Ascetic Style + Urumi for crit-fishing 2h Unchained Monk

[Gisher]

Valder wrote:

Gisher wrote:

lemeres wrote:

Gisher wrote:

Temple sword isn't on the lists from the CRB, UC, UE, or the blog. So maybe Humans of Golarion just had it labeled incorrectly.

It would obviously not be in CRB- temple swords didn't exist then- they were an addition because...y'know. "Darn, we didn't give core monks good weapons". It is up there with the cestus. Not sure of teh publication dates for the rest though

I would imagine its exclusion is a more likely mistake than its inclusion. It was a random add on- making it VERY easy to forget to add in the various additions to the weapons lists to fighter groups.

And really- one of the monk's few good weapons are NOT included in the monk group? I can write off axe knuckles, but temple swords?

I didn't know the history behind the temple sword. Actually I didn't even notice it existed before these Ascetic Style discussions started. I feel sorry for Monks if that is one of their best weapons.

Isn't the iconic Monk usually shown wielding a Temple Sword? If it isn't a Monk weapon that would seem weird.

The iconic monk for me are the Shaolin monks swinging staffs around. There is also some bias there because I do swing a staff around myself. It makes me sad that the quarterstaff/bo staff are such sub-optimal choices. I would love a viable bo staff build, and to be honest that was my initial intention when looking over Ascetic Style.

I was talking about Sajan the Iconic Character who represents the Monk class.

[Valder]

lemeres wrote:

Valder wrote:

In any case, even if Temple Sword is included the Sansetsukon might be the better choice. 1d10 19-20/2 vs Temple Sword's 1d8 19-20/2, so better damage in the early levels. Both weigh the same and the Sansetsukon is even 22gp cheaper!

We should to comb through the list to see if there's a weapon with the 'monk' special property (UnMonk gets proficiency) and 18-20/2 crit range.

EDIT: Spelling.

I'll admit, I was inclined myself to sugest that weapon, but I felt that getting something 'keen'able would be preferrable.

I wouldn't go out of my way to get high crit weapons via feats adn such, but just a +1 property? Sure.

It occurs to me that if we took Improved Critical (unarmed strike) it would, through Ascetic Style, apply to all monk weapons.

[Valder]

Would the combination of Weapon Focus (urumi) + Ascetic Style + Weapon Finesse allow a monk to finesse an urumi?

[Imbicatus]

No. an Urumi is not a finessable weapon and being able to apply feats that apply to unarmed strikes wouldn't change that. However, you could finesse one by taking Fighter's Finesse advanced weapon training. You would need to be a Sohei to take it as a monk though.

[Valder]

Imbicatus wrote:

No. an Urumi is not a finessable weapon and being able to apply feats that apply to unarmed strikes wouldn't change that. However, you could finesse one by taking Fighter's Finesse advanced weapon training. You would need to be a Sohei to take it as a monk though.

I'm more looking at the section of Ascetic Style that says "as well as effects that augment an unarmed strike, as if attacks with the weapon were unarmed attacks." My interpretation is that we are not finessing the 1h weapon, we are finessing a weapon that is being treated if it were an unarmed strike.

Still, it hinges on whether changing from str-to-hit to dex-to-hit is considered an effect that augments unarmed strike.

[Protoman]

Valder wrote:

Imbicatus wrote:

No. an Urumi is not a finessable weapon and being able to apply feats that apply to unarmed strikes wouldn't change that. However, you could finesse one by taking Fighter's Finesse advanced weapon training. You would need to be a Sohei to take it as a monk though.

I'm more looking at the section of Ascetic Style that says "as well as effects that augment an unarmed strike, as if attacks with the weapon were unarmed attacks." My interpretation is that we are not finessing the 1h weapon, we are finessing a weapon that is being treated if it were an unarmed strike.

It'd be treating it as an unarmed strike that is not a light weapon and benefiting from 1.5 x Str mod.

[Imbicatus]

Okay. So when you use Ascetic Style on a Sansetsukon, does it only do 1x STR bonus and 1:2 power attack? No. It's still a two-handed weapon, even though you can use unarmed strike feats with it.

Weapon Finesse is a function of the weapon being light, or a specific quality of that weapon. Ascetic Style does not override that.

[Valder]

Ok, thanks for the clarification.