objects that are animated are covered by the specific Animated Objects bestiary entry (the entry states that all objects, however they are animated, fall under it). And Animated Objects are constructs.

[The Imperator]

Except that it specifically says you can turn a rock into a human. Not into a construct, which could be permanent (large rock -> large construct/no Int/same kingdom(mineral)) going by the listed rules. Thus making PAO strictly better than animate object. All you need is the spell to control a construct, and you are set for animated objects for virtually no cost.

[Calth]

The Imperator wrote:

Except that it specifically says you can turn a rock into a human. Not into a construct, which could be permanent (large rock -> large construct/no Int/same kingdom(mineral)) going by the listed rules. Thus making PAO strictly better than animate object. All you need is the spell to control a construct, and you are set for animated objects for virtually no cost.

But you don't turn fully rock into a human, because that's not what the spell does, because polymorphs don't change types. PAO changes forms only. And the Animated Object bestiary entry says it covers all objects that become animated, with the animate object spell being one way. PAO should be another if you are turning an object's shape into an animate form.

[James Risner]

You'd have a rock wearing a realistic human costume.

[Alderic]

Same thing I said last time this came up.
The spell won't change the type of the target, but if you give life to an object and need stats for it, construct is your best bet.

[Kileanna]

Not having an official answer, the animated object option seems like the best one, indeed.

[dragonhunterq]

I would have thought it better to keep it as typeless. Construct type comes with all sorts of baggage that might cause more confusion than it clears.

[Calth]

dragonhunterq wrote:

I would have thought it better to keep it as typeless. Construct type comes with all sorts of baggage that might cause more confusion than it clears.

Except you can't really do that. The Animated Object Bestiary entry is pretty broad as it basically states that it covers all objects animated by any means besides craft construct. In effect it means that objects have a hidden type of construct. That is they normally aren't creatures but if they somehow become one they are constructs, which is reasonable and consistent.

It's not necessarily the simplest method but it seems to be what the rules are.

[dragonhunterq]

There is a distinction between animating an object and changing it to something else. I'm not convinced the animated object rules apply.