Double Hackbut mitigation


Rules Questions


Anyone know of any rules that allow a Double Hackbut to be set up faster than the normal 1 Full Round action to set up it's carriage? Or for that matter are there any items one can take that establish a small wall in which a Culverin can be mounted to avoid the -4 penalty and knockdown? I would prefer to use the Double Hackbut(refluffed as a small double barrel cannon) but that 1st round taking a full action to set up can be potentially fatal. Any suggestions?


Pathfinder Maps Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Mount the double hackbut on the forward hardpoint of your dragon's saddle. Or, better yet, make that a quad hackbut repeater mount. <g>


don't use a carriage and shoot from prone


I think one of the most common suggestions to this kind of thing is to attach the cannon to an immovable rod.


Does that Immovable Rod work per RAW with the Double Hackbut? I can see it working with the Culverin but per RAW, the Hackbut specifically says if fired without setting up the "carriage" then the penalty/prone issue comes in. Even firing from Prone would still incur the -4 penalty to firing. That being said, if the Immovable Rod method works with the Double Hackbut, I might have just fallen in love with that idea, I definitely do not mind shelling out an extra 5,000 gold to fit my character concept.


Well, you are definitely in houserule territory, since the interaction between immovable rod and bigger firearms isn't described anywhere in RAW.
I as a GM would allow you to build a swivel mount that is attached to the immovable rod instead of a carriage. Maybe I would request a knowledge (engineering) check or have you pay some extra gold for a specialist who does it for you. 5000 and the skill investment in engineering are a good price to pay for saving that one standard action.

Especially since, if you go only by RAW (which I strongly discourage), nothig says you can't just assemble the carriage once and never disassemble it, lest you run into some stairs.

Common sense of course dictates that you can not drive that thing though Sand or underbrush without being slowed significantly, but since the description of the weapon doesn't mention anything about movement speed penalties or being impossible to use in difficult terrain, TECHNICALLY there is nothing that says you have to take that full round action in the first round of combat.

So I would say the immovable rod is a solution everybody should be able to live with.


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Four levels in monk of the sacred mountain to gain Bastion Stance (cannot be knocked prone as long as they start and end their turn in the same spot). Wear a gunman's duster (not armor, so monk abilities unaffected) and carry both a culverin and a double hackbut in an endless bandolier...

I'd say an immovable rod would count as "support" for firing a culverin, but would not take the place of a carriage for a double hackbut (and there is no provision for firing a double hackbut on other supports, RAW, only while mounted/attached; "you must fire the double hackbut while it is mounted, or else firing it imparts a –4 penalty on attack rolls and the recoil knocks you prone").


Culverin it is then... hmmm... are there any ways to extend the range on the culverin to something a little better than 30ft? I'd prefer to keep away from enemies with this character but if I have no other good options I'm okay with the 30ft range. The character I'm planning on making is a Goblin Monk(because immunity to prone is delicious)4/Gunslinger 5/Rogue(sniper) X.


I'd still ask your GM about a houserule for the hackbutt, but culverin is good too.
An option regarding the range is the farreaching sight. Using it limits you to one shot per round, but since you are targeting touch AC, you can start sniping away at your enemies from quite a distance.


TheOddGoblin wrote:
Does that Immovable Rod work per RAW with the Double Hackbut? I can see it working with the Culverin but per RAW, the Hackbut specifically says if fired without setting up the "carriage" then the penalty/prone issue comes in. Even firing from Prone would still incur the -4 penalty to firing.

So? you shoot against touch ac who cares


The idea of running around shooting a gun which knocks you prone seems pretty amusing to me, especially if it were a Small goblin firing a Medium sized weapon (there's a feat which removes that size penalty)


I like the idea of a little Goblin carrying a massive cannon of a firearm and blasting people with it. I might forgo the Monk levels and give him Gunslinger(Musket Master?) 5/Rogue(Sniper) 4/ Alchemist X for a sort of mad bomber cannon wielding demolition specialist type of character.


Occurs that shrink item may come in handy here

Get a wand of it, setup double hackbut with carriage, shrink, pocket.

Get attacked, whip out tiny hackbut, resize, fire, kill stuff with extreme prejudice, rinse, repeat


Even better, Gunslinger(Musket Master) 5/Wizard(Spellslinger). Shenanigans shall commence, I'm gonna start building him now. The lower BAB will suck a little but Touch AC and making/enchanting my own guns will make up for it. I completely forgot about the Spellslinger.

Sovereign Court

By RAW you can stuff it in an endless bandolier (it's a two-handed firearm) and as you pull it of its extradimensional bandolier slot (it has two of those for two-handed firearms), it unfolds, carriage and all, megatron-style... ;)

The endless bandolier states "The wearer can draw an item stored in the bandolier as easily as if from an ordinary ammunition pouch or holster."


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Floating Disk is awesome for the double hackbut. It works for the culverin to. Cast your floating disk, cast wall of stone if you want to base it. Now it goes where you do.


Good call Rogar, ahh floating disk, so many uses for such a simple little spell (we have used is to seal a pit track spell, as arrow cover for halflings, as they fit underneath, and more)

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