nope grond I disagree
I suggest rolling out in the open if there are trust issues or communication troubles in your groupif you are looking to fudge in favor of your pcs, just do not mention the DC or AC in question
natural 20's happen
that being said a player will then curse the dice gods rather than suspect their GM is manufacturing luck
and like Jack of Dust said
if you feel like bad crits or just plain bad luck has your group feeling snakebit, then implementing a mitigating ruleset like hero points or the PFS 'folio reroll' is a good fit
Different strokes for different folks. My groups see the games as stories where the players are the characters and the GM sets up the story. As needed at times the GM can makes things easier or harder to make it more fun for all involved. Having dice rolls behind the screen helps make that happen.
Killing characters or ACs is not too harsh. It's a game. In most games there are winners and there are losers. Death of a PC makes that PC a loser, at least, the PC lost that fight.
Superman loses fights, Batman loses fights, James Bond loses fights (almost all the time, actually - I think he loses way more than he wins), etc. So there is no reason PCs can't lose fights from time to time, even if it means death with/without resurrection.
Me, I don't like to randomly kill them with orc #137, but don't mind it nearly as much when:
1. It's a boss or otherwise super-hard fight or
2. The players bad choices put them in a spot where a PC dies
I also feel exactly the same way when I'm a player.
Case in point, I'm in a Dungeon World game with a session tonight. My paladin in that game is 5th level now. We've had about a dozen fights, including attacking a ship full of pirates with only me and a PC cleric (it was two against a hundred, give or take). I started the game with something like 22 HP at first level. In all our dozen or so fights, I've never lost more than 3 HP, total, in any one fight. In other words, I've never even lost 20% of my total HP and never ever had to be healed, even after-fight healing.
How do I feel about that? Bored. Considering quitting the game. Not ONLY for that reason, but it's a part of it. There is no danger, no challenge, no game. All we really do is some story telling (and even that is the same formula where we describe what we're doing, then the GM creates an obstacle, we describe how we get over it - no dice needed - and then the GM describes our success). I love roleplaying, I love RPG story time, but when the story is never challenging and the combat is never challenging, then it's just like I'm reading a book that I'm co-authoring. No challenge, no game, and it's getting boring.
That doesn't mean PCs MUST die to make the game challenging, but the players need to know that they can, and possibly even sometimes will, especially if the PCs or the players are careless or take on fights that are too difficult to safely win. And even the "safe" fights can sometimes be risky when the dice get involved.
A lot of Debating and hurt feelings going on for a simple No answer to the question posed in the thread title.
I stand by my overall belief that the players individually made dumb decisions. I'll give them that the party being split wasn't by their choice (I posted my initial response before the player had posted anything), but everything else, well, I'm sorry. The players made dumb decisions.
They're not alone in doing that. Even the best groups, from time to time, drink in a big dose of stupid and some character or pet ends up dead. Combine bad decisions with unfortunately timed dice rolls, and this stuff happens.
The key, at least in my view, probably wasn't even the grippli character attempting peace. It was still a dumb idea, even in character, but far less egregious than the dwarven warpriest deciding to run away and leaving the grippli and roc to fend for themselves. This DM has the animal companions roll their own initiatives, and therefore the roc didn't even have a chance due to going last. It happens. But...if the dwarf hadn't of ran away...if the dwarven warpriest had done something to change the situation, then it's possible that nobody would have been killed. The dwarf might have been shredded, but probably would have still survived.
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Well, there's a couple things I would note about the situation. First is that a skeletal megaraptor is an incredibly dangerous CR 2 fight. It's defenses are severely lowered versus the CR 5 megaraptor, but little of it's offense has, especially if you forgot to remove pounce. Having one of the player's or animal companion die to the creature wouldn't be surprising, a full attack should have no problem dropping a character at full health with a little better than average attack rolls, and average damage. This is basically rocket tag well before it usually appears in the game.
Second thing is that animal companions die to lucky rolls all the time. Level 4 seems about right for this to be the first time it happens. And Rocs are especially bad for this, with their con penalty, and special movement type, it's pretty important to make sure they're out of range of attacks if at all possible. The plus side though, is that unlike a familiar or a PC, you can acquire a new companion for free. It's an inconvenience, but that's about it. And if you have a special bond with this particular companion, well, there's a spell to bring it back from the dead, and it's much cheaper than raising a PC.
I honestly wouldn't even be upset about this, it's just something that will happen during combat. Now, a few months ago, while playing my druid, our party was emergency teleported to an area where, upon arrival we were all obscured, unable to tell who was who, with an ambush in waiting. Everything played out by writing actions down with appropriate dice rolls and handing them to the GM. Our fighter thought the best thing to do would be go to town on the nearest creature, despite the fact that it isn't fighting back. Couple rounds pass, we subdue the attackers and figure out a way to see who everybody is. Sure enough first thing I see is my dead tiger on the floor. Now that's a situation to be frustrated about. Considering that the player wasn't under any charm or compulsion, deciding that the best course of action would be to attack and kill the nearest creature, who may have been, and indeed was an ally, while the creature refused to attack back, and non-lethal damage was an option.
Bad things are going to happen, and it's the GMs job to throw challenges at the players, some of which might kill characters. It's when you or your fellow teammates screw things up for yourselves that it really stings though.
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to be honest i dont see point in killing PC's . What's fun about killing a PC that player spend a lot of time and effort to create it ? especially with very good backstory
That's a lot like saying:
I don't see the point in having some athletes lose at the Olympics? What's the fun in telling an athlete they lost when that athlete spent a lot of time and effort becoming a Olympic athlete. Especially if they have an interesting biography?
Should the olympics let every athlete get a medal? Should they give special consideration to athletes who came from underprivileged families or regions? Should athletes who have interesting biographies get better medals than athletes with boring stories? Should any of this matter?
No.
Why should any of it matter in the game?
"Because it's not fun" is, in fact, an excellent answer. If players agree that losing a character is no fun, even to the point that playing a Care-Bear game where nobody ever dies and everybody always wins, all the time, is the only fun way to play, then by all means play that way.
The Olympic committee disagrees. Every single athlete who competes there also disagrees. Well, I haven't interviewed all of them, obviously, but I'm willing to be money that no Olympic-caliber athlete wants to be given a "special" medal for coming in last just because his dad left their family when he was 6 years old or some such. I'm also willing to bet that even the athletes who get NO medal agree that winning should be earned and defeat is the motivator to do better next time.
Which isn't to say you must play by the IOC's rules. I'm just trying to answer your question. What's the fun in killing a PC? That player, and the rest of the players, are given a stark reminder that games have challenges. Challenges MUST include a risk of failure to be challenging. Failure implies consequences. Being unconscious is not a risk at all. Being dead is.
As a player, I PREFER it that way. So do the people I game with.
While it isn't "fun" to kill a PC, it is much more "fun" for my group to know that the game is challenging and to know that they EARN their victories.
I honestly stopped reading after learning that the party split.
Splitting the party is one of those gaming lessons that almost always has lethal results.
Killing characters is not unfair. Whether or not it was an intelligent undead creature is really irrelevant - if it had been a human barbarian, it could have just as easily launched itself unexpectedly at the character. If it had been an intelligent foe using stealth, it could have scored an easy kill.
Everyone has different expectations, I suppose, but characters have stats for a reason, and sometimes the dice don't fall in your favor.
Learn from it as a player and get better.