[PFS] Blunt Arrows...

[Wei Ji the Learner]

...according to the book write-up, they 'can' be used to deal non-lethal damage at a -4 penalty.

Over the past weekend at a PFS event, I had a GM tell me that they could *ONLY* be used for non-lethal, and they couldn't be used to do lethal damage.

It wasn't scenario-critical, but it did get me to wondering, what is the official PFS ruling on this item?

I found one thread dating back to 2013 that was regular Pathfinder/home campaign/rules, but didn't see a post on PFS play.

Thank you very much for your time in advance!

[Black Powder Chocobo]

They can deal lethal damage. If blunt arrows only dealt nonlethal damage, it would have it stated in the profile, like the sap does.

CRB quipment chart

EDIT: Looking at the PRD text for blunt arrows, it says that it's the same -4 penalty to have a lethal weapon deal nonlethal damage. That would then mean that blunt arrows typically do lethal damage, else why the penalty.

Blunt arrows equipment page

There isn't a need for a PFS ruling on it because your GM was incorrect.

[Wei Ji the Learner]

David Higaki wrote:

They can deal lethal damage. If blunt arrows only dealt nonlethal damage, it would have it stated in the profile, like the sap does.

There isn't a need for a PFS ruling on it because your GM was incorrect.

Thank you for the prompt response!

[Eric Clingenpeel]

Yep, David is spot on. Blunt arrows simply deal bludgeoning damage normally. Their bonus is the ability to take the -4 to deal nonlethal.

[The Fox]

Also, it should be noted that, for the most part, PFS rules are exactly the same as the general Pathfinder rules.

We don't need a PFS-specific ruling on every single situation. Or put another way, the PFS-specific ruling is precisely the general Pathfinder ruling unless otherwise noted. If you fail to find a PFS-specific thread discussing an issue, it is because it works exactly as in the general rules.

[FLite]

If they *did* do only non lethal, they would typically not have the -4 penalty.

[Imbicatus]

Note that per the rules, it would normally be impossible to do non-lethal damage on a blunt arrow if it didn't have the line allowing it, as you can normally only do non-lethal damage at a -4 penalty on a melee attack.

[Ryzoken]

Repeat after me, cats and kids: can does not equal must.

[kinevon]

Note: It is entirely possible your GM was not referring to the blunt arrows from the APG, but the blunt arrows from one of the earlier entry level modules, Crypt of the Everflame.

The blunt arrows in that module are non-lethal in their write-up, so it may simply be that your GM did not know of the APG blunt arrows, and has only seen the ones from the Crypt.

Crypt Blunt Arrow Text:

The horses and ponies were obviously laden with gear and supplies, but most of that was already moved inside by the townsfolk (though the empty saddlebags remain). A DC 10 Perception check while searching the packs uncovers one that is still full. Inside are 2 days’ worth of rations, a pair of large, comfortable pillows, a quiver with 10 blunt arrows (as normal arrows, but they only deal nonlethal damage), and 2 pints of lamp oil.

[Mauler167]

Always pack some blunt arrows for those low level skeleton encounters.