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So the theme is "Shadow-Knight of Count Ranalc's Court". The general mechanics are to wield a normal, physical weapon - probably a scythe, for style points - while also creating a Dazing Shadow Weapon cestus on the right-hand to make dazing attacks when desired. The general idea being to daze with the shadow-cestus and then kill-off with the scythe.
Edit: I think I want some Trip-Hop to set the theme for Count Ranalc...
So far, I'm looking at Exploiter Wizard (+2DC Overwhelming Magic, bonus metamagic feats through Wizard/Exploits) for the spellcasting power, crossed with Savage Technologist for the huge combat buff, and moving into Eldritch Knight with Prestigious Spellcaster. Arcane Armor Training for mithral Kikko.
15/17STR+, 14DEX, 14CON, 15/17INT+, 8WIS, 8CHA
Traits: Magical Knack, Wayang Spellhunter: Shadow Weapon; Drawback: Sentimental; Bonus Trait: ???
1ST. Extra Rage
2EW. *Exploit: Overwhelming Magic*
3EW. Arcane Armor Training
4EW.
5EW. *Exploit: Metamagic Knowledge: Dazing Spell* / Favored Prestige Class: Eldritch Knight: Spellcraft
6EW. +W: Piercing Spell
7EK. Prestigious Spellcaster / +EK: Power Attack
8EW.
9EK. ???
etc...
Rage, Furious Weapon, Heroism for combat power; Rage and mithral Kikko for AC.
Eventually, two more levels of Wizard to qualify for Resilient Illusions... waiting at least until 6BAB though.
Anyone have any ideas for pushing this business further? I'm feeling pretty optimistic about it so far...
did you see the Shadow Mystery for the oracle? You might geht the same theme you want with a single class. But Resilient Illusions is definitely strong.
You might actually get some use out of the mirror strike spell with this setup. I thought that spell was useless.
Whip of spiders might be better than shadow weapon once you're high enough level. It might be worth retraining Wayang spellhunter (shadow weapon) to (whip of spiders) at level 8 or so. Which in turn might make power attack not the best since it wouldn't trigger on a touch attack, and if the spell needs whip proficiency you'd need EWP (whip).
Edit: no, you're wanting to use resilient illusions to make the save DC for dazing shadow weapon really high, so whip of spiders won't help. Never mind that part.
Resilient Illusions does feel too good to pass up, even if it's only taken at higher levels; but there's always other ways to get strong DCs if another idea is good enough.
Whip of Spiders is an interesting idea, but I like Shadow Weapon for the fact that a shadow cestus works seamlessly with two-handing a real Furious weapon. Duration is also nice.
Shadow Oracle... I really like that mystery, but didn't make that shadow spells connection. Hmm. Besides eventual Resilient Illusions, I really like the Exploiter Wizard's free +2DC with the Potent Magic Exploit.
What about Dual-Cursed Shadow Oracle, Misfortune Revelation and then maybe later Quickened Ill Omen to break saves? Worth thinking about anyhow.
I'm surprised you didn't opt for dimensional slide as one of your exploits. The ability to short-range Dimension Door as a move action without incurring AoO is a godsend for any character, especially an EK. Fluff it as something similar to a shadowdancer's shadow jump; give him several ranks in stealth and he can jump from shadow to shadow, striking from the shadows. I would consider getting Dazing spell at a different level and using the exploit to get this instead.
I'm surprised you didn't opt for dimensional slide as one of your exploits. The ability to short-range Dimension Door as a move action without incurring AoO is a godsend for any character, especially an EK. Fluff it as something similar to a shadowdancer's shadow jump; give him several ranks in stealth and he can jump from shadow to shadow, striking from the shadows. I would consider getting Dazing spell at a different level and using the exploit to get this instead.
It's tempting. The flip-side though is that feats and Arcane Reservoir points are really valuable - at first, at least. Exploiter Wizard is on a fixed budget of Exploit fuel, and every Shadow Weapon or other control casting really wants that +2DC. It's always possible to grab Extra Exploit down the road, especially when Resilient Illusions makes Shadow Weapon DC less important. Dimensional Dervish is also a possibility at higher levels, which makes it a moot issue...
We could think about a Shadow Oracle VMC Wizard. Latter gives you said short range teleport at 7 and Resilient Illusion at 15.
We usually stick with PFS-legal content (mostly), and don't use the VMC or other 'optional' stuff.... Anyhow, I think if I was going to go Shadow Oracle I wouldn't bother for a payoff at level 15; I'd just double-down on other ways to break saves. With the three feats lost by level 15, it would be easy to grab things like Spell Focus, Persistent Spell, Heighten Spell, Spell Perfection and so on to bump the overall DC anyhow.
Though I'm tempted to save Spell Perfection for Quickened Storm Step, because that's pouncing in style.
I don't remember anymore if stacking Wayang Spellhunter and Magical Lineage was legit, but with a -2 metamagic adjustment things could get real pretty fast - Dazing, Piercing and Persistent by level 5... so that's one major pro to going straight Oracle, if I can get over feeling so cheesy...
Though maybe Magical Knack on the EK could be sacrificed if it's only -1CL lost, and it's that good a trade.
Yeah, those traits stack. Remember it's -2 total not per metamagic though, so that's a 5th level spell not a 5th level character.
Taking the dual-cursed archetype as an oracle and the misfortune revelation lets you make an enemy reroll their save against your shadow weapon as an immediate action, which would certainly be nice. OTOH you lose the savage technologists rage.
Something about this build feels 'arcane', though I'm not sure why. Raging Shadows feels right too. If I didn't like Shadow Mystery so much it wouldn't even be a question...
Yeah, level 5 spells. With Prestigious Spellcaster or Oracle that's still only level 10 though.
But I think probably Heighten Spell to make Dazing Shadow Weapon last 2 rounds and Resilient Illusions on the EK are where I'm leaning. I need to try out some different Shadow Oracle builds to make sure though.
I will say, I'm really groovin' on the feel of this build... a hand roiling with dazing shadows, a furious scythe, and a servant of a missing Eldest god... yeah.
Have you considered just getting the Arcane Weapon exploit (or VMC magus), summoning a shadow weapon scythe, enchanting it and using it as your main weapon?
I did consider that, though I'm wary of relying on a Shadow Weapon casting as a primary weapon. If it's disbelieved, then it becomes useless as an actual weapon - it can still daze if it does damage, but it only does 1 damage, so any DR will kill that too. Even more ominous, Spell Resistance will simple destroy it completely.
So you end up with a situation where your main weapon requires a standard action to cast, and then a standard action to enhance with the cost of an Arcane point (meaning it costs 2 Arcane points in total with the DC boost) - and then it can be disabled or destroyed by some bad luck.
That's why I prefer the idea of a 'shadow hand' effect plus a powerful two-handed weapon; they work seamlessly together, and the weapon is real, always available, and enhanced with at least Furious. Plus, clawing at someone with a dazing shadowy hand before bringing down the two-hander is just awesome flavor.
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Dotting, if for no other reason than the trip-hop mix.
You may find an idea or 2 here.
http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2s5ns?Shadow-Weapon#1
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It doesn't, but VMC wizard does if you take the Teleportation subschool.We could think about a Shadow Oracle VMC Wizard. Latter gives you said short range teleport at 7 and Resilient Illusion at 15.How does shadow oracle give you a short range teleport? I'm not seeing it.
I see. I've been trying to find a good way to abuse the dimensional agility feats, and I thought I'd found a way to do it with an oracle.
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Has there been any clarification on whether the combo Dazing Spell + Shadow Weapon actually works? Because last time I checked, there was disagreement on this, on the argument that the spell doesn't do damage, the spell only creates a weapon.
I'm not saying I agree with that, I'd just like to know if there's been a FAQ or designer post about this.
Has there been any clarification on whether the combo Dazing Spell + Shadow Weapon actually works? Because last time I checked, there was disagreement on this, on the argument that the spell doesn't do damage, the spell only creates a weapon.
I'm not saying I agree with that, I'd just like to know if there's been a FAQ or designer post about this.
I don't think there has been an FAQ or comment by a designer on Shadow Blade. Most people seem to agree that since you need to save vs the damage that it can be enhanced with meta=magic like dazing. I also agree that it works that way.
Has there been any clarification on whether the combo Dazing Spell + Shadow Weapon actually works? Because last time I checked, there was disagreement on this, on the argument that the spell doesn't do damage, the spell only creates a weapon.
I'm not saying I agree with that, I'd just like to know if there's been a FAQ or designer post about this.
I normally avoid anything too controversial - I wouldn't assume Icicle Dagger as working - but I have no doubts about Dazing here. If the weapon created by the spell is subject to Spell Resistance, then the weapon is the spell. Especially considering that conjured projectiles like Acid Arrow are considered as the spell doing the damage, and they're real and not subject to SR.
1) Pardon my ignorance, but can you please explain how you are able to wield both a scythe (two-handed) and a shadow weapon (cestus) at the same time.
You may use this weapon to make attacks as if it were a real weapon
So don't you have to wield it with your hand?
2) Continuing my questions, I am assuming that the posters suggesting the Shadow Mystery suggests picking up the Shadow Armament Revelation. How would one go about making that similar to Shadow Weapon altered by the Dazing Spell feat?
1) Pardon my ignorance, but can you please explain how you are able to wield both a scythe (two-handed) and a shadow weapon (cestus) at the same time.
You may use this weapon to make attacks as if it were a real weaponSo don't you have to wield it with your hand?
2) Continuing my questions, I am assuming that the posters suggesting the Shadow Mystery suggests picking up the Shadow Armament Revelation. How would one go about making that similar to Shadow Weapon altered by the Dazing Spell feat?
You can change grip on a weapon as a free action, so you can switch between punching with the cestus and wielding the scythe in two hands pretty effortlessly. When you want to try for daze you punch; otherwise, Furious scythe in two hands goes chop chop.
I don't think there's any way to make Shadow Armament work with metamagic. The Dark Secrets Revelation will let you grab the spell Shadow Weapon anyhow though. I probably wouldn't take Shadow Armament; there are lots of other great options in the Shadow Mystery, or in Revelation-replacing Archetypes.