
LordBiBo |
So my group is really set on getting their hands on a roc egg, and I am up for letting them, but they need to get it out of the nest and back to somewhere where they can hatch it. My question is just how big and heavy would this thing be and what would it take to move it? It is born a medium size creature, so I am imagining an egg large enough to contain a human. Assuming they are curled up in that egg a bit, I am guessing it should be something like 3 or 4 feet tall and maybe 200-300 lbs? Does that sound about right?

LordBiBo |
Also on a side note, they are thinking of using Hide from Animals to hide themselves from the Roc momma and are planning on casting it on the egg to make it invisible as well, arguing that the baby roc is a creature. I am thinking that while the roc is a creature, it's egg is not so it doesn't work on the egg (though the baby inside might be invisible to momma).

Corvino |

It might be worth pointing out the difficulties in hatching and raising a Roc. Eggs need to be kept warm, as well as intact. Keep them at room temperature or below and all you've got is omlette ingredients.
Once they've stolen it, do they have:
1) a cart or similar to transport it safely
2) straw/blankets for insulation and padding
3) some warming pans/hot water bottles to maintain temperature
And that's just to get it to hatch. A Roc is going to take years to reach maturity. Have they arranged a barn or aviary to keep and raise it? Where are they getting enough meat for a medium/large/huge/gargantuan carnivore? Who is mad enough to care for this partly-tamed beast while they're off adventuring?
Personally I love the idea, and that they're trying to pull it off. But even Fantasy has harsh realities!

LordBiBo |
Oh, I am not worried about the realities of raising it as it will be an animal companion and according to the rules:
Rocs taken as animal companions by druids or rangers are typically newly hatched birds—a baby roc is the size of a person and ready for flight and hunting within minutes of hatching. Unfortunately for druids seeking animal companions of legendary size, an animal companion roc is limited to Large size—still large enough for a Medium druid or ranger to use the flying beast as a mount.
As for Enlarge, that only lasts 4 minutes at their current level (and I think they only have it available on a wand that casts it at 1st level anyway). 40 minutes for hide from animal should be sufficient, but I doubt 1 minute of enlarge will be.

Orfamay Quest |

Oh, I am not worried about the realities of raising it as it will be an animal companion and according to the rules:
Quote:Rocs taken as animal companions by druids or rangers are typically newly hatched birds—a baby roc is the size of a person and ready for flight and hunting within minutes of hatching. Unfortunately for druids seeking animal companions of legendary size, an animal companion roc is limited to Large size—still large enough for a Medium druid or ranger to use the flying beast as a mount.As for Enlarge, that only lasts 4 minutes at their current level (and I think they only have it available on a wand that casts it at 1st level anyway). 40 minutes for hide from animal should be sufficient, but I doubt 1 minute of enlarge will be.
Well, the fighter with a strength of 20 could [probably] carry a roc egg as a heavy load if she had a way to grip it, and it's fairly easy to rig up a web/net to carry objects that are roughly egg-shaped. So the hide from animals spell would still work.

DM_Blake |

In Whispering Nickel Idols, Garret (the private investigator) carries a roc egg in his pocket. One was even used as a sling stone.
While that's not exactly Pathfinder cannon (which says the eggs are man-sized), it made for a fun story.
I don't think an egg weighs any more than a creature of flesh and bone. After all, it's basically a bit of calcium (same as bone) surrounding some liquid and a little flesh and bone inside. So flesh and bone and liquid, just like a human body. Which means a man-sized roc's egg should weigh roughly the same as a man-sized human.
Therefore, anybody who can lift and carry a man should be able to lift and carry a roc's egg, but it would be harder to drape the egg over your shoulder in a traditional fireman's carry position, so it might weigh the same but be considerably more awkward.
I think the real problem is safe transport. If that egg even cracks, it will probably never hatch. Bouncing it along in a wagon might not be good for it. Rolling it along on the ground would never work. Actually carrying it in your arms might be safest, but every time you put it down to rest, eat, fight, or whatever, you have to worry about cracking it. I can't think of any rules to cover such a thing, but I might make some up on the spot to turn the adventure into an ongoing challenge.
Then, for fun, I'd have them encounter a nest of egg-eating oviraptors on their way back to town...

Arlandor |

The best way to transport it would be for them to use the 1st level sor/wiz spell floating disk.
at caster level 4, that is a max load of 400 lbs and it lasts for 4 hours. plenty of weight allowance for the egg with padding and insulation to keep it warm. plus there should be no worries about the egg being jostled over rough terrain.
the only major worry would be if the terrain was really steep, which I imagine is likely being its a roc nest probably high up a mountain. in that case I would likely try to use 2nd level sor/wiz spell levitate. where needed.
but the 4 minute duration could lead to problems depending on the distance needed to travel up or down.

Orfamay Quest |

In Whispering Nickel Idols, Garret (the private investigator) carries a roc egg in his pocket. One was even used as a sling stone.
While that's not exactly Pathfinder cannon (which says the eggs are man-sized), it made for a fun story.
I don't think an egg weighs any more than a creature of flesh and bone. After all, it's basically a bit of calcium (same as bone) surrounding some liquid and a little flesh and bone inside. So flesh and bone and liquid, just like a human body. Which means a man-sized roc's egg should weigh roughly the same as a man-sized human.
And a pony-sized egg would weigh roughly the same as a pony, which is about 300 kg, or 700 pounds. Remember that ponies are also, in Pathfinder terms, "man-sized" (Medium).

DM_Blake |

No, ponies are not "man-sized".
Nothing in the description says the roc's egg is "medium", which would let each GM decide on a wide band of sizes within the bounds of medium.
In fact, the description says "man-sized". Assuming that "man-sized" means "pony-sized" because they both happen to be Medium is a huge non-sequitur, just like assuming that "man-sized" means "Storm Giant-sized" because they're both humanoids.
So no, the roc's egg is "man-sized".
Now, it's true, there are a few men who actually do weigh 700 pounds. Those are fairly rare. There are some men who weigh 75 pounds. Those are fairly rare too. I would assume that "man-sized" probably means "average man-sized" but I suppose there is nothing explicitly stating that.
Still, when someone says "man-sized", nobody ever thinks of Verne Troyer or Andre the Giant. They probably think of average, which is also probably what the author meant.

LordBiBo |
I personally would think that the egg shell of a roc would actually be pretty tough. If it were as delicate as a normal egg, it would crack open under its own weight so I imagine it being roughly the thickness, toughness and weight of pottery. Heck, it might actually be as tough as "rock" which might be a reason for its name. Obviously with a hardness of 8 for stone, the little guy would never be able to get out. Pottery isn't listed in item hardness, but a hardness of 3-5 and like 10-15 hp might be reasonable. With its 1d6 bite attack, it could eventually peck its way out of there and having such a tough egg would help explain why the critter is combat ready as soon as it gets out of its egg (it has to be to get out). Real chicks usually take a few pecks to get out of their eggs anyway, so it makes sense. Also would be a simple enough mechanic to see when the egg hatches if, for example, one of the party members was dropped into a nest of eggs to feed the new babies right when they were about to hatch...
My google foo has found nothing on how much such a a giant clay pot should weigh, but experience with larger plant pots makes them pretty darned heavy. 10-20 lbs is a guess (but I have never weighed one to be sure, so I could be wrong). Plus a big ole bird. And yes, while men range in size, I would think that a creature that will soon become large size would be on the larger side of the spectrum, which is why I say the egg should be up around 200-300 lbs.

Cevah |

My question is just how big and heavy would this thing be and what would it take to move it? It is born a medium size creature, so I am imagining an egg large enough to contain a human. Assuming they are curled up in that egg a bit, I am guessing it should be something like 3 or 4 feet tall and maybe 200-300 lbs? Does that sound about right?
Look up contortionist. People take up about 2 cubic feet of volume*, so can fit in amazingly small suitcases.
Another safe passage method is the old bag of holding. Just take a break every 5 minutes to open it on the way back down from the mountain. When at the bottom, leave the bag open on the back of the wagon.
/cevah
Edit: *People float just a little about the surface of water, so they displace about the same weight of water. Two cubic feet of water weighs about 130#.

LordBiBo |
You sure? I an not sure I draw the line there because it is kind of like touching its clothing. If you were to poke a bird with a stick, that would cause the spell to break. If the bird were wearing plate mail and you touched the plate mail that would also cause the spell to break. Touching a bird surrounded tightly by an egg doesn't sound that different.

Pizza Lord |
I would not consider the egg to be part of the baby roc. Unlike clothing or armor or shields, the baby roc is not really the 'owner' or possessor or the egg. It can't move around while within the egg or move the egg around substantially.
It's not like it's wearing Egg-Carapace Platemail, even with a speed reduction. It's physically inside, just like a normal character wearing plate-mail and sealed inside a barrel. They can maybe rock the barrel, even roll the barrel, but you can't shocking grasp them by touching the barrel (a metal barrel maybe being a rules call). A character could cut open the egg or hit it without counting as attacking a creature (unless the attack were really violent or intended to injure the creature inside, like pushing it off a cliff.)
My plan to get the egg (obviously not knowing the geographical layout or nest specifics) probably have the strongest character secure a net around the egg and leap off while the caster uses feather fall to allow a safe landing. Assuming the egg is within the character's carry weight, you should be fine, but even so, the caster can also target the egg itself with the casting as added insurance. I wouldn't send the egg down alone, since I'd probably rule it would take half falling damage based on its weight (though not height fallen) as if it had dropped on someone (per feather fall rules, and even without damage I might rule too much rotation and movement might 'scramble' the baby chick.
As for moving it someplace safe after that, levitate has been suggested or floating disk. Those are good choices, but assuming the trail is too steep for a cart or something, probably a sling (net) supported by two long poles on the shoulders of two stout characters could get the egg down a hill or through some woods with only a bit of swaying back and forth.
Having hide from animals helps immensely. I would not allow it to disguise the baby roc just because a character under the spell's effect were carrying it. Assume you picked up a smelly sailor zipped up in a sleeping bag or in a box. Just because you have a spell that conceals your scent or makes you imperceptible to something doesn't mean that the other creature gets it automatically, so assume that even with hide from animals you will need some way to keep the baby roc's parents from tracking you down.